Disciplinary over Tweets - I need a hand hold

[BelgianFudge]

Does anyone have any experience of facing disciplinary over getting into a twitter spat? Nothing to do with the employer, but someone has sent screenshots to them and disciplinary action has been initiated.

Sorry for scant detail but I'm understandably worried about revealing much.

I have to ask a tough question, do you think that the anger and argumentative behaviour has occurred in person, as well as online?

No it hasn't - his colleagues know his views, but he is restrained at work. His boss confirmed that in his interview. And like I've alluded to - his boss isn't his biggest fan, so he wouldn't hesitate to say if this behaviour had spilled over into the workplace.

DH has a t shirt with a slogan on relating to Brexit - he deliberately doesn't wear it at work because he doesn't want to provoke his brexiteer colleagues.

He should get a copy of the investigation meeting notes ahead of the gross misconduct meeting. The invite to the gross misconduct should explain exactly what he has allegedly done and which policies it breaks.

What has the union rep said?

He only seems to be "mortified " and learned his lesson now the shit's got serious... He has repeatedly not learned any lesson from past incidents and it's only now he could loose his job he is suddenly contrite. What utter bollocks - HR will see right through this.
And telling people who he happens to disagree with that they are a dickhead makes him an arrogant, immature twat.
Sorry op, but it seems to me he deserves all he gets.

"telling people who he happens to disagree with that they are a dickhead makes him an arrogant, immature twat."

Plenty of people really are dickheads and you've just called OP's DH a twat...

@topcat2014

Most companies employ people with views that would upset guardian readers. They can't all be sacked, surely?

Well, exactly. No Twitter user would have a job if you go by what people are saying in this thread.

@BelgianFudge

Yes he's not denying he did it - the evidence is clear.

There are mitigating factors, which he will present. And he is very embarrassed and contrite.

But also I think their allegation of him being linked to the company is tenuous, and their allegation of harrassment is absurd. So they need to be challenged on that.

Do you think they could be challenged on how vague their social media policy is? It doesn't say you can't express political views.

He has a representative from the Union going with him.

The link to the company isn't tenuous though as they've proven that by searching his name and job (that he has chosen to display on Twitter) his company came up straight away, therefore there is a clear link.

The harassment claim I agree probably won't stand up.

There's not much point challenging the social media policy for not including political views as, has been previously mentioned, it isn't the fact of his political views that's caused the issue it's the arguing about them. Had he just posted along the lines of "don't agree with Brexit or PM's decisions" they most likely would never have took disciplinary action, it's because by arguing with other people and calling them names etc, he's showing that he can't respect that others may not have the same views as him. That's what his company won't like, it's fine to have your own opinions on stuff whether that's politics, religion etc but you also need to be respectful of people who have different beliefs and opinions and he's shown that he's not doing that

My husband has a name for people like your husband, a Keyboard Rage-aholic. He's addicted to the fight and drama. After getting reprimanded for his Facebook antics, getting suspended from Twitter, only to make another account, I wouldn't have much faith in him stopping these shenanigans. He's only stopped because he got caught.

@Aquamarine1029

My husband has a name for people like your husband, a Keyboard Rage-aholic. He's addicted to the fight and drama. After getting reprimanded for his Facebook antics, getting suspended from Twitter, only to make another account, I wouldn't have much faith in him stopping these shenanigans. He's only stopped because he got caught.

Imagine Twitter existed for ever.

And say we weren’t living through Brexit, but the Iraq war. Would OP’s DH condemning the war and warmongers be a “rage-aholic” or a person with a strong social conscience?

Go back a few more decades to Nazi Germany. Would Op’s DH be a “rage-aholic” for condemning Nazi politics in strong terms?

At least when his grandchildren ask what he did, he can say I spoke up vocally against injustice. Unlike others who say, well I just put my head down because, you know, my employers social media policies are more important than civil liberties.

Anyway, OP. You might need Flowery from the employment boards. I think she is a lawyer.

Anyway OP you may need Flowery from the employment boards. I think she is a lawyer.

This is the employment board, although you wouldn’t know it from some of the recent posts. I don’t think Flowery is a lawyer but is an HR specialist, but generally we do try to restrict answers to be employment law based.

Thanks AprilX. I think OP needs advice from a lawyer who has dealt with social media matters, not simply an HR specialist.

Firms can overstep legal boundaries with their social media policy and getting advice from a good lawyer early on could be immensely helpful.

And definitely ask for their investigative reports and all materials in writing before attending any meeting. If you feel something doesn’t make sense or is absurd, it probably is. Trust your instincts and judgement, and stand up for yourself, nobody else will.

@Gwenhwyfar oh the irony of your comment

DH has been doing is telling people they are wrong for believing in Brexit

And therein lies the problem

I am amazed at employers that consider the whole of their employees life is their business.

Unless you have actually criticised your employer there should be no case.

But IANAL

And he is very embarrassed and contrite

I dont think he was very embarrassed and contrite when on Twitter, was he?

