Mums forced into office by big UK company?

[MM90]

I work for a big, well-known company. The bosses are considering plans to force all colleagues to come to the office 3 days a week. They are thinking about checking our turnstile data individually and disciplining anyone who doesn’t come in for 3 days every week, whether they need to be there or not. I thought this was the 21st century where working women have the chance to create a sensible work / life balance so long as they perform in their job. My line manager gave me a great performance rating during Covid. I have two children under 5 and no family nearby. Any thoughts on this?

@PinkPeonies22 so you're openly saying you're working from home while your kids are home? You don't have childcare in place?

Unfortunately I think it's threads like this and the lead into people combining "wfh" with childcare that is leading to bringing people back into the office.

If people who are "wfh" are simultaneously childminding, taking dog for a walk, going to the gym etc it's very different to when you're present.

Oh don't worry - my colleagues aren't ignoring their children! Based on their reduced work efficacy I would say they are meeting their children's needs just fine.

Well that is good to hear☺️

I have mixed feelings when I'm chasing them for a response, but yes I suppose you're right!

I'm wondering what career I should have chosen to be able to shamelessly think it's okay to play with my kids after school instead of work.

I would like a change! I work every minute I'm paid for and this sounds much better 😁

I'm just not getting how pre Covid the majority of parents seemed to be able to attend their workplaces daily and somehow now this is impossible.

My childcare is fortunately 8 to 6,so i can work a 8 hour day from 8.30 to 5.30, thanks to wfh, but if i had to commute on top, this would be impossible. My point is that if childcare available is only 9 to 3, wfh will allow parents to maximise working hours, eg possibly 9.15 to 2.45 if nursery is close by, which they cannot do if commuting. Personally i would find it impossible to work while watching my 2 year old, who demands full attention at alll times.

I agree. The nurseries around here haven't changed their hours and there's the same childminder provision.

Speaking for myself - pre COVID, we managed this by staggering our hours slightly so say DH would drop off at 8, work 9-5:30 or so, I would get in early and pick up at 5 and work 8-4 or so.

It's a lot easier WFH because we don't have to do that but it was doable before. We now hybrid work so basically take it in turns to WFH and do the pick ups/drop offs - still easier than it was pre COVID

I think it's the parents who never had to do full office attendance that just haven't quite worked out how to do it

Demanding in-office attendance when you've been performing your job to a high standard while working from home is unreasonable

I agree, and that's why WFH is still just fine where it works for everyone, sensible monitoring's in place and most are pulling their weight

But as said so often it depends on who's defining the "high standard", and there can be a difference between what staff - who naturally want the WFH to continue - claim, and the view of those actually doing the paying

Demanding in-office attendance when you've been performing your job to a high standard while working from home is unreasonable

There is so much gained by being in the office - more than individual performance, it allows a level of cooperation that doesn't exist if everyone is wfh.

Also employees "keeping companies afloat" comment. I hope you realise that the alternative would have been mass redundancies and sunk pension funds so it's in employees interests to keep companies afloat.

I agree with the commdny. Those parents who didn't work pre 2020 just having worked it out yet. There will be options and some flexibility that will make it work.

The company I worked for did the same thing. Sadly it sounds as toxic as the place that I’ve just left! Treat adults like kids “monitoring attendance by way if swipe card or turn-style data” There seems to be an unspoken conspiracy narrative ALL companies are following. They won’t tell the employees the truth about where it’s come from, my guess is it was from the Tory gov. I took my role as “remote” and confirmed at the time of contract that I wouldn’t commit to hybrid of the circumstances were to change due to their location and I would not and could not spend £350 a mth on train fare there nor would I drive 2hrs either way in traffic. The insisted my contract could never state remote but insisted the role had always been remote for the last 6yrs and always would be. Like an idiot I signed the contract and then 14mths later they shafted me and got away with it. Disgusting behaviour and legalised lying from HR! My request for Flexible working was dragged out for another 2mths and then refused so I quit and refused to work my notice after being treated so badly. Funny enough people are leaving the company in drives due to the same experience I had! These companies are getting away with murder. I also don’t know of ANYONE that had their flexi work request agreed either. Treading a fine life and likely to be sued as I thought single parents would het some help and support of flexi start and finish or compressed hours but no they are forcing people out of jobs instead. All this media hype that flexi work can be requested from day one in any job is pointless! It’s a big fat lie, employers want slaves and to dictate to their workforce and have their own way regardless. So until companies get with the real world this will continue. Pretending there’s flexibility when there actually isn’t, childcare costs are extortionate, what are people supposed to do with all this. I took a job close to home but alot leas £, not ideal but im now happy, my anxiety is nil and I no longer dread going to work, even remotely the toxicity of people was a cross to barw theough Teams. You are better off out of there don’t be a pawn in their game.

