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To be shocked at teacher telling DD to 'hold in' period.

(728 Posts)
yaela123 Mon 11-Dec-17 18:41:59

DD is 15 and her school have a no going to the toilet during lesson time rule, which I completely agree with on the whole as I know how disruptive it can be if people are constantly in and out, and how everyone just uses it as an excuse to bunk off (I am a teacher too - very different environment though)

Only exception is if you have a medical note from a doctor.

Today in one of her lessons DD says she could feel that she really needed to change her pad, she was getting quite worried about it leaking. She eventually asked the (male) teacher if she could go to the loo.

Teacher: No, you know the rules
DD: I really need it.
Teacher: What did I just say?
DD: It's a girl problem...
Teacher: What do you mean?
DD: Umm... I'm on my period
Teacher: Break is only in half an hour, hold it in til then

Obviously those aren't the exact words said but she says it's pretty accurate.
DD is quite shy so did just wait til break (no leakage btw).

She doesn't seem overly bothered but AIBU to be pretty shocked at him telling her to hold it in? Surely even men have some basic idea that it doesn't work like that?

InternetHoopJumper Fri 15-Dec-17 18:49:23

No, Maisy I am just pissed off to see the attitudes that were used to make my life miserable in school still persists. I am not just angry at you, but other posters as well. But thanks for accusing me of not arguing in good faith and making light of my bad experiences.

InternetHoopJumper Fri 15-Dec-17 18:50:40

I also love how you, as a teacher, show maturity by punishing all students for the bad behavior of a few.

MaisyPops Fri 15-Dec-17 18:51:39

That's not what I've said!

Dear me. I swear this thread gets more abd more obtuse by the hour.

Allow me to spell it out.

Teachers know who in their class are thr ones who tend to time waste (toilet trips are just one strategy). We know which kids tend to fib and we know which kids can act up

We also know who the well behaved students are who don't waste time and just get on with their work.

There's always an element of professional judgement involved whrn the same child requests a toilet trip just as the extended piece of writing starts/the student who is out on the field all lunch arrives claiming they had no time at lunch to go etc.

A child who behaves, doesn't engage in a range of time wadting strategies, doesn't ask to leave often, who doesn't have their hall pass page full etc is probably not going to be time wasting.

You treat the 2 differently. That is professional discretion. (That's not to day i would blanket ban a habitual timewaster, but i do usr stalling strategies. Interestingly enough, once timewasters know you don't accept time wasting they stop time wasting and only ask when it's ptobably genuine because they have seen you be more than fair).

People on here who don't get that are being deliberately argumentative and goady.

MaisyPops Fri 15-Dec-17 18:56:15

InternetHoopJumper
Except I don't punish them.

You're obviously so wise and havr all the answers. You teach a lesson and let one after the other out every few mins and try and run a lesson. You try supporting your SEND kids without a TA but have to stop because yet again you've got the same few known characters deciding they mist go now (7 mins since lunch) because it's fine to miss class but not take a break from footy at lunch and so thry all need instructions giving again.

My school has a sensible policy.
Staff use discretion.
I apply a spot of common sense.
When staff stop exercising sensible discretion that is when schools go for blanket bans.
I don't want that to happen.

Contrary to the way some on here carry on, in my school the most respected and liked teachers are the ones who are firm and fair.

Mumof56 Fri 15-Dec-17 18:59:56

Teachers know who in their class are thr ones who tend to time waste (toilet trips are just one strategy). We know which kids tend to fib and we know which kids can act up

But my child wouldn't do any of the above wink

grin

perchi Fri 15-Dec-17 19:01:07

But if their hall pass page is full, that means they have genuine toilet needs/problems. So, if they don't fill it, they are a "good kid"? Bizarre!

InternetHoopJumper Fri 15-Dec-17 19:02:26

Yes, you have aknowledged that you allow students to go, during class. That's very generous of you.

But why is that always followed by a "BUT..."?
You successfully hijacked a threat that was not even about abusing bathroom privileges and, in my opinion, you have been rightfully called out for it.

You are making light of other people's experiences and use an extremely condescending tone in your posts. If that was not bad enough, you also have the nerve to accuse others of being goady. Don't you see the hypocrisy in your bahvior?

