Is anyone else an academic who has not produced enough research while having kids and is now in the s***?

[Kathyis6incheshigh]

There are lots of academics on MN, just wondering if there is anyone else in my position.

Am pg with 3rd dc in 5 years. Have had hyperemesis and other problems in all 3 pgs, which on top of 2 maternity leaves means heaps of time off work. In the meantime I have completely lost research momentum and produced sod all apart from a few book reviews. I was not submitted for RAE (though fortunately my dept did very well without me so none of my colleagues are holding it against me personally.)
Every time I come back it takes me all my time to get back up to speed with teaching and admin, get on top of all the changes in my field etc, and I only ever seem to make baby steps towards producing anything before I am sick or pregnant again.
Just had uncomfortable meeting with (supportive) HoD at which she broke news to me that I am about to get a scary letter from Personnel and a process is going to start which will probably include ritual disembowelling/change to a teaching only contract if I don't get something submitted before baby is due. Which would be fine as long as the foetus behaves and sickness holds off - am only just back at work after 2 months off with HG.

Serves me right for having children, doesn't it?

Thanks MagicGlassesFairy
I've been in touch with the union and they seem very sensible - will be talking again to the rep later this week.
Was chatting to a barrister friend yesterday - was very heartening. He thinks anyone who is trying to use pregnancy/pregnancy-related illness to help get rid of someone is likely to have bitten off more than they can chew.
I am getting my paperwork straight and there are a fair number of inconsistencies in what HoD says.
Of course I hope it won't come to lawyers....

Hope things get better Kathy.

How VERY interesting from the European RC. What a sane response to the problem. It will never happen in UK universities and RCs though, will it?

It's heartening to read about the European RC - I wish/hope the REF takes that on board.

If you don't mind me complaining/asking a question:
I've just got my payslip, and realised I haven't moved up from the top of lecturer A/grade 7 to lecturer B/grade 8. I was under the mistaken belief that it was essentially automatic, but it seems from looking at HR documents online that it isn't. I should have gone through the annual review process a year ago. I'm quite peeved at this. There's nothing in the annual review documentation about applying to move from grade 7 to 8, nor does it set out any criteria for promotion. (Yet, there's clearly set out criteria specifically for confirmation of appointment, promotion to senior lecturer and professor.) I remember colleagues moving straight up to lecturer B over the last few years without going through any of this. My fear is that I've actually been held back due to my poor research performance (well, it has been poor since I got pregnant with DD), but that may just be paranoia. Anyway - sorry for the waffling - I was just wondering whether this is typical of most pre-92 Universities? I don't want to bring this to anyone's attention at work if there's little/no chance of me moving up.

Hiya Dontrun.

I moved up a few years ago - it felt automatic to me as I didn't have to apply for it, but I do remember getting a letter from my then HoD saying he was recommending I should, and being congratulated afterwards.

I imagine it used to be genuinely automatic but they changed it in order to have another way of exerting power over staff and also another way to save money if they wanted to. I would imagine them not moving you up is more about saving money in your case as surely if this was about research performance it would make more sense for them to say 'Now listen Dontrun, you haven't moved up because your research isn't good enough so you if you want more money you'd better improve it young lady' (even though we know it's not as simple as that) rather than leaving you to notice it by yourself IYSWIM? I don't think you would lose anything by asking for an explanation, especially if you couch it in terms of 'What would I have to do to get promoted?'

I hope you enjoy your maternity leave Kathy and it doesn't get taken over in work disputes etc. how long are you taking off?

Thanks Fennel. I'm having 9 months off.
Not feeling very cheerful about the whole thing at the moment of course.
I'm just glad I didn't post on that thread about 'Who likes going to work every day because they love their job?'

g'day you lovely people

sorry I've missed so much of this thread stupid international timezones!

I am sad and horrified to hear of your fondness for Marian Keyes, Kathy. If ever anyone needed a good editor! Find yourself some Julia Quinn, she's heaps o' fun.

and your HoD doesn't sound too hot either . Sorry it's all so rubbish for you - hope things even out for your a bit now and you get to enjoy your last week. (and that the birth is a doddle )

I have made absolutely zero progress since last visiting the thread. (apart from turning 40.) dh has had his gallbladder op and gone straight from that to being away for two weeks. dd has now added two more night feeds to her schedule and ds is celebrating with "No!"'s to everything and floods of tears when I fail to understand his every fleeting desire . 'Tis all doing my brain in rather a lot bit.

