Would the ageing population comment at work be considered ageist?

[theninthwave]

I am 60 years old and the company I work for has recently been brought out by an American company. Recently I had to attend line manager training for recruitment and one of the subjects brought up by a participant was about what to do when recruiting someone if they didn't have access to email (the company uses DocuSign for contracts).
This guy mentioned that some of his potential drivers were 58 (oh no!) and didn't have email addresses - not sure what their age has to do with this???
As if this wasn't bad enough the person doing the training (quite senior in rank, but probably mid 30s) responded by saying, "Ah yes, the aging population." !!
Myself and another 'older' lady on the course exchanged glances, and this has bothered me ever since. When I joined the company as an experienced 59 year old manager the function was a mess - I have since sorted it out and got it organised. In addition, the majority of new recruits and contract staff are over 50. They seem to be totally reliant on the over 50s to get the work done, but obviously see us as 'the aging population'.
I have also had to attend meetings with younger representatives from the US who have been rude and condescending. I've worked for US companies twice in my career and have both times decided to leave. Trouble is I only need to stick it for another three years or so, then I'll be a position to go self employed doing something I'll enjoy much more and that will take me into my older years.
Two questions - would the 'aging population' remark be considered ageist, and should I complain (may seem petty but it's what attitudes underlie it isn't it?), and do I stick it out or start to look elsewhere (I still get a lot of agency calls about jobs)?

I’m surprised so many posters see nothing wrong with these comments. ‘Ageing population’ referring to people within your own workforce is othering; I would certainly feel like I wasn’t seen as a colleague, but an ageing colleague if I was in this situation.

And that’s a problem because the term is highly negative in tone. ‘Ageing population’ is a phrase I associate with media reports about the problems a society might be facing where a high percentage of individuals are above a certain age. Problems like that population being a drain on the economy as opposed to younger people. It brings to mind care homes and dementia. These things may be realities at a population level and I’d agree language shouldn’t be minced when talking about them, but it’s an awful way to talk about employees who are contributing and capable.

I think it’s terrible, op, and should be challenged.

Ermmm....am 55. In 2000 when we were all getting. hotmail addresses and finding lost school mates on Friends Reunited, I was 30. Mature enough to be established at work, young enough not to be scared of the Internet. It's deeply insulting to suggest someone of my age is so old they missed the Internet altogether. That was my mum who, if still alive, would be 88. But even so, I know plenty of people into their 70s and beyond who are perfectly capable of accurate use of an iPad, smart phone and laptop. It beggars belief people think otherwise.

Age UK.

Actually it's over 65, not over 60.

18% of people aged 65 & over, around 2.3m, do not use the internet.

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/siteassets/documents/reports-and-publications/reports-and-briefings/active-communities/internet-use-statistics-june-2024.pdf

Yes if you like.

Or Age Uk...

I’d keep in mind that at some point it might be appropriate to contact HR. Many US companies are ignorant of UK / EU employment laws and policies. This applies to such things as disability rights, paternity and maternity rights, respecting the work life balance and not expecting people to be available 24/7. That causes genuine problems until corrected.

Yeah. There are (according to gov.uk) more than 14.5 million people aged 60 or over in the UK, and 3.2 million of those are over 80. So if, as the pp says, 2 million people over 60 in the UK aren't using the internet, chances are that nearly all of them fall into the over 80 bracket. Hardly likely to be looking for a job and needing an email address, are they?

Besides, I know a few people in the 70+ age bracket who still have a joint email address with their spouse, left over from when the internet became a thing and people never really thought they would need one each.

Ageism really fucks me off and all I can say to those people who have such ageist views, is that one day they too will be old enough for it to happen to them. And it will serve them bloody well right😁

18% of over 65s. So 18% of people between 65 and 100+

As someone mentioned, that’s likely to be mainly over 80s.

Of course, all the ageism on this thread is likely to come back and bite most of you in the arse at some point 🤣🤣

The summary bullet points at the top of that document make clear that the overwhelming majority of those offline users over 65 are in the 75+ age bracket. Given that it’s talking about figures from a few years ago, these non-users would be in the 80+ bracket now.

A very different picture to someone in their late 50s, which is what the op described! I cannot see an age-related reason as to why someone of 58 wouldn’t have an email address as they’ll have spent the majority of their adult life in the digital age - unlike someone in their 90s!

I hear a lot of ageist twaddle at work. Maybe it's always been there and I'm suddenly noticing now I'm 50!

Maybe you could say some withering stereotypical comment Americans as passive aggressive revenge?

Correct.

As I said earlier, over 2 million people aged over 60.

Although I stand corrected and it was over 65.

Still, I'm not sure what your problem is with me stating this?

You appear to be acting a bit weird about it?

You are right OP. We train corporates in inclusion n I’m in tech but I’m still wary that I suffer due to unconscious bias as a 58 year old female. Inside I identify as Irish one off the IT crowd.

You described the op as making herself 'look very silly' if she raised the age point. In fact, I think she's quite right to ask what being 58 has to do with not having an email address and why the speaker felt the need to mention it. The report you linked to is about people a good decade older, and in fact overwhelmingly two decades older. I.e. people for whom the internet exploded when they were already at a much later stage in life and so were less likely to adopt it. Age surely has nothing to do with a 58-year-old not having an email address. The speaker sounds ignorant and it is not 'very silly' at all to challenge it.

I believe every age has value and an unique perspective.

