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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Is being trans a 'disease'/mental health issue?

1000 replies

SolveMyPrombles · 26/06/2026 20:05

I'm asking on this board for deliberate considered responses so please do share your thoughts.

A lady on a local group has described being trans as a mental illness that should be treated with compassion not pandered to because it's a disease.

Looking into it more deeply I believe she's wrong and there is no current diagnostic manual that agrees with her take.

What do you think?

OP posts:
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12
ScrollingLeaves · 28/06/2026 19:54

@Zoonosis
Nor have any efforts to "cure" trans people apart from allowing them to transition ever been successful or caused anything other than harm and distress.

The majority of children who think they are trans, who say they they are trans, but who are left alone - not affirmed, not given puberty blockers - do desist by the time they are out of puberty. They ‘cure’ themselves you could say, except that would be the wrong word.

Please link to peer reviewed brain imaging and accompanying articles showing transpeople's brains? Be sure to include differential diagnosis from being gay, or from the effects of hormones and other medical treatments. I hope a scientist will come and read and comment.

ThatZanyFatball · 28/06/2026 22:25

Octavia64 · 27/06/2026 20:15

Well there were two options amputation and metal foot or try to recover motor function and sensation in my foot

i went for trying to recover motor and sensation although I do sometimes regret it as the main sensation is pain.

i do have much better ability to walk than of the foot was amputated though,

I’m not sure how or why you are linking this to conversion therapy?

Well you're the one who brought up your mental foot issue on a board where trans ideology is debated. So you do understand are the one making the comparison here?? Sounds to me the mental therapy you decided to do was a much better choice than severe and unnecessary surgery to remove a perfectly healthy body part. Wondering why you think the same wouldn't work for a person - especially a child - who's brain (or the internet has tricked their brain) is telling them to remove perfectly healthy breasts or mutilate their genitals. And also wondering why people like you are against said people and children receiving similar compassionate talk therapy to help them develop a healthy relationship with their beautiful natural healthy bodies. It worked for you.

Baileyonice · 28/06/2026 23:14

noblegiraffe · 28/06/2026 12:03

You agreed that non-binary didn't have cross-cultural acceptance. It is therefore not broadly accepted. It is not, for example, recognised in law in the UK.

I'm assuming that your definition of 'broadly accepted' however will be 'just enough acceptance for me to say non-binary is a valid gender'.

No I didn't & you can't show where I did. What I mean by cultural acceptance is meaning. The term non binary is broadly understood.

Baileyonice · 28/06/2026 23:15

Theunchosenone · 28/06/2026 12:08

Isn’t that trans activists claiming men and women are totally the same and interchangeable? I mean, if enough males have “feminine” characteristics, at what point do those characteristics no longer become “feminine” but masculine?

Self identification means its upto the individual's values & belief system.

Baileyonice · 28/06/2026 23:26

Shortshriftandlethal · 28/06/2026 12:13

'Man' and 'woman' are perfectly fine for identifying who belongs to which sex category - if they weren't why would the terms need to be appropriated by transgender ideology?

If 'male' and 'female' were truly interchangeable nobody would need to transition would they?. Ultimately, there is no getting around the body and its deeper and wider implications - no matter how we'd like to.

'Man' and 'woman' are perfectly fine for identifying who belongs to which sex category - if they weren't why would the terms need to be appropriated by transgender ideology?

There's thing called a 'prefix' that distinguishes words & for trans people its 'trans' & 'cis'. Of course that's not enough for those obsessed with territorial word ownership.

If 'male' and 'female' were truly interchangeable nobody would need to transition would they?. Ultimately, there is no getting around the body and its deeper and wider implications - no matter how we'd like to.

You could say the same about women who adopt a butch presentation. The answer is they like trans people are just expressing their personal inclinations towards an aesthetic.

Of course a woman expressing gender non conformity is totally acceptable & 'within the realm of female expression' according to GC doctrine but a man? Not so much. He would is instantly labelled a deluded 'cross dresser sex pest' by them….& society So don't gimme that 'no need to transition' hypocrisy.

noblegiraffe · 28/06/2026 23:27

Baileyonice · 28/06/2026 23:14

No I didn't & you can't show where I did. What I mean by cultural acceptance is meaning. The term non binary is broadly understood.

You said "When we talk about 'cross cultural' we have take into account some societies don't allow free expression or are culturally constrained & as such we don't know whether such identities exist there."

So non-binary doesn't have cross-cultural acceptance. You're trying to handwave that away as those places having cultural issues, but you're basically agreeing that it doesn't.

You've said yourself that the idea of gender is a social construct but now you're saying that these identities exist independently of the society they are in? If they are not accepted by a particular culture, it's because they haven't constructed them?

Yet, you have dismissed 'two spirit' as a gender because it doesn't have cross cultural acceptance.

How do you know that our society is not merely 'culturally constrained' in a manner that means that two-spirit people cannot freely express themselves and you don't know whether such identities exist here?

You're not being very consistent here. Why is that? It's like you're making it up as you go along.

As for non-binary being broadly understood - have you got evidence for that assertion?

murasaki · 28/06/2026 23:29

It's broadly understood in as far as find a bloody good reason not to hire this person as they'll be an HR nightmare....

noblegiraffe · 28/06/2026 23:29

Baileyonice · 28/06/2026 23:15

Self identification means its upto the individual's values & belief system.

I thought it was socially constructed and meaningful and now it's entirely subjective?