Don't run
I may be talking rubbish here - but I think 7-8 is a progression rather than a promotion ie they have to prove why you can't move rather than you have to prove that you can.
This is based on the old scales though - but the equivalent move. The UCU (AUT as was) webpages will have useful info on this.

Only just noticed that this thread has a new lease of life, so I'm just checking in.

Am shocked at the attitude of your HoD, Kathy - good idea to start documenting now. Hopefully the union will help out. Hope the maternity leave is a little less stressful than your recent work - unless you've gone into labour by now, of course! Keep us posted on any developments.

I'm feeling relatively positive at the moment - had a week reading lots of journal papers and come up with a few ideas worth exploring (I found a couple of review articles that included sections on 'Research Opportunities' - great for idea generation!). No doubt the excitement will wear off once I realise that there's a very good reason no-one has done this yet (it's too hard!), but in the meantime it's quite refreshing to be enjoying work for a change - it's been quite a while since I've been able to say that.

Kathy - best wishes for your maternity leave & I hope you can leave University worries to one side for a while.

Thanks for the advice on moving up between grades. I learnt of a new development at my Uni this week, which is that academics are going to be sorted between teaching & research and teaching only. We've never had that type of official separation and I'm feeling worried. (I think they're following Stirling's example.) I'm going to check further, but according to my University a) I have to apply to move up from lecturer A to B (grade 7 to 8), and - assuming I'm successful - they could choose to put me into the teaching only 'box.' (Given the current state of my research, that seems very likely.) I go on maternity leave in 2 weeks. So what are the chance of me getting some publications out before I go back to work in a year?!?!

Hi all,

Have dipped into various points on this (long!) thread and found it very reassuring, so thank you! I've been in a lecturer post for a decade or so now, but started young, straight from professional job (not PhD route), and in a very teaching intensive department, so have always found it a bit of a struggle to find my niche research-wise. Suffice to say seem permanently stuck at the wrong side of the lecturer / senior lecturer divide!

And though had a couple of research grants and publications have now hit a bit of a few years long bare patch with unsuccessful grant apps, diversion into educational research (interesting, but not very promotion friendly), rejected or just stuck papers. So my CV has ground to a halt, my confidence is pretty low, and now... am expecting first child in Feb. Which is good news, we'd been trying a long while.

Planning to take off 8 months or so maternity, and am planning to come back PT, say, 3 days a week. But am a bit nervous about this. Most female lecturers with kids I know (and glancing through this thread can't find many exceptions) try to keep on FT. Those that are PT are far more likely to have research only, or teaching only positions.

I enjoy teaching and don't want to give it up, and I'm resigned that my research may continue to be at a bit of a standstill... but as long as I can keep it going in some form or other. Ideally I would like to go back to FT when kid(s) are back to school but no way to have guarantee of this so that's another risk. The prospect of Senior lectureship seems a complete pipe dream.

I just wondered if any of you have gone PT with a lecturer post which involves teaching, admin and research, or have friends who have? Any tips would be welcome.

Hi all,

Dontrun and comeonbishbosh - might be worth a look at the Boice book, Professors as writers, which a few people on this thread have found useful. He is very good on how to get writing done in limited time (e.g. dontrun, if you are trying to get a publication or two done while you are on ML) and also has some good strategies for tackling stuck or rejected projects.

Congrats on your pregnancy, bishbosh! Is there anyone in your university or outside who could act as a mentor - e.g. to discuss what you would need to do to get to SL, and talk about ways to keep your research on track if you go PT?

Unfortunately I don't have any direct experience of people going PT - it seems that most people here try to muddle through somehow until the children are in school. But obviously this would be very hard if your department is very teaching intensive.

my birth announcement here.

Fantastic news! Well done, Kathy, and welcome little 6incheshigh.

