Mums in the arts: writing, visual arts, etc

[expatkat]

I feel like there's a special set of problems that women who work out of the home don't encounter in the same way we do

Often we work at home, isolated, andeven if you can afford, say, a nanny or childminder to watch the children for a few hours, when the children are at home they often assume you are availableeven if you've made it clear that you're not--and they feel extra abandoment when, say, you ask them to leave so you can continue working.

Similarly, my actor friend spent a whole year when she pretty much never put her DD to bed because she had West End performances every night. This was incredibly hard for her DD

My DS (8) is proud that I've published a book and have another on the way, and that I do journalism/criticism too. I get him involved when I can--he is honest if something I've written is rubbish (and is always right!)

But in another way I think children can sense they come "second" to another passion/calling. Which is sadly the case for me right now because my career is just beginning to pick up, and I do put them second sometimes.

It's a huge source of guilt.

I had children because I like children very much, and wanted them badly. I thought I'd easily be able to fit my writing around their school days, etc, but in a way its been the opposite. A structured daily corporate/office job works better IMO--or by the sounds of it, it does.

Oh yes--the other difficulty of being a writer, is that you're out a lot in the evenings. . .lots parties/readings/events, opportunities to hang out with other writers, and lessen the isolation one feels. Also, if you're a creative writer, traveling around giving readings is a source of income.

Are there any other professional writers on here who struggle with ambivalence and MAJOR GUILT about the way they are handling motherhood?

Oh God yes. I'm a journo and always stealing bits of time from ds and dd to try and do a bit of research or make a call - look at them sneakily and wonder how deeply involved they are in a game or CBeebies and whether I have time to send that email or finish that outro.

I had an office-based job when I was pregnant with my dc but am now pregnant and at home with them and working and I remember the sheer luxury of going into the office and being able to get on with things and have a bit of downtime and rest. I even used to like the commute because I could read in peace. It was also great because I could pace the work whereas now I have typical freelancer's feast or famine.

But, having said all that, we had a very bad experience with a childminder who was caring for my ds a few months ago and, if I had still been working at the office, there is no way I would have been able to withdraw him immediately and keep him at home until I felt he was old enough to cope with nursery. I am also very lucky that my husband works late shifts on a newspaper so he can care for the children until lunchtime but, yes, working in a child-free environment would be unimaginable bliss.

I was interested to see what you were going to say about this. I've been working from home for years, as well as doing house renovations I've worked as a question-setter for TV for several years. Now I've moved to Bermuda and decided to give my long-cherished dream of being a writer a go.

Sometimes I felt the children didn't understand that if I was lying on the couch reading a pile of novels it was work, and sometimes to be sure, it didn't feel like it!

I think another problem is that you are surrounded by other jobs that are going to require your attention, the ironing, the dusting, writing your Christmas cards, etc, and because those things are in your face you feel torn in a way you wouldn't if you worked outside the home.

At the moment I am struggling badly. I've written a novel and it only needs a final edit before I can submit it somewhere, I've written two articles for a series I was planning and have copious notes for more. But I'm having chemotherapy so my dream has gone a little awry. I think this is a perfect time to get on with my writing but I haven't lifted a finger. I just feel too washed out even to look at my writing and the hours, the days, the weeks go by. I feel I am wasting the time but I just can't summon the energy I need to write. And it does take energy, lots of it, to write about emotional issues in a way that is real.

I think I have strayed off your point really, kat, but I hope you don't mind as I think these issues are all intertwined.

Well you are dealing with a separate set up challenges, anorak--more serious ones than the usual, e.g. chemo, and a move to Bermuda, and the struggle with believing that your work is "work". (Social pressures contribute to that lack of confidence.) I view my work as work because i believe it is, but it took a while to believe it. I come from a family, as does DH, that has a conservative view of careers.

But see(and this goes back to my original point), being an ambitious/serious writer requires a selfishness that makes me uncomfortable and guilty. I, for example, don't do xmas cards. I don't do ironing either(but I'm lucky that dh can afford someone to come in and do my ironing.) But you see: he views my work as work, so contributes however he can. He doesn't have some hierarchical view; just because he makes more money, he doesn't view my work is less important than his.

Plus: DH and I don't buy into the whole idea of what women are "supposed" to do. DH and I share the domestic work; he organizes the kids' activities as much as I do. My marriage isn't ideal in other ways, but at least I'm with someone who feels my time is as valuable as his.

