F*****g Goverment! Im so upset - I dont know what to do

[MammyShirl]

I just called Inland Revenue and they said we are not entitled to any help with childcare so basically I can't afford to work and I cant afford to not work. I don?t understand this government, they don?t seem to want to help people who want to help themselves. They just waste money on no-hopers!

I might as well chuck my boyfriend out, leave my job and say I'm homeless to get any help, and on the way damage my leg so I can be registered disabled and get a free car - its sad but true!

So what's next for people who don?t get help with childcare - where do us people who want and need to work stand? Is there no government funded nurseries?

What are my options?

We earn what I consider low wages well under 30k, we are in a lot of debt and just about makes ends meet each month, we dont earn enough to pay our bills we just balance it. i work part time and we need the money. my mother looks fter my dd but is now finding it difficult so i need to get my dd into a nursery, ive been looking for a couple of weeks and yesterday, trailed arouns chiswick/acton from 10 - 5pm, i was so tired, they are so expensive and i really stupidly thought we would get some help with the costs - but no! nothing! so what do i do now, we cant live on my dh wages, we cant afford to pay the nursery costs as it costs two thirds of my monthly wage. i am desperate, what the f* is this goverment up to. when i lived in australua they really take care of you, their money is well spent and not wasted on no-hopers like it is here. im sorry but i cant express or say what i really want to say as i will come across arrogant and racist which im not im just saying what is true! the goverment needs to start taking care and putting people first who want to help themselves, they really do have their priorities wrong.

im so anrgy and i feel so low, my debts feel like a ton of bricks on my shoulders, i work hard and always have, i dont spend much, i dont have much. i pay rent, my bills and ive worked since 14, i see people from school living in nicely decorated houses, do they work? - no! they get all because they can, because they choose to cheat the system, but who is they clever one? not me the mug! i should learn a lesson from them that i cant fight this system i should just join it or suffer in silence as no-one wants to hear from me unless im disabled, homless, single or a refugee. sure they need help but what about all the falling people around them, soon we will be in the same boat as homeless people an dthen they will have to help me and it would cost alot more then it would if they just gave me some f help now so i can look afte rmy family.

i just want to screaaaaaaaaaaaaam!

sorry if i offend anyone but we should be allowed to say what we feel, i dont hate anyone just the goverment.

M2T - I'm sure you are right about childcare costs being the big deterrent.

not offended Dinosaur - just very upset....and then angry at such sweeping statements from someone who posted that Mammyshirls comment "no-hopers" was inflammatry - a comment I agreed with - but her little piece of prose was also inflammatry and biggoted.

Not being a regular I didn't expect such an "attack"

M2T - i have to pay more for childcare. Not that I'm complaining - I know we are very lucky that dp and I ean what would be considered an enormous amount compared to others, but to enable us to live near enough to our office to have a reasonable commute and therefore time with dd we have to own a fairly bog standard 2 bed flat which is valued at £350k (thankfully we bought it in the middle of the last downturn so the mortgage is manageable), and I pay £1,145 per month for the only nursery that is close enough to be convienient. I (quite rightly) qualify for no help with childcare costs, but this does mean that it is just not practical for me to continue working after this baby. So the country will not only lose my vast expertise and brilliance , but also the considerable amount of tax that I currently pay

Won't someone else just pay that tax?

lol Prufrock - It is all relative though. Our Ex-council 2 bedroomed semi-detached with driveway and garage is only valued at £50k!... which is £15k more than we paid for it. We were lucky in the fact that moving nearer to work for me meant moving to a lower priced area. Not now though coz I've changed jobs, but until this little working class miners village suddenly becomes a sought after area to live our house prices will stay low. Great for 1st time buyers like we were though..... gets you on the property market.

Well, I'm sure Aloha doesn't need me to defend her, but I do think that she was making a fair point - however I don't think she was aiming it specifically at anyone who has posted on this thread - so I don't think there is any need to be upset.

But I do agree with the general point that I think she was making, which is (I think) that it is all too easy to let one's needs expand until they magically mop up all available cash! I certainly find this anyway...and that's without paying for childcare of private education (although we were paying nursery fees for DS1 until the end of last term, and DS2 should get a nursery place this term, so we will be paying for that too).

lol Tinker - I hadn't thought of that - I was assuming I am irreplaceable.
But if I saty at home and look after my own kids, my nursery will earn less, and employ less people (if wnough people do the same as me) who will then pay less tax. C'mon there has to be some revenue raising reason behind the governments encouragement of working mothers.

I too agree with that point. In fact my opinion on mammyshirl's original post was that it was her debts not her income that was causing her a problem.

But I do disagree with you - I was the only one to mention PE - and I'm sorry but the tone of her prose is sarcastic and inflammatory.AND talk about taring all with the same brush!!

Sonnett - I too feel that Aloha's post was general and not directed at you in particular. She mentioned housing/area and type of car which were not included in your post. Sorry that you are upset. Am now feeling guilty at mentioning Twinkie's income in my post. Sorry Twinkie (altho' think you've gone now) it was meant to be directed at you - was just using your figures as an example.

