AIBU to think PC Harper's killers being released early is awful?

It’s a bloody joke. It’s difficult to get to court, difficult to get a sentence. It costs a lot too. Rape as we all know is bloody difficult to get someone imprisoned. And then they were seriously just going to let them all back out again?? Thank goodness Andy Burnham has ruled sex offenders out of early release. But others still want them out.

It’s also notable that we are of course talking about the men’s prisons being full. There is a major problem and it all stems from men. But you know, it’s women that are being unreasonable always to dislike or distrust men, and women that are being unreasonable to not want to propagate the male human species. The men who dismiss crimes against women and want the men committing them released are demonstrating the misogyny that fills the human species. I completely agree with the pp who said we should be emptying women’s prisons first. That it should come to this though shows that law and order is on the verge of collapse.

That isn’t how the law works. Fortunately.

Well, it sort of is!

The law was changed, but not retroactively (retroactive change would offend the rule of law).

Although tbf, it changed the sentencing to be on par with murder, rather than turning manslaughter into murder, in these circumstances.

It's crazy isn't it. Pp saying sniffily how thick we are to not understand. I've seen people charged with murder who equally didn't have weeks of premeditation and planning but in the moment clearly intended to kill someone. Same as these 3.

So yes yes while we know they got manslaughter most with any braincells know the cps/jury/ system were very wrong and it should have been murder because whilst they may not initially intended to murder PC Harper once they'd dragged him a mile the intent was there!

I really struggle to understand the outcome of this case and why not murder. On the other hand I was not in that court room, I don’t have all of the facts to hand to make a full decision and I’m not the CPS person having to weigh everything and take a risk that they might walk free.

in the moment clearly intended

This is the key point. Clearly intended. Which could not be proven in the Harper case.

That is what you cannot seem to get into your head. "Oh of course they must have known" isn't evidence, no matter how much you wish it to be.

A murder conviction for these three was never possible in the circumstances. Manslaughter however very much so. Would you rather they walked free? Because if the court had gone for murder or nothing then that's where we'd be now.

'Manslaughter was very obviously the correct conviction here, given the sequence of events and the lack of provable intent or premeditation'

Yes we know it wasnt premeditated, there wasn't google searches on how to drag people to their death or anything. Well, not sure they use Google I believe they're illiterate.

They set out to steal but the phone call reporting the theft stated they had weapons so I think the cps could've surmised that they were indeed intending to kill anyone who got in their way and again if you drag someone a mile driving at high speeds they clearly intended to kill him then.

I hope the prosecution team have been on some refresher training courses since.

So why didn't you offer your services to the prosecution team? If you're so confident you could have secured a murder conviction then you've let PC Harper and his family down just as badly as the prosecution and the courts. How dare you keep that information from them.

Or, maybe, you're full of hot air and don't actually understand the law.

'Oh of course they must have known" isn't evidence, no matter how much you wish it to be''

It should have been evidence! Anyone who drives would say you can tell if you have a flat tyre nevermind dragging an adult behind you.

They'll be banged up again so the whole thing has been a waste of time and caused immense distress to PC Harper's family and friends when other options are available to free up spaces.

They've never shown any remorse. That in itself should cancel their pathetic get out of jail free card.

Prove they knew it was an adult.

Prove they knew it wasn't the quad bike, or a branch, or another piece of debris.

In the dark, in a car with no lights on, in a chaotic situation. Prove they knew beyond any reasonable doubt that it was a human they were pulling.

Prove it. Go on.

'Full of hor air'. How patronising. I'm furious that these killers are being patted on their heads and sent on their way as you should be too.

There are enough police/court documentaries for us all to know many people get murder when they hadn't set off that morning with an 'I'm going to murder someone today' idea in their heads but when circumstances change and they intend to then it is indeed murder.

It must be awful for ALL victims if an offender is on the list for early release so spare a thought for them too.

'A branch'. Fgs. A16 stone branch. Were you on the jury?!

So you admit you've let PC Harper and his family down just as badly then?

Good to know.

Maybe you can spearhead the retrial, since you know so much? No?

So you can't prove it then, and you are indeed full of hot air.

Thank you for confirming.

The two under consideration for early release were NOT driving the car! They were passengers. Hence the manslaughter conviction. Why do we find it so difficult to comprehend the difference?

Lynch mob mentality.

Haven't you heard of joint enterprise? They knew exactly what was going on.

You’re a mind reader now? Fortunately clairvoyance isn’t admissible in a court of law.

'Lynch mob mentality'
Yes it's horrific isn't it, feral criminals. None of the 3 have ever shown any remorse. You'd think that would count in this lovely get of jail free system wouldn't you?!

It's a chat forum, we aren't in a court of law. Like all the other threads on here we share opinion. Hope that helps.

I was actually responding to a pp who thought the other 2 were oblivious innocent passengers, they had no idea what was going on it was <checks notes> maybe a stick?

It is actually how the law works. Watch, I fought the law (Ann Ming mother of Julie). Abuse such as coercive control didn't fit in, so laws were changed and new ones made. The new Hillsborough law is another example. Hate speech was extended from a previous law. I've longed believed that passengers should bare responsibility about the cars they get in. We hold women responsible when their partner stashes drugs in the house.
There's enough men to release who are the perpetual shoplifters etc because of drugs. Those who committed fraud and similar non violent offences. Then we have the criminals from outside of the UK. We need residential rehab akin to prison. Deport the four thousand non citizens. Tbh, most women prisons could be emptied and put the men in there. It isn't fair that women are getting custodial sentences for a lot less than men, because men's prisons are full.

I wonder why it is impossible to build new prisons. They seem to be able to throw up whole hosing estates in less than three months.

In what world, does anyone with even the wit with of a portly hamster, see that prisons are becoming overcrowded and shout, " I know! Let's release the prisoners! Drinks all round!

Instead of shouting, " I know! Let's build more prisons!"

The manner of his death was horrific and the thought of his suffering must be a constant torment to his poor family.

And soon that will be the only type of justice that people will feel they can rely on as they watch grinning, champagne popping criminals who should still be in jail, slide and creep, leering, around their streets.

Badly thought through in more ways than one. Still, what do you expect from a pig but a grunt!