He's only showing that now because he has been caught out - same as when people are caught out when having an affair. Not sorry about the affair, but sorry for being caught.

Your DH is frankly an idiot - that he was banned previous and still didnt change his habits proves it. Deserves the riot act to be read to him and I would not be surprised if he is sacked.

He's a total dickhead.

@Plonthy

Your DH is frankly an idiot - that he was banned previous and still didnt change his habits proves it. Deserves the riot act to be read to him and I would not be surprised if he is sacked.

He's a total dickhead.

You've responded to my thread which states in the title that I need a hand hold with this.

The irony of you coming into a thread about my DH arguing with strangers by calling him (a complete stranger) an idiot and a dickhead.

Thanks for the support. Your opinion is neither wanted nor useful.

I dont think he was very embarrassed and contrite when on Twitter, was he?

He's only showing that now because he has been caught out - same as when people are caught out when having an affair. Not sorry about the affair, but sorry for being caught.

And thanks for your opinion of what my DH thinks and feels. I can see that you're clearly in a better position to know what he's thinking than I am. Thanks for correcting me.

The irony of you coming into a thread about my DH arguing with strangers by calling him (a complete stranger) an idiot and a dickhead.

Pot, meet kettle....🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️

Plenty of other folks have opined on this thread too - suffice to say, I hope your DH learns a valuable lesson from this. I doubt it, but you never know...

I hope you’re sifting some useful advice from these posts. Whatever people think of your husband’s actions they’re his not yours, and it must be a very stressful and worrying experience for you.

I can see his employers issue if he has been posting about Brexit and calling names, to be honest.

I work somewhere where I am aware that some people voted Leave and some Remain. We live in a democracy.

If I posted on Twitter declaring that anyone who voted Leave is a thick, racist cunt I would expect to be facing a disciplinary. It would be seen as harassment of colleagues who chose to vote a different way from myself. It is grossly offensive.

I'm assuming that's the kind of thing that we are talking about?

Well, according to this academic blog, a large swathe of people who voted Brexit were thick (lesser educated) and racist.

blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/10/09/race-class-and-brexit-how-did-we-get-here/

So if Op’s DH did indeed say that, it is not inaccurate. Although I agree that cunt is a subjective assessment

Anyway, as OP said, it was in a private conversation (not in the workplace) and no one at his work felt harassed. So it is not clear how his employer incurred any loss or damage because of his private actions in his private time

I can’t claim damage if none occurred Eg, I can’t sue a store because they have a broken step. With the argument that the broken step is negligence and I could have slipped and then I may have been injured and I may not be able to work and hence I sue them for lost earnings (all based on hypotheticals)

@Lookingforwardto2021

Well, according to this academic blog, a large swathe of people who voted Brexit were thick (lesser educated) and racist.

Well I have 2 degrees, work in a highly specialised field so certainly not thick or lesser educated and also I'm not racist......I also voted for Brexit....🤔🤔

@Lookingforwardto2021

Well, according to this academic blog, a large swathe of people who voted Brexit were thick (lesser educated) and racist.

blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2018/10/09/race-class-and-brexit-how-did-we-get-here/

So if Op’s DH did indeed say that, it is not inaccurate. Although I agree that cunt is a subjective assessment

Anyway, as OP said, it was in a private conversation (not in the workplace) and no one at his work felt harassed. So it is not clear how his employer incurred any loss or damage because of his private actions in his private time

I can’t claim damage if none occurred Eg, I can’t sue a store because they have a broken step. With the argument that the broken step is negligence and I could have slipped and then I may have been injured and I may not be able to work and hence I sue them for lost earnings (all based on hypotheticals)

That’s the 2nd stupid statement you’ve made on this thread, the first being that the far left are ‘more tolerant’. That’s absolutely ridiculous, as shown by the OPs husband who is being disciplined for persistently arguing with people who don’t share his views.

The new cancel culture we have is due to the ‘woke’ far left refusing to accept any point of view that differs from their own. It’s dangerous and very far from tolerant and inclusive.

I think it may be you who is the ‘lesser educated’

I can’t claim damage if none occurred Eg, I can’t sue a store because they have a broken step. With the argument that the broken step is negligence and I could have slipped and then I may have been injured and I may not be able to work and hence I sue them for lost earnings (all based on hypotheticals)

Yeah, you don't know anything about employment law, do you? An employer doesn't have to "claim damage" to dismiss an employee.

Can an employer dismiss an employee for theoretical offence that could be caused to employees, even when the employees themselves have said that they haven't seen it and it is no longer there?

The fact that the offensive tweets / posts are no longer visible is irrelevant as long that they can be proved that they did exist

(See Mr Trump and his tweets inciting violence. These will come back to bite him even though they are now deleted)

As for making the harassment person-specific, I think this a red herring. To bring a company into disrepute or behaviour unbecoming don't need to be liked back to an individual.

You sound like you're arguing a case for why they are wrong. A better angle would be contrition and full acceptance they are right and a plead for mercy. Afterall, you have already said you/he recognises his behaviour was inappropriate and unacceptable.