Can you be a fully trans inclusive feminist?

[Imdunfer]

Inspired from another thread where it was out of place so I brought it here.

Someone seemed to claim that it was possible to be both be a feminist and to be trans inclusive, where by trans inclusive they mean males in women's spaces and shortlists (the attitude to sport wasn't stated).

I don't believe that you can truly be both, do you?

I don’t want to be rude, but is this an issue of reading comprehension? I do not believe that “gender” is distinct from biological sex. I do not consider “gender identity” as meaningful in any other way than being a personality label. Sex is “biosex”, there is no other type of sex than biological sex. Gender critical feminists are critical of the entire stereotype-based and oppressive edifice of “gender” in all its forms.

So if you include TIM in your feminism, I have a question. If there is a TIM who wants access to a women’s only rape crisis centre, but his presence will traumatise the women in that place, whose rights and needs should be met?

Yes it does. But still we persevere.

No. I don't find women's and girls' rights boring.

I do like groundhog day though. Good film.

First film I went on a date to as a teenager!

The fact that women’s biology has been misunderstood and used against them, does not mean that women’s biology is not fundamental in how they have been oppressed historically

Exactly, perfectly put, more patience than me!

Men's mental health is absolutely a feminist issue. Feminism is about identifying and calling out the patriarchy, and the patriarchy plays a huge role in causing mens mental health struggle , it's mostly feminists who even recognise the patriarchy as a thing in the first place.

I never said it was the issue or that it should overshadow the ones that directly affect women. But the comment I replied to said anything to do with men isn't feminism, and that's just not correct.

OpenAI are going to be all over that detail 👀

Feminism is the rights movement for female people. I don’t agree that it’s feminism’s job to advocate for men. They can do their own advocacy, they have more societal standing. It’s a case of everything being women’s job, isn’t it?

Probably 🤷🏻‍♀️

Men say women cant do x/have to do y because of their biology.

Men say they are women because they choose not to do x or choose to do y.

Both men are imposing gender onto women.

Come again?

No. They may CALL it feminism, but it's not. Feminism doesn't include men. How could it?

No. Any women that agree that men should be included in women's spaces etc are brainwashed by the patriarchy.

Why do men need feminism to focus on men?

Men’s mental health is about men. That’s for men to address. Unless you think a woman’s job is to sort out the whole world for low pay.

Feminism is about female people’s rights, health and lives. The clue is in the name.

It is not a movement set up to sort out everyone else’s problems as well. It’s not simply a generic “be nice and kind” movement.

To identify patriarchy and its impact on these things.

Men can do that

Isn't it a little disrespectful to assume that men can't fix their own problems?

They can. They just won't.

Edited for clarity.

Yes, didn’t say it needed to be women

just needs a feminist and feminist perspective

Women do not need men to identify patriarchy, as women experience its daily impacts, cultural norms, and structural inequalities firsthand.

Why does a group on Facebook matter?

Do you waste time worrying about what people you don’t even know think about you?

This really is all a bit school playground mean girls stuff. “They don’t like you ner ner.”

We’re not at school any more.

I

Ah, I see!!!
So are you saying—it was SOCIETY that decided women were destined to bear children and feed them from their own bodies, and deal with all the physiological and physical constraints that result from that, not chromosomes! ?

Thanks so much for pointing that out.

I disagree.