Oh dear. Dinosaur is quite right and makes my point for me beautifully. I certainly wasn't aiming my comments at anyone and I'm sorry Sonnet that you are so upset. However, I certainly don't think it is inflammatory or bigoted to say that if someone has a huge income but no money they must be spending it on something and even those on this thread earning very little admit that if they earned more they would spend more. I would (and do) find it hard to cut down on my outgoings and I know there are people out there who think we live very well - so do I, so I am not setting myself up as Mrs Thriftyier-Than-Thou. I didn't even claim the tax benefit partly because I don't think we'd get it - I think we prob earn around the threshold between us TBH. But the truth is private education is very expensive. If it is a choice you make then you will, of course, have less money than someone who choses state education - I live in Southwark BTW and my ds goes to a private nursery as there aren't any others and I really like it. I'm not judging on moral grounds. I was actually thinking it was a shame that you wanted another child and it was sad for for you not to have it just for financial reasons. It just seems a pity to me. However, I'm not a puritan about money, far from it, and even I feel a bit ashamed of our ancient and battered car next to the glossy people carriers and Mercs outside my stepdaughter's private school God knows what they all earn. I bet £90K would be pocket money to most of them!

Er, no Sonnet. It wasn't sarcastic. Maybe a bit rueful because I think it's true, nobody ever thinks they are rich and it's certainly a rare person who thinks they have enough money. I feel sulky because we can't really afford to convert our cellar into a spare room and home office but I know I'm not really poor.

hi just to add my 2c - £26k may be the national average income, but it is frankly daft to talk about an average income when regional costs (mainly housing of course) vary so much. I'll eat my hat if £26k isn't below the average for London, and I'm damn sure it's less than the average for chiswick!

Ah Chiswick...My friend lives there in a stonking great 5 bed house worth over £1mil. Very grand, like a 5star hotel. She's lovely but boy does she make me feel poor.

lol, aloha, you're right no-one ever thinks they're rich but frequently think other people are! just ask people who are in favour of a "super-tax" where they think the threshold should be...

lol bossykate

well in excess of what I earn, obviously!

yes, dino, it always is, it always is - no matter whom you ask!

Seriously, though, when you work with people who earn 800-900k a year, then you do tend to view your own salary as rather modest.

I think my dh's ex's new husband (how modern!) prob earns at least that - prob more. They have £2mil+ house in London, 4 kids in private education, 2 new Mercs, fulltime housekeeper, pt nanny, gardeners, cleaners, private tuition in all sorts, expensive hols, weekends away etc etc, and she's still after dh like a rottweiler for more money so I suppose even they think they aren't well off...

Hey Bossykate, you know how I like a challenge...

I happen to have a copy of the 2002 New Earnings Survey to hand so covers period 2001-2002, only a little out of date... and it says...£34,762 within London is 'average' gross annual for full time workers so you were right. Only £26,449 for rest of South East, though.

No clue where Chiswick is... but maybe you can find it looking at the "Wealth of the Nation Survey Summary Report 2003", 1st 'brochure' listed on CACI website . The brochure goes into a lot of detail about salary to housing costs across England & Wales, too.

Blimey Aloha!

I don;t think I'm poor, I accept I'm lucky and I would agree that rich people don't think themselves rich. I don't believe in my post that I indicated I thought I was poor
Yes, we did make the choice and yes we gladly plan our financies accordingly.We wouldn't have dreamed of starting on this if we hadn't planned it through the next 18 years and beyond and yes, I could have a baby tommorrow if I took our DD1 out of school and stopped DD2 going in September. BUT I cannot do that to DD1 - she is so happy, loves school, has some great friends and has fantastic teachers that she thinks the world of - added to that guilt is the fact that we live in a shocking LEA and I was not happy at all with the three promary schools in our locality - how could I live with the guilt just to fulfill my selfish desire to have another child.
Where my DD goes to school £90k would not be considered pocket money. The majority of families at DD's school are 2 income families, like us who having chosen the PE route make sacrifices to do so. It is obviously very different from you step daughters school....so please belive me when I say "we" are not alll the same and P.Schools are not all the same. Your "battered car" would not be out of place - believe me!!

Well there you go Aloha - that's where you get you opinion from....and your DH contributing to it too....

afraid it;s way out of my league! - which was why I got frazzled at being tarred with the same brush...

Can I ask which LEA?

We live in Hackney.

We are "rich", we earn a lot of money between us - over £100K a year - but we live in a very good area of London and we pay for a private nanny for our boys ( no day nurseries, no child minders really avaliable ) £2400 a month. We can only afford a two bedroomed flat where we live. We have a good car, holidays etc... but we are time poor so spend far too much on food, clothes etc...

I'm not whingeing - don't think that I deserve help. Only complaint that I pay tax and then pay my nannies tax and national insurance - think I deserve a tax break of some sort.

We want to downsize, move out of London and try and manage on less. Very scary, not sure how a lot of people that I read on Mumsnet survive on the amount of money that they have. So respect and I hope to soon have the guts to try and survive on less.