Why are we ashamed of our children?

[Twinklemegan]

Following on from the Sralan's childcare questions thread, why do we feel the need to brush our children under the carpet? Why are we afraid of being questioned about our childcare arrangements, answering honestly and facing the consequences? Don't you think it's time that we stopped being so apologetic? Any good employer knows that a good employee will not let his/her home life interfere unnecessarily with his/her work. But similarly, any good employer accepts that there are times when family life has to come first and trusts their employees not to take advantage. That is my experience in any case.

I have never brushed my child under the carpet, far from it I twitter on about her all the time and she is always sat with me at the end of the day while I catch up. I still have a very successfuo career, recently been promoted to the management team but maybe education is more enlightened

I'm glad it's not me Twinset. It annoys me when I see women feeling they have to be so defensive and being afraid to discuss or be asked questions about their children. My rule at work is simple, I am me - a mother - within and outside the workplace. Take it or leave it. I do a good job, so they take it.

Glad it's not just me, I meant.

I certainly dont. I arrive at 9.30 after dropping her off, I have a lovely pic on my desk and she comes first
I had a last mintue hospital appointment for her at the same time as a meeting. My answer, was go to appointment with DD.My boss didnt have any problem wit it.
I guess im lucky
L

I am not ashamed of my child.

But by equal measure, if you want to seek out a job I think it is only basic courtesy to have thought through your childcare arrangements. And also have very loose sick child arrangements in place.

IMO it is just a professional courtesy.

Oh I agree absolutely Bree. If I was employing someone (like Katie for example) I would be very suspicious if they hadn't thought it through, and I would certainly feel entitled to ask. It's the attitude that an employer has no right to ask these things that I find hard to understand. If you're honest and hardworking why should there be anything to worry about?

tm I am neither ashamed of my children nor apologetic about them nor defensive. to be honest I think you are missing the point - the point is not about children - it's about discrimination. it's about the assumption that children only affect women. It's not about an employer's right to ask - it's about employers thinking they have a right to only ask women.

I think you have it back to front twinkle.

Employers seem to think that children are a negative point against employing women.

I'm not missing any point - I'm having a discussion. I couldn't care less if I'm asked and a man isn't, as long as my honest answer is given the fair consideration it deserves. Although I'm a WOHM, and my DH is actually a SAHD, we both still consider me to be the main carer. I just think women should get over themselves and accept that there are some differences between women and men in the workplace. Like I said a good employer will employ a good employee regardless.

Well you see that's just not my experience VVVQV, even though I am the only one in my team with children. I'm good at my job and I have been open and honest and worked with my employer the whole way through. I have even got permission to work from home one day a week in order to take care of my DS (against all advice from MNs I might add). But I think the defensive, litigious attitude of many women would put me off as an employer I have to say.

But why on earth should there be differences between men and women. Differences between parents and non parents yes, or differences between people who care for elderly relatives and those who don't yes, but not between men and women. the attitude that children are a womans responsibility, even when both parents work, is why there is so much inequality in the workplace.

Well for me, I do consider my DS to be primarily my responsibility. That doesn't stop just because I work full time and I wouldn't wish it to. And I want to make damned sure that my employer knows that too.

"It's the attitude that an employer has no right to ask these things that I find hard to understand" - if that was meant to reflect my point then you did misunderstand it. I didn;t say employers have no right to ask. I said they should not be asking only women.

Twinkle - it is very much my experience. In fact, I went to tribunal for it.

I worked for a HUGE multinational company and they tried to cover it up all the way to the top. It' incredibly common, and you are incredibly lucky.

geniune question tm - why do you consider ds to be primarliy your responsibility? I honestly don;t think I know any women who would say that. apart from those for whom this is de facto the case because they are single.

Why not? And why do you care if you can answer the question to the employer's satisfaction? I am proud to be responsible for my DS, I am proud to be a mother and I want my employer to recognise it. I would be more worried from the point of view of men who feel the way I do, that perhaps their needs might not be accommodated in the same way. I agree there could be a problem there.

VVVQV - I'm starting to realise it. It might just be the only good thing about my employer (and it's the only reason I'm still there believe me).

Because I was desperate to be a mother for 4 years before DS came along and, if I was religious, I would thank god every day for finally giving me the chance. So I never ever stop thinking of myself as a mother first and foremost. I guess I'm a little old-fashioned - my mum was a SAHM and definitely took most of the responsibility for us, so that's the way I think as well. I am a WOHM out of necessity not out of choice, although I do enjoy the job. I think I'm a bit of an earth mother at heart.

sorry tm - don't want it to "kick off". we really are coming from different directions here - and I am interested - though honestly quite shocked! I too am proud to be a mum, of course I am. But I pasionately wish that I lived in a society where parenting was much more equally spread. I know it's better now than when we were kids, but there's still a long way to go and I hope desperately for improvements when dds are grown up

do you want to swap? I can have my glittering career instead of bimbling along 3 days a week and you can come and be earth mother?

I didn't mean kick off. Should have said get interesting.
I think I feel a little vulnerable being a reluctant WOHM. If my DS was ill I want to take care of him and would take leave, paid or unpaid, to do it. I go in my own time to take him to the doctors. I would hate to leave all these things to DH much as I love and trust him. And when someone pointed out to me on here that if DH and I split up, DH may well get custody if he wanted it, I nearly died of shock and terror.

I have to go to bed! night night

I suppose my point is really that, instead of trying in vain to argue for equality, we should perhaps be arguing that we are different but just as good. Being upfront is the best way to deal with these issues IMO (although I accept that it still isn't possible). I would be much more worried NOT to be asked about my childcare arrangements in case assumptions were made which weren't true.

Me too hatwoman. I might bump this tomorrow because I'm interested in others' experiences. Night!

YOu see Tm I completely agree about different but just as good - I just don't see that childcare past the age of stopping bfeeding is one of the areas where we have to be different. And please don't think I'm getting at your choice here - I think every woman should be able to decide that they want to be the main carer, but it should not be presumed that every woman wants to be, and the choice of some women to not be should not be discredited. And by making childcare responsibilities a womans issue, we do disadvantage those woman who want to be a parent, but not necessarily take on the hands on parenting role themsleves. We also take away the opportunity from men who would like more equality in parenting