Disciplinary over Tweets - I need a hand hold

[BelgianFudge]

Does anyone have any experience of facing disciplinary over getting into a twitter spat? Nothing to do with the employer, but someone has sent screenshots to them and disciplinary action has been initiated.

Sorry for scant detail but I'm understandably worried about revealing much.

@BelgianFudge

Yes - we are hoping he will get a written warning, he may even get a final written warning. He would be massively relieved with that.

I think dismissal for Gross misconduct would be unfair. The way I see it is if he heard of a colleague being sacked for doing the same, what would he think...? His first instinct is he would think it was absurd.

It's not about what you think is fair though.

Harassment under the Equality Act is not the same as harassment in a DV situation where someone is being targeted. Creating a hostile environment can be considered harassment. It would appear that is how they are viewing his conduct.

That concerns harrassment because of a protected characteristic. Does political views come under 'belief' as a protected characteristic?

Still googling.... (your saving me from cleaning and hanging the washing out)

These make interesting reading

elliswhittam.com/blog/dismissal-politics/

www.keepcalmtalklaw.co.uk/social-media-unfair-dismissal-bad-news-for-employees/

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/aug/07/high-court-rules-public-servants-can-be-sacked-for-political-social-media-posts - this one is Australian, but her account was anonymous.

There’s nothing I can find that’s the same as your DH though, although there’s quite a lot of solicitors that have blogs/pages on employment issues to do with social media usage.

What a nightmare for you. I’m glad he’s leant his lesson. I’ve known people to be dismissed over social media posts/pictures/videos before. I was once called up as a witness as I’d been in the background at work (nothing to do with the fun that was going on and didn’t really take any notice at the time!) but someone else had taken a photo and posted it to social media, then that social media post was screenshotted and sent to the chief exec. In that case the person was demoted rather than sacked, but ever since that day I’ve never posted anything on social media that could be turned against me.

Someone else might be a lawyer and have better advice though.

It also says:

For it to count as harassment, both of the following must be true:

the person is justified in feeling harassed
the person being harassed feels they're working in a hostile environment

so they would have to prove that political views are a 'protected characteristic'. He has it on record that his colleagues don't feel harrassed, and don't feel like they work in a hostile environment. His Boss said the same.

He has not expressed these views at work.

It says here that political beliefs are not considered a protected characteristic:

coodes.co.uk/blog/discrimination-at-work-religious-and-philosophical-beliefs/

"What about political beliefs?
There is no protection against discrimination because of political beliefs."

Well, what does the employer's policy define harassment as? Mine takes the wider view of harassment, regardless of protected characteristics, because they want a healthy workplace.

All the employer has to do is demonstrate they have followed their own policies correctly and not acted unlawfully. And that's only if you take them to tribunal.

What do they have an issue with -his views or how he expressed them? ( I would imagine it is the former and he has rubbed someone the wrong way. But they are trying to frame it as the latter being ‘harassment’)

He could possibly argue the Brexit is a philosophical belief and is hence a protected characteristic and he is being harassed and discriminated against by his employer.

Some cases of that I think with a climate change belief and a vegan belief in case law.

If I were you I would have a narrative that is legally strong rather than relying on the goodwill of the employer to do the right thing (they often don’t). But first get utter clarity and details of why this constitutes gross misconduct in their eyes. So they can’t change their story later on.

The employer is not conducting a criminal trial or civil case.

They are implementing their own employment policies.

This is interesting

www.internationallawoffice.com/Newsletters/Employment-Immigration/United-Kingdom/Lewis-Silkin/Something-to-be-leave-in-Brexit-as-a-philosophical-belief

So views on remain/leave may be construed as a philosophical beliefs (although a grey area). If it construed as a philosophical belief, then you could argue that DH should not be discriminated against in the workplace for expressing his belief that we are a core part of EU (although he expressed it outside the workplace and it has sod all to do with his busybody employers!)

But is it his political views he’s in trouble for? Or calling someone a dickhead and telling them to shut up?

That's interesting. But it could therefore also be argued that him being an arsehole on Twitter about people who don't hold that same belief is him harrassing their philosophical belief.

Well, what does the employer's policy define harassment as?

Good question. I don't know. I'll check.

@PinkSnowAndStars

But is it his political views he’s in trouble for? Or calling someone a dickhead and telling them to shut up?

It's him being aggresive and sweary on Twitter about the government and Brexit voters.

Him calling someone a dickhead is what brought it to their attention (because that dickhead sent them a screenshot). But they then looked into his old twitter account and were not impressed by what they found.

@user1174147897

The employer is not conducting a criminal trial or civil case.

