I consider myself a feminist...and a housewife.

[darcymum]

I don't want a job, I just want to stay home look after my children and cook nice dinners. I dread the day my youngest goes to school as I know I will have to get a job. DH goes to work I do most of the house work... I like it that way. I am not a surrendered wife, my husband doesn't tell me what to do.

And yet I consider myself a feminist, I am a feminist, and am a very strong supporter of women's rights, and men's rights if they want to stay at home and be 'mum' like me.

Am I deluded and oppressed and just don't know it?

"Eh? You mean the 'freedom' to say "I don't want a job"? That's not choice, that's laziness"

Eh? you mean looking after kids is not a full-time job in itself? Not more demanding than most other jobs that exist? Oh yeah, its unpaid. Can't be a job then, can it.
FFS
Let's ask ourselves why this work is still unpaid in the 21st century.

Yes, absolutely there has been a move that way. Various second wavers have done huge amounts of research into how much a SAHM/housewife would earn if her jobs were priced on the open market; childminder + housekeeper + chef + nurse etc.

And of course, it's feminists who have fought for paid maternity leave, female custodial rights (it used to be that the man automatically got custody of the children, I assume everyone knows that), the Married Women's Property Act and related legislation that meant a woman didn't give up her legal autonomy and property on marriage (married women didn't use to be able to enter into contracts for debt, for example), legislation that allows us to breastfeed in public (don't know if that exists yet in England but it does here in Australia, and in Scotland), access to maternity services, etc.

All things that support women to run a household and care for children.

Sakura - who should pay for this then?

And those who work still have to look after their children, and do all that housewifey stuff, too, after getting home from their jobs.

"Various second wavers have done huge amounts of research into how much a SAHM/housewife would earn if her jobs were priced on the open market; childminder + housekeeper + chef + nurse etc."

Is that the same guff which concludes that doing the grocery shopping is equal to being a buyer? FFS

Some women are more equal than others?

Are you referring to a particular study?

I think it's perfectly reasonable to point out that the unpaid work of society is disproportionately done by women, that some of it is quite skiled, and that if women didn't do it unpaid, someone would indeed have to pay for it.

Just as I pay for someone to look after my child while I'm at work.

I'm a feminist who has been a WOHM, a SAHM and am now a WAHM. My politics did not change as my lifestyle/role changed.

What did change was that I realised that things are a lot more complicated for women then I naively thought in my childless 20s.

Before having children I thought I was living a pretty equal experience and saw my opportunities as being the same as DH.

Then we had children and I was hit by the fact that it is still really difficult for women to achieve equality and be mothers at the same time in a patriarchal society and that most men do not face the same dilemmas.

So you do what you have to do to 'thrive in the patriarchy' as tortoise puts it.

I have managed to wangle things so that I work for myself as it is the only way for me to combine what I want from my work with what I want for my children and need for my finances. This solution which we are told is 'having it all' is really just 'doing it all'.

I think it is perfectly possible to be a feminist and a housewife just as it is possible to work and not be a feminist. If a women is in an equal partnership with her DH and she has as much control over shared finances as he does whether she works or not does not define her politics IMO. That women are influenced to not work and men are influenced to not SAH with children is part of the structure of the patriarchy however.

I think as the feminist movement has progressed (which has brought us too many benefits to list) the role of wife and mother has lost some of the respect it once had. If you are a SAHM it is as if you have failed in some way and are not good enough to have a high flighting career. I have never had a job I could even describe as a career, a poster earlier called me lazy, and I have to confess I am a bit, but as somebody else pointed out that's not incompatible with feminism.

I think equal pay is a big issue but I don't think the fact that women earn less is fykwlm. I have female friends who work in the city in very senior positions, have never had a break and a bet probably earn less than male equivalents. The fact that dinner ladies earn less the man who paint lines on the road, need to be challenged and changed. But the fact that overall women earn less than men because careers have not advanced due to working part time or taking time off to have children I dont think is a problem I think we just have a more balanced way of living our lives. Money isn't everything. If a woman takes out, say five years, I have no problem if she is then five years behind in career progression (assuming shes the sort of woman who wants a career rather than just a job) as long as it is only five years behind not more.

A big issue for me at the moment is actually mens rights. I would like to see men have equal rights, and be respected, for staying at home to look after children. If maternity leave could be shared for instance, You get one year off after the birth of a child but either partner could take it.

I also have to admit I am not a campaigner, I do just cheer from the side. I did go on the reclaim the streets march recently though and have started a one man campaign to change the law on something. The link to the petition is below if anyone wants to sign it. Please sign.

petitions.number10.gov.uk/Childlands/

Although we have so much to thank feminism and the women who lead the way, for I also think it has closed some doors for us. Women used to be 'trapped' in the home now we are 'trapped' in the workplace, although I think the relentless consumerism of todays society has as much to answer for this.