Absolutely SPOT ON! The lies that companies are telling and the misleading encouragement of “flexi working requests” leaves me speechless. I out performed in my role from day 1, constantly praised by my line manager and dept managers until the goalposts changed. When I challenged them I fell out of favour for to speak they truth and question things. My final Flexi work appeal was with the Head of HR and 2 other senior bigwigs who tried to put the frighteners on me…..didn’t work, I stood my ground and they had no real answers for my questions. When I bought up my consistent “out performance” of my role and various other positives I was told it’s not about the quality or quantity or standard of work it’s about …..”collaboration” 🤣 cringe! Awww you want me to waste £350 a mth coming 3days to the office to talk shit, drink coffee n hobnob with people I couldn’t give 2hoots about, when I could be happily remote, not wasting time commuting and having no work life balance. I resigned in the meeting and said I'm not working my notice I want out of this toxic hole asap. Funny enough they have already gone through 3 people or my old role. Look who’s laughing now

there are others who are not close to school and refuse to use before school care, after school care, vacation care and in some cases nursery, and who are not doing the right thing by employers and coworkers

And do you have evidence for this assertion or are you basing it on a few threads on MN?

There is so much gained by being in the office - more than individual performance, it allows a level of cooperation that doesn't exist if everyone is wfh

Depends on the job. I don't need to be in the office, I think the people who supervise graduates and other trainees do (at least more often than I am). Sensible employers don't have a one size fits all policy.

I think it's the parents who never had to do full office attendance that just haven't quite worked out how to do it

Also there was a time during and just after covid when the trains were pretty reliable, I think because they weren't running as many it was easier to recover the service if there were problems. Now they are close to the pre-covid service it isn't. And they still run less frequent trains from where I am, which is another issue for people if they need to get home for a nursery pick-up.

No it’s not, it’s due to a far bigger behind the scenes narrative that has been rolled out. Yeah I don’t doubt some people may have taken the mickey BUT I have various friends and neighbours that were working remotely in different industries and we are all being given the same waffle and excuses. They want bums on seats in offices and micro management to return. Without it….middle management don’t have a job to do.

Oh dear always someone with a belittling statement like this. OP doesn’t need to be thankful they don’t work in Sainsbury’s….they wouldn’t be working there in the first place due to their circumstances and flexibility needs. So many people with this outdated attitude from the dark ages. Life has moved on, flexibility is needed for some workers, we are in a digital age and yet people want to go backwards and refuse change. Employees acting like it’s not a job n a dictatorship. Work isn’t a place that you go it’s something you do. Obvs depends on what your skillset is. Mine was digital but if I need to be sat and micromanaged and babysat while outperforming no thanks I’ve returned to self employment and I’ll make my own choices

Totally agree AlexiaH.

The paternalistic approach of employers needs to change. Their employees make them money, either directly or indirectly, and need to be treated properly.

If you get a bad penny, you deal with that bad penny.

You don't have draconian policies for control's sake.

I saw a job advertised locally which was 12 hours a week. They said "we may permit home working after two years' service". My, that's big of them! It was an office job that, from the description at least, could easily be done at home.

Full time I get it's hard for parents

x3 days a week is doable and unless you have a remote wfh contract you can't say too much

I do x3 days and x2 from home it works fine although I wouid much prefer x2 in office

If you get a bad penny, you deal with that bad penny.

My experience post covid with a team of circa 300 people, though, was that there was a massive increase in the number of 'bad pennies', and they all became worse when working from home. In that instance it was the many spoiling it for the few, so I ended up getting them all back in the office. Guess what? We stopped missing deadlines and productivity went up.

I concede that this is a sample of a single company, and there were other factors to take into consideration, however I tried everything I could to let them self organise / carry on flexibly.

Also, as a manager, it is much easier to gain information over a water cooler conversation. Again, not insurmountable, but the organic nature is often lost. I haven't read every post above, but of all the ones I did read, all the comments were about the individuals and not the company / management.

I think people forget that younger and less experienced workers really need that interaction in the workplace. They do not want to be isolated at home, they have missed out on all the social interactions and learning opportunities that just happen by simply working alongside experienced colleagues. I get those with childcare issues wanting the convenience that of WFH but it is not always conducive to a good relationship with colleagues and an overall positive workplace environment.

Also every time I call an organisation I can instantly tell they are WFH. The service is consistently poor, they seem unbelievably slow and poorly trained and if they have a query they have to raise it via teams with a manager who invariably is also WFH and too busy doing school pickup to respond.

Well, my experience is the exact opposite, so I guess between your anecdata and my anecdata the net score is at 0.

Major crisis in childcare industry has reduced availability!?!

Grandparents less willing and able to help with post nursery childcare because plague rats.

More parents in the workforce having taken a job than needs to not have a commute to work