All that said: I DO feel guilty. So I haven't managed to vanquish all those traditional views of mothers vs. father/men vs women! I feel very uncomfortable with what I feel is "selfishness."

Journalism is a whole dif thing lalalonglegs (I bow at the feet of journalists) and I'd imagine that's really hard because of the constant deadlines. (I just do a little journalism because the deadlines nearly kill me.)

On the other hand, not sure if you have all that obligatory travel and parties and events and readings and so forth, which you start to feel you have to attend. So in a way it's the being away at night which is almost worse for me.

I dream of my writing reaching the stage where I get all those invites, kat. You've obviously worked really hard to be so successful. Well done to you.

I sometimes think that we feel guilty about settling down to do some writing because we enjoy it so much - it feels like a guilty pleasure. I have enormous trouble teaching myself to arrange my day so that the writing comes first, rather than 'clearing the decks' in order to make time for the writing. Something deep within me sees it as not work, but a self-indulgence.

And I think if I didn't keep overruling that philosophy within myself, I'd go on leaving it until my life was over, saving it till I'd 'earned the right' to justify time spent on something so uncertain as a wage-earner.

Thank you for starting this discussion, kat, I'm finding it really useful.

Hi Kat et al,

I feel like a bit of a ligger on this thread but I do have related issues, but deal with them a bit differently. I am an academic, so in one sense, a professional writer (though not actually very good at it, partly - not blaming them - because of having children). Actually I do write creatively also, but at the moment only for myself and because it is what I've always done. I much prefer the freedom of that, and find the academic writing quite stultifying these days.

But because I - when I'm not on maternity leave - have an unstructured structured job, I imagine it is a bit easier. I couldn't cope without childcare TBH although lots of academics do try to juggle things while working at home (bad idea IMHO). The problem for me is that the mundane bits of the job (teaching, admin, pastoral work) pretty much fill the whole week, and the research/writing need to be done at other times. I don't really have those other times cos although DH is a fully equal partner, he works hard too and we try to keep evenings/weekends for family, not to mention crashing out exhausted. Or sitting on MN of course!

The big question for me, I guess, is whether writing can, must be done in a much more structured way for women with children, or whether it is possible to just work when you can? Do you all write at the same time each day etc? Are there times for your writing, and your family, that you protect or does it all just blend together?

I would like more space for my own writing, but at present, think I'll find it incredibly difficult to give myself that time when I'm back at work (in June! Argh!). that's partly why I'm trying to get a bit more rhythm at the moment.

welcome hotcrossMonkeybun! [not that I own this tread]

IMO being an academic is exactly the same thing.

Given that your writing is academic in natureor mostlyor at this moment at least--probably it would be a good idea to adhere to a schedule because that kind of writing lends itself to a schedule. (That's what my academic mum friends tend to say/do.)

Being a novelists (almost paradoxically) works the same way (usually). It's often a matter of banging out a certain amount of pages a day--and novelists (in my experience) tend to be pretty systematic about it.

My genre, poetry, is different in that writing it can be intense and unpredictable. I often just need to leave for a while to get any good work done. And mums just don't "do" thatleave, I meanbut I do. Still : other poet mums do just fine and write well within tight time restrictions. Everyone's different.

Tomorrow I'm going to an artists's colony for 2 weeks and feel BESIDE myself with guilt. If DH went on 2-week biz trip, no one would think twice. Its harder for us (I think). It's somehow not "work" in the same way. . .well not unless you're Zadie Smith. Who (rather fortunately) doesn't have children.

One thing I have found is that I can't write unless I am alone in the house.

Which means I can't do a thing during the school holidays, unfortunately. I often read my stuff aloud to myself, to make sure it sounds okay, iykwim. And I just can't put myself into my characters' heads without deep concentration - which never happens if there are other people in the house.

Lalalonglegs, do you not use childcare? I freelanced - I am a journalist - from when my babies were four months old - I had to, quite apart from wanting to - but I couldn't have done the four solid days of work that I did, without childcare. I can't/won't do that move-it-all-together bit. I saw my mother try to combine childcare and a PhD, and she never finished the PhD.

I think it is no bad thing for children to realise that there is something equally important to their mothers as them. Equally, not more.

Expatkat, I have done bog-all on my own novel for bloody ages...

My daughter is at a pre-school nursery thingy but we withdrew my son from his childminder and then couldn't find another we wanted to use and, I'm not working full tilt, so we get by with juggling. He will be starting at dd's nursery for a couple of days a week in May when he turns two so that I have some time alone with the newborn and I'm really lucky that I have a couple of regular columns which I can knock off with ease and that will keep the wolf from the door until I can decide when to start taking on more work again.