Mumof56 Fri 15-Dec-17 19:04:00

You successfully hijacked a threat that was not even about abusing bathroom privileges and, in my opinion, you have been rightfully called out for it

No worse than those who hijacked the thread to tell us about their flooding periods

InternetHoopJumper Fri 15-Dec-17 19:05:19

Periods is what this thread was about.

Landed Fri 15-Dec-17 19:10:11

I've had times when I've worried no end, been unable to concentrate for worry that I'm flooding or that I've started unexpectedly when I haven't. Periods are not an exact science for anyone. I wish that those posters arguing otherwise would stop being narrow minded, grow up and hopefully find that their own periods change for the worse so they can eat their own words! As for any teacher not showing understanding and giving benefit of the doubt in such a situation, well, words fail me.

AssassinatedBeauty Fri 15-Dec-17 19:13:53

Those explaining about how their periods affect them were not "hijacking" the thread.

greenhairymonster Fri 15-Dec-17 19:33:38

I just asked dd's teacher to call me to discuss shouting/screaming at dd in class - it will be an interesting chat - both my dcs are in the same class and they both describe her as a bully, I'll listen to her reasons and if they are not satisfactory I'll involve her Form teacher/Head of Year....but I'm guessing she will not admit to shouting. hmm

MaisyPops Fri 15-Dec-17 19:40:39

But if their hall pass page is full, that means they have genuine toilet needs/problems
Are you naive or being willingly obtuse?
Students with medical needs get toilet passes.
Students who tend to havr their hall pass full within a couple of weeks are the ones who go for wanders regularly / don't bother at break or lunch and instead know they can go in class instead.

It's not that 'not having it full makes someone a good kid' confused It's that good kids tend not to be time wasters so although their hall pass is used, there is a noticeable difference between students who are known for timewasting (in a range of ways) and those who don't. Y

internet
Hijacked in the sense that people were discussing school bathroom policies and I joined in a discussion (along with many others).
I wasn't aware that the discussion had two acceptable angles:
1. Talking at length about flooding and periods
2. Decide anything other than go on demand is horrifying and a form of bullying

Interestingly enough, there's been a range of teachers with different views on this thread and the almost universal response from teachers on this thread to thr OP has been 'it is worth speaking to the head of year about school policy and exploring a toilet pass if needed' (something also echoed by parents on here too).

Yet again, it is fast becoming another one of those famous mumsnet toilet posts where if you aren't of the view 'let anyone go any time' you'll get pounced on by people with infinite wisdom who (mainly) have zero experience of managing a classroom. Happens every time on threads like these. People stating perfectly reasonable things lose the will to live and stop replying and the people willfully trying to twist sensible points of view piss the remaining people off and then use teachers' frustation as proof for their silly little 'see i told you teachers were mean' stance.

MaisyPops Fri 15-Dec-17 19:46:37

greenhairymonster
You seem sensible.

I have a class who joke about the time I 'screamed' at someone. I didn't at all by the way. I used a firm, slightly louder tone than usual but it's so different from my usual positive and light tone that it has since become known as me 'screaming'. I did say to them that screaming is massively inaccurate but they said screaming sounds funnier. It's a good job it became a class joke and they didn't go home saying Mrs pops screamed. That would be a whole N thread. grin
I do think there's a difference between a firm, slightly louder tone and shouting at someone.

Though seriously, some teachers are needlessly shouty and are right to be challenged on it. The main thing is that you are contacting the teacher first, being reasonable etc.

greenhairymonster Fri 15-Dec-17 19:59:28

Maisy My dcs have had the same English teacher - she is firm and a tiny bit shouty - they like her, they think she is firm but fair and they would describe her as a very good teacher.
They don't like teachers who can't control the class - it's boring and frustrating and they have to do their own catching up at home. They really don't like kids messing around.
The teacher that left dd in tears today is, according to both dcs, constantly losing it with the class, they come home every week annoyed and upset by how she has behaved. Smashing the rolling pin on the desk in a silent manner - it scares the shit out of them!
So dd said the teacher said to her that is was ridiculous for dd to cry over cooking, but the teacher screamed at her over cooking - I know that teaching a practical subject must be hard but dd is a keen well behaved student - she made a mistake - the teacher seems to be behaving like Gordon Ramsey!

greenhairymonster Fri 15-Dec-17 20:02:21

Smashing the rolling pin on the desk in a silent manner -

I meant Smashing the rolling pin on the desk in a violent manner....Christmas lunch effects still wearing off! fblush

MaisyPops Fri 15-Dec-17 20:05:48

green
The teacher you are complaining about / raising concerns about sounds awful.