I would like to know what a careers adviser in a school would say to a 15 year old girl (or boy) who said she didn't want a job she wanted to get married have children and stay at home to look after them.

"but she isn't just limited to being a mother in the home if she wants more"

Diffrent, not more, this implies going to work is better in some way than staying a home.

I would class my mother as a feministy, despite having put her career on hold to look after my sister and I. She was a firm believer that my sister and I should be able to follow whatever path we wanted to in life, with no limitations. She and my father instilled in me detemination and self-belief...to the point that even as a young adult I didn't really understand the concept of women being seen as second class citizens etc in the workplace...because I have never experienced or seen it. My sister now works at a high level in a very male dominated inductry, and I had a very high powered career before switching to what I do now. Obviously I know it is a problem now that I'm older, but I still haven't experienced it.

However, when our first child comes along in the summer I will be staying at home...for at least a few years but timings undefined as yet. I don't feel this makes me less 'feminist' in my attitudes. I am choosing to ctay at home, my husband doesn't mind either way. He agrees with my decision whole-heartedly, but would do so were I to go to work. I don't think not wanting a job (when not financially necessary makes a person lazy. There is far more to life than wage slave work!

"My sister now works at a high level in a very male dominated inductry, and I had a very high powered career before switching to what I do now."

It would be interesting to know if you and your sister are both paid as much as male counterparts.

I'm a feminist.

I've been SAHM, worked part-time, freelanced and worked full time (crazy hours, weekends etc) since having children. Nothing is ever ideal.

Staying at home was the least ideal, though. My DH is a fabulous and fair man who was happy to take a 'what's mine is yours' approach, yet I still loathed the idea of being financially dependent on a man. How can anyone bear it in the long term? It is just anathaema to me as a feminist. That was the crux of the matter for me. Work = financial independence = being a truly free and adult in this big bad world. Anything else is misery to me.

For me, being a feminist doesn't depend on what you do, it depends on what you believe. It comes down to believing that men and women should be treated equally in every respect (barring the very small amount of different treatment necessitated by our different bodies).

Choosing to be a SAHM /housewife/whatever, is still completely compatible with this belief.

It is only a "non feminist" choice if you have made that choice for "non feminist" reasons - for example because you believe that "a woman's place is in the home" or "women are always better at housework and childcare than men are" or other such rubbish.

Ask yourself: Would you have been happy, in principle (leaving aside issues like different pay), for your husband to stay at home while you went out to work? If not - you are probably not a feminist.

Yes, we were/are. Hard to tell with my career as I would be the only person in the company with my role, if you see what I mean. But the role I had prior to my last was in a big firm within which there were scales...regardless of gender there were set things you needed to do to move up scales.

Now I'm a teacher I am on pay scales again. Yes, there will be men earning more but they will have taken more responsibility...I have enough on my plate walking from one side of school to the other without worrying about that at the moment!

As for my sister, she is an officer on a cruise ship. One of only 3 females of an intake of over 200 on her apprenticeship, and very good at what she does. (Put me in charge of a cruise ship I'm not sure what would happen!) All by the age of 26. Yes, I'm sure there have been times that she struggled during her training, I know she found it hard being the odd one out...but she is certainly paid the same. As far as I understand it there are pay rgades according to stripes earned. My father was a pilot and despite being a very 'old-fashioned' man in a very traditional, patriachal male role he was very keen for her to follow in his footsteps and has been pivotal in helping her. In his eyes there are no jobs that are male/female etc. So I guess maybe he isn't that old-fashioned at all!

My husband is a blend as well I think. He was brought up in a family with a SAHM as I was, and does genuinely feel the need to be able to provide for his family. But he does that for himself, as against me if you see what I mean. When we met I was far outearning him, we have swapped around a few times since and are now pretty equal as he is retraining. He wouldn't feel the need to play a part in my deciding whether or not to work after this one is born, bar the usual discussions on how we want our children raised. If I went back to work we would both bear responsibility for our child. He does more around the house, my main responsibility is ordering the online supermarket deliveries...mainly because I quite enjoy it. He is a far better cook than me, and does more than his share of housework. We have joint finances, and when I sotp work altogether all money will go into the joint account. We chare all decisions, despite the fact that all large lump sums of money are his. I think we're pretty equal in all things.

Bit of a ramble so will stop now. I have also noticed the number of typos in my earlier post.

I disagree with paternal leave in the first year being given to wither parent.
Bet SMA are rubbing their hands in anticipation at this concept.

Sorry, that should say 'parental leave being given to either parent'.

No absolutely, I think fathers should be able to have as much input as the family wants. They just haven't got breasts.

I feel tired at the thought of getting in to this one again but can someone Purleeeese tell me what the 'O' stands for in WOHM??!!! Ive been asking for months

Also; where is Zenia when you need her?

the O stands for 'outside' as in Working Outside the Home.

I'm sure Xenia will be along soon to tell the OP she's 'silly' etc etc etc