They are implementing their own employment policies.

Yes, but they are bound by law. If OPs husband has been there for two years, he has employment rights.

Employers often have a right to dismiss someone if they had a criminal conviction during their employment. Much more grey in civil matters.

But being dismissed because you expressed your political views strongly in your private social media account? We should be wary of that and stand up for our rights. Otherwise we won’t have any left!

I know it is easy to say it and OP and her husband are facing the stress. But it has come to this and they have options ranging from saying sorry and hope the employer is reasonable to standing up for themselves and pushing the employer regarding their civil liberties and rights. They don’t lose that simply because the employer as a vague policy.

In this thread you have done nothing to paint yourself or your husband well. Even advertising you're a Civil Servant but have a tea-towel that effective slags off the Govt. could probably be considered against civil service codes on impartiality.

The fact is, the company clearly feel they have a strong enough case against him for it to be raised and probably wan't to get rid of him given he has form.

Sorry OP but if I were you, I would expect and prepare for the worst. People have been dismissed for less.

Hopefully this will be a lesson for all on social media; don't have it if you aren't prepared for the consequences.

In this thread you have done nothing to paint yourself or your husband well. Even advertising you're a Civil Servant but have a tea-towel that effective slags off the Govt. could probably be considered against civil service codes on impartiality

Seriously?

@Lookingforwardto2021

“But actually yes, an employee brawling in a bar or the streets in their own time could lead to disciplinary in the workplace if there is a link back to them. ”

Do you have examples of this?

And what do you mean by a ‘link back’, eg someone recognised that it was John from payroll at company Uptight?

Yes obviously I have examples of this. Nothing I am going to share on an Internet forum though. And yes, I did mean that perhaps somebody would link back to John at company Uptight. Company Uptight would not appreciate their employee John behaving inappropriately and bringing them into disrepute.

I’m sorry OP. I’m sure your husband is mortified. Of course it’s not good to be calling people names on social media but I’m sure he feels absolutely awful about it now. I agree with the strategy already suggested - apologise profusely and say he won’t do it again. I’ve had some involvement in a case like this before and after seeing the fallout I will no longer write anything that I wouldn’t be comfortable with somebody reading back to me in front of others.

@BelgianFudge

That's interesting. But it could therefore also be argued that him being an arsehole on Twitter about people who don't hold that same belief is him harrassing their philosophical belief.

I would think the Twitter bargie is two private individuals arguing in their private time in a private space (as it is their personal Twitter accounts).

His employer calling this gross misconduct is subject to legal scrutiny.

Eg., if I am a devout Christian and I tell some random person on my private twitter that they will burn in hell for being a non- believer. Can my employer use this as a gross misconduct?

If I am vegan and tell someone on my private Twitter in my private time that I think people who hunt animals for pleasure are murdering cunts. Can my employer call that gross misconduct?

Has he been invited to an investigation meeting or to a gross misconduct hearing op?

Has DH brought up his mental health issues with the investigator, they might use this as mitigating circumstances

It's the "aggressive...sweary....dickhead" bit which is getting him into trouble. I don't really think his political opinion comes into it. It's that which is bringing the company into disrepute. He's not being respectable of other people's opinions or political beliefs.

What was on his old Twitter account out of interest???🤔🤔🤔

To be honest if I had a colleague who was aggressively mouthing off about politics and especially being rude about those who hold the opposite political view then I wouldn't be impressed either. (On the point of Brexit the Remain view was the the MINORITY after all!!)

There are ways of expressing yourself and putting a mature argument across....and then it seems there is your husband......

Don’t disappear down the rabbit hole of philosophical beliefs and protected characteristics.

If it were my DH I’d get him to give himself a bloody good talking to write a letter of apology. I wouldn’t save it for the meetings. The company want to know that he knows he’s been an idiot and they want to be 100% sure he’s not going to do it again.

Sometimes it comes down to: do you want to be right, or do you want to keep your job?

Op is your husband proactively also looking into his situation?

How did they get hold of the old Twitter though? Trumps account has been banned and I can’t see any of his old posts. (I only searched him off the back of this thread!)

Did they already have the information? Before it was banned?

Has he been invited to an investigation meeting or to a gross misconduct hearing op?

Hes had the investigation meeting, now he's been invited to a disciplinary hearing where they said they may consider gross misconduct.

Has DH brought up his mental health issues with the investigator, they might use this as mitigating circumstances

No he hasn't. He has told them he is suffering stress due to personal circumstances which they are aware of. His line manager wasnt entirely honest about this in his interview where he said he thought that personal problem was resolved. DH emailed him about it recently - he should be aware.