Firm and fair staff are respected. I think I'm similar to the first teacher you describe. If you shout too much it shows as little control as someone who has them ruining learning because the shouting ends up ruining learning.

If it helps, heads of department generally have a measure of their team so if it gets to the point where you need to go to the HOD then they'll probably be receptive (though usually quite diplomatic in their conversations).
I hope your situation resolves itself.

perchi Fri 15-Dec-17 21:22:57

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

perchi Fri 15-Dec-17 21:27:55

I agree with Internet that you use an extremely condescending tone. Unfortunately, you don't recognise this in yourself or how you sound, allowing only certain kids to use the toilet.

perchi Fri 15-Dec-17 21:45:55

I don't like the way you consider children whom don't need to use the loo are "good kids"? I don't understand how you can possibly know if a child's need is genuine, expecially if it's a period problem? And how do the refused kids feel when one or two others are allowed to go?

MaisyPops Fri 15-Dec-17 22:14:36

perchi
Umm.. try because I didn't and the students said i didn't and it's a joke! (This may seem surprising to you but we actually like our students and they like us and we have a laugh and get on with each other and enjoy each others company)

I don't only allow certain kids to use the toilet. I just exercise discretion when appropriate.

And i don't consider kids who don't go to the toilet 'good kids'. For thr millionth time you are attributing causality where there isn't one.
1. Time wasters tend to have their hall pass filled whereas non-time wasters tend not to
2. Students who try work avoidance techniques etc are more likely yo try and abuse going out of class than those who are well behaved
This isn't rocket science.

Of course I'm using a condescending tone! I'm getting exasperated trying to explain a very very very simple concept to people willingly trying to twist things or perhaps are just incapable of understanding.
There is a middle ground between a free for all and a blanket ban. I really don't see how a common sense approach can create such issues.

MaisyPops Fri 15-Dec-17 22:18:58

And you seem to the missing the central part of yesterday's thread which pissed me off was that another poster decided to go from a thread where we disagreed to another onr and instead of replying to the thread decided to start making digs about me and then got all ridiculous when i challenged them on it.

But that's by the by, school threads seem to go crazy at the best of times (mainly because there's a number of people who can't grasp common sense and professional judgement).

mathanxiety Sat 16-Dec-17 06:01:37

You are really good at splitting hairs, MaisyPops. I'll give you that.

You also do a great line in patronising and condescension.

It's almost as if you believe nobody posting has ever been to school themselves, or sent children to school for decades, and that parents are complete eejits.

MaisyPops Sat 16-Dec-17 06:41:56

I'm not splitting hairs by correcring people who make entirely false statements about my views (like maisy you think holding it in makes someone a good student hmm)

It's just correcting people when they do this doesn't go down well because it's much better on school threads for some posters to be willingly ridiculous, abandon all logic and then get snipey if anyone's to be changes as a result of them choosing to abandon any common sense.

If people have gone to school then they know fine well that toilet trips can be one of many time wasting and work avoidance strategies and they know that kids try it on. Thry will also know that some kids try it on more than others (and yet it seems saying is controversial here!)

Oh and then there's been statements about what I must be like as a teacher because obviously a joke with my students (who i like and they respect me) mustn't be a joke, I must think parents are idioys etc (I don't. But then thankfully most parents aren't idiots because they understand there is a middle ground rooted in common sense)

Yes, my tone has been patronising because here we are pages later with me still saying: There is a sensible middle ground between letting everyonr out as and when thry like and a blanket ban and people still finding this difficult to understand or they are just willingly being awkward.

TheMaddHugger Sat 16-Dec-17 07:09:23

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