Have I failed financially? What is the norm?

I think its very tricky for both mums and kids to work out 'adult treating'. Very often there is a honeymoon time when getting a first job and thinking "mine, all mine, to spend on whatever I want!"
Shopping trips, trying on outfits, perusing make up ect whilst poor mum looks on and works out what the parking, coffees and lunch out has done to her housekeeping budget for the coming week!
I know you want them to enjoy life but part of that lesson is the ability take responsibility for their own financial impact. It really is the most useful skill and shouldn't be shied away from due to parents feeling guilty/uncomfortable teaching it.
Hold your head high OP, you are doing a hard job on your own, its tough and you should feel pride in managing, let your kids know and give the a chance to be proud of you & themselves too x

If your children don’t understand or aren’t willing to understand why it might not be feasible for you to pay for everything they’re sounding a bit entitled.

Y they appreciate that you’re a one income family?! I wouldn’t expect my mum to pay for me to go out to dinner and actively wouldn’t accept it if she tried to pay.

how old are they?

When you meet up with the older child(ren?) are the younger child(ren?) normally there too? I can see that that makes the dynamic harder as obviously you need to pay for the younger ones but you're then in the situation that you're paying for some but not all of your children. I can see why it's awkward to ask them to pay for their own ice cream if you're buying all the others (it would be awkward if it was just a friend, really, to pay for the whole group except one even though it's obvious that you have financial responsibility for all but that one).

Lots of people are in a similar financial position to the OP, many doing essential jobs that society really needs. I work for a charity, partner does similar. We earn over the threshold for benefits (aside from child benefit) but we've no scope to save anything for our DCs future. The summer holiday childcare expenses and days out (even a trip to the seaside can add up) are something we need to save for from the previous September. The lives portrayed on MN where DP earns £160k and the OP 'only' earns £90k and feels poor, really don't reflect the lives of anyone we work with.

How many kids do you have OP? We always pay for ours but there are only two of them! They often offer to pay, but we don’t let them as we have much more money than they do. But if you’ve got a big family it must all add up. if you can’t afford it, you can’t afford it.

I'm in my 40s and my mum pays for stuff when we're out BUT she can afford to without going without and I will always sneakily pay from time to time and for other stuff and spoil her on special occasions to pay it back, and I am always very grateful and thank her for paying.

Honestly, next time lunch plans out come up I'd say something along the lines of, that would be lovely, I'm looking forward to seeing you, but I'm afraid things are tight and I'll only be able to pay for myself. Or we could have a picnic instead?

Some people never seem to catch a break in life and so far you seem to be one of these ( like my parents who always worked hard for very little). I never had a cup of tea or coffee in a cafe with my mum - we had a kettle a home after all! I didn’t go in a restaurant until I was a student.
I hope your circumstances get better but in the meantime don’t keep paying out for stuff you can’t afford - explain that you have very little left after all your outgoings (start to cry if this will ram the information into them) then do things with them that don’t cost much….walks/windowshopping/make a meal for them.

There are more people in your situation in this country than those you describe.
They may be represented on mumsnet but not on the threads you mention.
Getting a mortgage and paying it is nowt to be sniffed at.

You have raised a good son. You should be proud about that irrespective of finances.

Could you not have said that you were going up to the bar to order yours? What happened about the other people who were there to witness - surely they ordered separately, so there was already a situation where there wasn't one order for the whole table?

I’m most shocked that it’s your own kids that you speak of. Kids that you raised through hard circumstances it seems. How have they never learnt to want to treat you or have that nurturing feeling of taking care of you as a mum. I guess culture really does play An important part of your upbringing.

I also grew up with a single mother due to df passing away tragically. Times were very, very hard. Dm put everything into making sure we were educated. And then culturally we all come together as a family. Everyone helped out in a tiny way if they could. Today I can’t ever accept a penny from my dm, between siblings and I we will never see her pay for a thing herself.

I really can’t believe and it’s very sad that these are your own kids you speak of. My ds is only 10 and for both our birthdays this year he has spent his own saved up money to get us something so genuinely thoughtful. Sorry op, your kids should not be letting you get the bill or trying to make your life easier if they possibly can.

This is an interesting topic op

My parents did v well in business when i was a teen / early 20s & they always paid for me & my sibling

Now they're old & we live far from each other & me & my dh mostly pay for meals etc when we meet up.

We have a young adult in university & we pay for everything still

I had not really given this much thought but sort of thought that when they get a job & are earning to support themselves then it might change a bit

Do your adult children work?

Your children are tone-deaf if they expect things from you.

On Saturday I am taking out 8 of my family for lunch. This is the second time - in my life and I am well over fifty that I have hosted and paid for so many. Honestly I have 50% off after doing the owned a favour so it’s still a bargain. They will think themselves treated as I would never buy a round of ice creams in a park. No one would even ask - awful ice cream and well over priced. I would buy supermarket packs and keep them in the freezer and that would be a treat. We do picnics and big shared lunches at home and evening get togethers with games or a video. I am very clear that there is only my income so we can’t pretend we are unlimited spenders.

I told my kids early on that the consumerist buy buy buy insta friendly approach was a big con and have been clear if they want to spend money on pricey clothes or cafes they can crack on! I am generous with my love and my time and my hosting and baking and they are lucky to have me.

These days I actually could spend more and their isn’t a day where I don’t appreciate not having to monitor the basics quite so tightly but I can see the habits of conscious spending helped my kids develop habits that liberate them from consumerist noise and help them save. So I would say stop being apologetic - you are the queen that has run the show and funded their lives and they need to respect that and not treat you like the magic wallet. You aren’t a fucking resource - you are a treasure! And if you find any extra savings at any point put them into your pension.