Dontrun - I will be trying to work on publications while on maternity leave as well.
From previous experience, I have tended to find you have a lot of reading time while feeding babies etc but writing time needs to take more careful planning. So if I haven't made much progress by Easter (will be going back in June) we will put ds2 in nursery one day a week from then to give me time to really get stuck in.
But it's so hard to predict - it really depends on the baby. If you have a good night-time sleeper your brain works better, but OTOH if you have one that naps during the day your brain may be woollier but you have more time to actually write.
Had a long talk to dh about the financial side of it and we reckon that we are prepared to soak up childcare costs as long as I am doing it for myself not for them. Which I am, because if I do leave academia, for whatever reason, I do want to do so having finished my book.

Comeonbishbosh - many congratulations on your pregnancy!
There is a lecturer in my institution who persuaded them to make her post part-time with a guarantee of it becoming full-time again after a few years. She is a research star so it is not something that's going to be an option for some of us on this thread at this stage (!) but it's worth knowing that it has happened in some cases.

PhDLife - congratulations on turning 40
Things will get easier once your dh is better/your dcs are a little bit bigger.

Congratulations Kathy! I hope you have time to enjoy your maternity leave, as well as gettig a couple of publications out.

And congratulations comeonbishbosh!
I work part-time (3 days), but I'm one of the research-only people you mentioned. I don't really feel I'm holding research together very well, and so would feel quite daunted if I were lecturing as well. I have a colleague who is a lecturer who works 4 days a week, but I'm not sure how she is coping - she seems to be holding her own, but is always very stressed when I see her, and says it's very difficult juggling everything. Her partner is also an academic in the same department and I think in a child-care emergency whichever of them is available helps out - it would be a lot tougher if he worked at a stricter 9-5 type job.

One of the problems with part-time as a lecturer as I see it is that courses often can't be split up, so if you're only working say 3 days, there's no such thing as 0.6 of a course... I think you probably end up doing more than your fair share of teaching which of course eats into the research time, especially as you become more reluctant to work in evenings and weekends.

Somewhat downbeat view, I'm afraid! On the plus side, the colleague I mentioned is getting decent student feedback on her courses, and has a couple of recent publications, so clearly it can be done.

oh Kathy, congratulations!!

to celebrate 40 I have put a blue stripe in my hair (since I am not going to be working any time soon )

Surely academia is one of the few professions where you can get away with a blue stripe?

well yes, IF I was going to be working in academia. feelin' pretty doubtful about that atm.

sorry

still keeping fingers crossed for you though....

Perhaps the blue stripe is a sign of things to come and by the end of 2010 you will be a radical pomo academic somewhere? (A bit like the annoying advice, 'dress for the job you want, not the job you have')

Am feeling rather swamped by the start of term. Teaching and toddler-induced sleep deprivation not a great combination.

There is currently a trend in our department of male academics with SAHW/Ms smugly telling us how they get in early to do two hours research before the day starts, and how we should all adopt this wonderful practice. I feel like grabbing them by the lapels and hissing 'Yes but you don't have to get your children up in the morning, DO YOU?!!'

Aargh & LOL @ the academics with stay-at-home partners and their useless helpful tips on how to get things done.
Sympathy over the teaching-while-exhausted. Reminds me that this time last year I was doing the 'welcome new students' talk on very near zero sleep the previous night. Are we all mad?

oh I just lose all sense of humour when I'm this tired . dh still away and I'm suffering intense sleep deprivation atm.

otoh, it could be madness: I've often thought that if I was in a relationship like this with a person rather than a job, that all my friends would be telling me to get out!

Hello everybody. Congratulations to Kathy on your new baby and sorry about all the horrible job stuff.

I am looking for some sympathy or support from more experienced academics than me! I have just received comments on my first ever paper. Of course, I was hoping they'd say it was a work of unparallelled genius . In reality, I've got a 'revise and resubmit.'

Thing is, two ref's comments are actually OK-ish and say it's almost publishable in its current form, but one seems really pretty bad (I mean the comments actually HURT!). Of course, I am only focusing on the bad one and have decided that he/she must be the only one who knows anything about it! Is that normal? I don't know whether to feel really demoralised or not, or what to do next!

It's really quite hard this process isn't it - or is it just me? I feel as though my peers are speeding ahead, and I should have got published long ago, before I even finished my PHd, for even a hope of a job after this postdoc.

Moan over.