Aren’t we all members of the ‘aging population’? I don’t know anyone who gets younger as time goes on.

You described the op as making herself 'look very silly' if she raised the age point.

No I didn’t.

I said she’d look very silly to pretend it isn’t a factor.

Airing your opinion doesn't change theirs and I don't see any good outcome for you, in this scenario. What are you hoping to achieve?

I'm not suggesting the view, comments etc are fair, but would recommend against doing anything that hurts more than comments.

It’s highly unlikely to be a factor at 58.

Or do you think the report you linked demonstrates a clear linear correlation between increased age and lack of digital skills? So a 35 year-old would be less likely to have an email account than a twenty year-old due to their age?

The reason a large number of people older (much older) than OP’s late fifties colleagues don’t use the internet is because it became popular when they were already at a certain point in their lives and didn’t adopt it, not because the older you get the less likely you are to use it.

It’s absurd to argue that the reason someone in their 50s doesn’t have an email address is due to their advanced age.

(Also, not sure who she’s looking silly to if she’s not raising this with anyone!)

Yep, I was 24 when I got my first email address, in 1998. I’ve been using computers since I was at primary school in the mid-80s. No one over about 40 grew up their whole lives with computers and the web, and yet we can still use them. Meanwhile we have colleagues in their 20s who don’t know about things like file structures and basic MS Office functions.

Who do these people who assume anyone over 50 knows nothing about tech think invented the internet, Google, social media, Mumsnet etc etc? Most people in their 50s are still working, too.

Oh you’re thinking about me 😃
I'm 68 and leeching off the young ‘uns including my 3 kids who pay taxes 🤣

Never mind that I paid mine to enable me to receive a pension based on what my parents paid 😂

She was dead serious. To be honest me and the other older lady on the course had a good laugh about it, especially as the guy who brought up the subject looked at least 50!
But, if this senior woman thinks it's okay to say that dies she also think it's okay to stereotype younger people?

I am over 60 and I wouldn't die on this hill, it's not worth it.

Interesting to see the various responses here. I am guessing those who don't think this is an issue are mainly younger. Well, good luck cos there's a shed load of crap coming your way!
As a hearing impaired person who got 'told off' for mentioning that I couldn't understand someone who spoke in a strong Slavik accent, due to my hearing loss, it's sickening how people think it's okay to stereotype based on age, but anything else is offensive.
As for the pension issue, what about all those who never had children paying for everyone else's kids? Should they get a rebate maybe? Or, maybe people who have never claimed any benefits get a rebate they retire?
Should my grandfather who was born in 1894 and fought in both world wars (in the medical corps) not have received a pension cos, you know, he was no longer paying in? Even though he worked from the age of 15? What a mean spirited, naive and selfish attitude! People now are better off in the UK than they have ever been! My mother was a child in London during the WW2 blitz in the East End (look it up...). At one point half their house was bombed and they had to continue living in the other half! When she got her first wage packet she "treated" herself TO A BL**DY BAR OF IMPERIAL LEATHER SOAP!!! Because due to the war they hadn't been able to get proper soap. And you are moaning because people are getting pensions??? No doubt you have shower gel, face wash , and unbombed property to live in, holidays etc. Why shouldn't people who have worked hard have their pensions? I've been working since I was 16, frequently had a second job, and had three jobs at one point. That's 44 years of working, nursing a mother through cancer, 12 years of also looking after a father with dementia - but God forbid I should have my (let's face it) pittance of a state pension or NHS treatment (which I don't actually as am very healthy and have BUPA through work).
Typical whiny millennial attitude (tell you're not, go on). Nice to be stereotyped based on age huh?

If it were an English Company that bought the original owners out would you still have this stance.

You have been given a 25% increase in your salary to acknowledge your worth yet you still want to stir things up or is it that really you wanted redundancy.

Whilst some of the language used in the meeting may leave a lot to be desired, it actually is a clumsy way of acknowledging that us oldies have the knowledge in our heads whilst at the same time being reticent to join the techno age. I for one was like that years ago. Swore I would never have an iPhone, then along came Covid and realised I had to have one for certain medical things. I remember feeling very put out at the time.

You have two options. Feel proud they took the time to research your input and acknowledge the wage increase as such. Help your colleagues that will struggle with the change and have not been as fortunate with such a leap in money in these difficult times or, take the bitterness you seem to feel and move to another Company.

If you decide to stay and nit pick each day as to language being used, your colleagues will not thank you one bit. You will make coming into work less enjoyable for them and create an atmosphere.

Stereotyping or being derogatory to a group based on a protected characteristic, especially in the workplace is discriminatory. And yes, I’d say this was ageism as he was publicly emphasising a problematic association with one group of people who share a characteristic.

I might just sidle up to him by the photocopier and make a big thing of whispering about the Equality Act and that you personally didn’t see it as a problem…but he might not know, as an American, how important it is to be careful about making sweeping generalisations like that here in the UK in the workplace.

Wasn't there a report recently about how people in their 50s are more likely to comfortable with email and different tech when they start a new job than people in their teens, who have always used phones?
I'm not in my 50s, but I would never argue with the people who have used everything from a VCR to AI, and know how to do cassette tape surgery with a pencil.
Seriously, it's the sneering attitude you seem to think they have that bothers me. There is nothing wrong with saying that men on average can carry heavier weights than women, but saying my brilliant Body Pump instructor mate shouldn't be allowed her job because she is a woman is sexist and stupid.