Well from your username I’m guessing you are 39? You have adult children and also a young disabled son?

are you a single parent?

so it sounds like a lot of your life has been taken up with childbearing, and it sounds like the ages are quite spread out.

raising kids is an expensive time and it sounds like you’ve had many years of that. Particularly if you’ve been a lone parent working part time.

So you will have a lower income, high outgoings, and slower career progression.

Cost of living is also a huge factor.

There are a huge number of variables. But you say it don’t go without, and haven’t mentioned being in mountains of debt, so you are doing ok xx

Yes, I think we need to know how old your adult DCs are and whether they work.
I think you should sort this out by having a proper conversation with the DCs, explaining that now that they are adults [with their own salaries] it's time to re-think how things are paid for. I think the default should be that everyone pays for themselves. If you want to treat them, or they want to treat you, that can simply be offered in advance. That way there will be no misunderstandings. Obviously you wouldn't charge them if you invite them round to your home for a meal. It may be that you'll need to do that more.

This thread has inspired me to ask my DC who's at university what they think. They basically said they'd expect to pay for themselves once they leave university, but they mentioned a friend who's left university and lives independently and has a job, but who can't manage on her wage from that job, because only limited shifts are available. She sometimes asks her parents for money. Unfortunately the job market is terrible, and that does complicate things. However, DC did mention that that friend, despite her low earnings and asking her parents for money, does spend money on a rather expensive hobby. So there is an entitlement issue. I think some young people expect a high quality of life when they leave home, and need to come down to earth.

It wasn't awkward, although I did feel embarrassed for not having realised sooner! It's not a failure at all, and i do wonder if it might be a mumsnet thing, because IRL it's more normal to hear about adult children treating their parents to lunch/dinner.

I’d be mortified to do this. My mum expects me to pay most of the time!

Surely as the parent you can just say ‘I’ll go order mine and you can order yours, I can’t afford to pay for everyone’s’ or if it’s somewhere the bill comes you just pay your part. If they’re working it’s not unreasonable at all and you’re just indulging this

So who initiates going to these places? Surely someone must say let's have lunch? If it's you, then I can see why they think you are paying as you are suggesting it, but if it's them saying let's go here then you can put a stop to it by saying sorry no, moneys a bit tight.

Who are these other people who are observing this? Family?

This is an attitude thing. Our household income dropped when DD turned 18 (benefits and maintenance), i informed her of this when she turned 16. This meant that she would have to start paying for things that I previously covered. To ease her into it, at 17 she started paying for her phone, public transport and other subscriptions. At 18, she was paying for everything else except rent, food and shared holidays. New glasses she pays for them, bike maintenance, she pays for that too. She can make budgets and sets things money aside for contingencies. Granted, she now gets her maintenance paid direct from her father but the expectation about finances was set early on. I also insisted that she set up saving accounts and makes regular payments to them, the same goes for joining her employers pension scheme.

Just because some parents can afford x, y and z doesn’t mean I can, or should. DD went to secondary school with kids whose parents were considerably wealthier than us. We are a holiday every two or three years family and not a winter, summer and short break family. For me it’s an attitude thing. I do not feel guilty for not giving DD everything financially because I don’t think she would be best served by me doing so. My main job as a parent, is preparing her for the world, which means encouraging her to make good financial choices based upon personal circumstance.

Why do your adult children, expect you to pay for coffee/ lunch out? Maybe make it clear beforehand, that you don’t have a huge amount of spare cash and that if they want to go out, everyone needs to contribute?

My DD is a student and is home for a few weeks, working to earn money for rent for when she starts her masters in September. When we go out, we alternate paying or she uses student discounts etc. We recently went to a pizza place ( myself, DD and DP) Again, she used her student rewards and it brought our bill down significantly. We all
help each other. Ds is 18 and pays a bit of board. He’s saving for a house and works hard at his job which he found himself. Occasionally he will ask me to buy something nice, food wise, but mainly he’s self sufficient. Saved for his own car and paid own insurance and tax.

I have cancer and had to take ill health retirement. Money is tight for myself and DP, but we’ve arranged our finances and cut our cloth accordingly.

You haven’t failed OP. Life is hard for many and can take unexpected twists and turns. No adult child should just expect anything these days.

How much does your adult child earn? Do you have a general idea? Are they equally struggling?!

My grandparents were well off but from as far back as I can remember my parents always treated them and paid for their flights, food etc. Some times they all fought over the bill as everyone wanted to pay. I think that example was set in my head.

My grandparents have all passed on. My parents are very wealthy, I still try my best to treat them, buy them gifts they will like etc. If we go out for a meal we all try to get the bill or take turns. I would never sit back and assume they will pay.

Even though you don’t like the idea you have to have a frank discussion with them on what you can and cannot afford. They must pay their way and not be so entitled.

Going back to this post, it's well known the the MN demographic is disproportionately more affluent than the UK population as a whole. Comparing yourself with people on here over money is like going into Waitrose and asking the women with the nicest coats how much money they have. Don't do that to yourself.

But there is no norm. The range of circumstances is vast, from people who can't even cover the basics to those who can spend endlessly without worrying about running out of money. You just have to try and make the best of your own circumstances. And if you can't afford to pay for your whole family, especially adult DC who work and have their own money to eat out, don't feel like you have to do it and don't be afraid to say it's not in your budget. There's cheaper ways of treating them - make nice food at home for example.

You haven't failed and it sounds like you have some challenging circumstances so don't beat yourself up for not 'keeping up' with those who have had a more fortunate path through life.