Sorry Expatkat - I wasn't trying to compare journalism with writing books which I consider a much higher calling, just trying to sympathise with the working from home situation. Hope your book is working out.

I think part of the issue is that (a) writing isn't considered 'work' - any bugger can do it, supposedly, from journalism on (b) the expectations of/needs of mothers differ so greatly for those on men. Very few male writers seem to wrestle with (b).

And then there is the idea that being at home somehow isn't work, even if what we are doing within that home is working. People assume I do housework during my working hours, ffs. (I get faintly insulted by this.)

In my world,(had name-changed BTW, now slightly closer to the original again), we suffer from the same notion that the writing part is vocational and all the rest is 'daily grind'. Which means it is OK for the writing to be treated as a moveable feast. It gets squeezed into the edges, at least for academics in the mediocre, low-rent universities (like mine, ahem...).

Oh now I sound like I'm moaning and whigeing, and that's unforgivable really when you do a job like mine - it's not a bloody factory FFS.

I guess I also wish I didn't care so much about what I'm trying to write for work - perhaps that would make it easier to churn out.

Yes, the churning factor is consoling I find

God I wish I was a proper writer...

oops, hope I wasn't being insulting MI. Wasn't trying to be, just my usual crass self.

Mind you, I do like a bit of journo bashing sometimes (only because I'm so envious) and now you know what I do you can return the favour with corduroy jacket and elbow patch ripostes, to add to my Really Long Holidays...

Oh goodness, no, was serious about the churning! I am indeed having a Churning Day. Feel positive milkmaidish

I think you have to think about it as a Proper Job.

There isn't that much difference between what you do and going out to work in the office. The guilt you feel is the same I think. Though I know it's different because you are aware that you are 'there' but also most definitely 'not there.'

I agree with MI that largely speaking it is important for your children to know you have other things - even if it confounds and irritates them.

You need to give yourself working hours, which everyone understand. Discipline. You might even think about working outside the home, if there's a room you can go to.

The advantage is the flexibility, the disadvantage is that there isn't enough structure. It might help to create some artifical structure, and office hours?

Though I shall temper that by saying that my children have the great misfortune of living with TWO writers - and a more attention-seeking gaggle of children you couldn't help to meet.

Or hope to meet.

I also think it's incredibly good for the dcs to see that I enjoy what I do, and that work can be fun (I'm a freelance journalist).

I'm pretty good at ringfencing my time though. I work from home p/t and have a nanny on those days. The dcs know that when I'm in my office, I'm out of bounds. Equally, I take pleasure in refusing work which I can't fit into my schedule. I won't work at night or w/es for instance. I love that feeling of autonomy. It gives me a massive thrill. It's the best thing about being freelance/self-employed, imo.

Other fab thing about not being officebound is being so much more efficient with time. When I think of all the hours I wasted, commuting or sitting in meetings... ugh.

Hi there,...Interesting to see all your thoughts on this. I'm an advertising photographer and have somehow become much more successful than I ever imagined. I'm constantly wracked with guilt trying to balance my gorgeous dc's, and my career, which I love and have dedicated my entire life to. I can disappear at the drop of a hat on a trip for 2 weeks and then be at home trying to meet deadlines and still not giving dc's the attention they deserve. I also have quite a few people working with/for me, agents, clients assistants who also want my attention and nobody wants to wait..(especially the kids ) I'm not sure how to deal with this anymore really. I'm either going to have to scale down my career or become so uber successfull I have a huge team working for me just so I can read the kids a story without stopping to answer the phone. I think it'll probably have to be the 1st option as I'm going to have a nervous breakdown achieving the 2nd!

I agree Myeye...dc's are very proud of me and are always bragging to friends and family. but

I have to say that the way I managed with pre-schoolers was to have them physically out of the house at their childminder's.

Oh god must go and Churn. Have 400 words to produce by, well, quite soon. Must reduce the raw material of this morning's interview to a tempting confection of well-placed nuances. And all that.

Could I ask you professional churners a bit more about your working habits, then? If it isn't too rude?

How long does it take yer average journo to churn 400 words? How many words a day do you average? Do you do it all first thing, or wait until the moment takes you, or, erm, last thing, before the deadline is upon you?

I'm hoping to improve my academic writing TBH and fit in other writing and I suspect I just need to develop a better work ethic about it...

...and get the fark off MN, obv.

you are sooo right Monkeybird....
LOL's