Cattywillow · 28/06/2026 23:31

AnonyMumAuDHD · 28/06/2026 15:07

Like many, I have found myself pondering @SolveMyPrombles OP. Partly due to the heat. But actually I have been grappling with it for nearly 10 years in fact, as I tried to support my DC. Some posters and lurkers here will recognise me despite a recent name change.

Because I have only ever seen the distress, the angst, the anger my child feels. Mainly at how women are perceived, at how she felt starting her menses - during the Weinstein trial and Trump’s grab ‘em by the pussy’ tapes and the height of the MeToo movement that confirmed that women are vulnerable and men have all the power. I understood that periods are shit if you start them relatively early, that the hormones and emotional turbulence they bring are difficult to navigate, especially if you have an as yet undiagnosed ND condition - or more than one. But she didn’t.

For much of this time I thought it was an extreme reaction to societal pressures and that she would find her way, come to terms with it. But the self-harming, the suicidal ideation, the actual (admittedly feeble) attempts at suicide spoke of something deeper. I then spent years thinking it was my and DH’s fault. Was he too masc? He has a corporate job, is often away with work, is sporty and happiest with the trad-male household jobs that his dad and grandfather taught him (plumbing, gardening, wiring). I wondered whether she was starved of his attention when home because he sort of relates to our son a little more easily. I wondered whether I had contributed to a toxic home environment that affirmed genders - I am SAHP because we have no local family to support and returning to my corporate pre baby job would mean nannies, staff and I hadn’t wanted that for my kids. Did she look at me and see an ultra femme and weak parent? Was I to blame for telegraphing and affirming toxic gendered stereotypes? I asked myself this over and over.

Except that I know this was not the case. My DH has lavished time and affection on both kids, encouraged both in STEM and the arts, dedicated his weekends to supporting both. Both were offered the access to the same sports and arts activities. There was no pink or blue to be seen amongst their toys. We let them steer and gently pushed back against sexist, racist and homophobic comments by their friends. DH cooks and does housework. I have worn a dress a dozen times in as many years and as I am as likely to be knee deep in polyfilla, emulsion and white spirit as I am carving my way through a month’s ironing with a bottle of vino and a gruesome crime boxed set. A few weeks ago I had my first ever manicure (BIAB which I have just seriously tested today hand sanding down the wooden kitchen counters and applying Danish oil. Not sure that was the oil I was supposed to drench my cuticles with, but hey, I’ve skinned my knuckles anyway).

When I explained to DD that I did not know what she meant by a gendered soul, many years ago now, because I don’t have a ‘gendered identity’ she said that was ‘very terfy of you mum’. But the thing is, I don’t - I was adopted into an apparently liberal Iranian muslim family where there were nonethless very clear expectations for women and girls. Women gave up their seats for male relatives of any age, even if there were 4 sofas and only one female person seated. Women ate after men had been served. Once I hit puberty my dad had very clear and strict ideas on how I could dress and the fact that it was MY responsibility to ensure I did not excite the sexual attention of men. Not theirs. It did mess me up and I, like my mother, had an ED by the time I was at uni, but I was fully recovered by the time I had kids. But did I telegraph my ingrained body shyness or residual issues with food? I’d be naive if I thought DD didn’t pick something up over the years.

I am probably very femme to people looking at me and my life - I sew, craft, play woodwind instruments, am an [feminist] English/creative writing post-grad. I’ve just hand knitted blankets for each of my kids for university, FGS. I desperately wanted kids - but to heal after a dysfunctional childhood, not because I am a ‘woman’. Do I ‘feel’ feminine? No. I just AM a woman. I no more understand what ‘being a woman’ is for other women, than I understand being British, or ND, or white. I only understand what my experience of those things are through the lens that is ‘me’.

So where does that leave us as a family? How can my DD have had such a visceral response to her changing female body? And it was the changing bit that was the issue. She had no issues with being a girl before her periods started and her breast began to bud. I truly do not think she ‘wants to be a man’. She just doesn't want to mature into a woman with a body that feels alien, with a mind/maturity that hasn’t caught up yet, in a world that she is struggling to understand, where the narrative around women is hostile, where toxic masculinity is recognisably an issue within certain demographics. I mean - it’s all a bit shit, isn’t it?

As far as I can see, my DD has never had any trauma other than puberty itself. A puberty she was not quite ready for, that being ND made harder for her to navigate, a puberty that is continually being pathologised by society and which the current social, political and clinical narrative is one where, rather than offer support for young people who are struggling - whether through autism, family trauma, confusion over sexual preference etc - we offer to medicalise it. I think she started as a distressed and confused little girl and society’s response to her distress has damaged her.

So no I don’t think she - or any other ‘trans’ person - has a disease. I think she has a maladaptive and negative reaction to adolescenceand her sexed body that gender ideology has weaponised and used to deeply and utterly harm her. I think she is ‘ill’ but I am constantly hopeful that given time and space - and no conversion therapy legislation or tacit cultural condoning of medicalising adolescence that the PB trial communicates - she and others like her COULD get better. Mental illness doesn’t have to be permanent. It doesn’t have to define a person - but cosmetically altering their bodies or giving them cross-sex hormones which we know do more harm than good, when they are too young to make other life altering decisions alone or unguided by parents - well, this risks trapping them in a mental ill-health cycle for life. I, personally, think that is unconscionable.

Edited

Thank you for sharing this. I am so glad your daughter has you in her corner. I was very distressed by my (precocious) puberty as a tomboy with a brother and mostly male friends. I believe I would absolutely have fallen for this ideology if it had been around then. Instead I lived a fully embodied life thanks to the absence of the internet and after a few years I came to terms with my body and even began to love it. I channeled my outrage at the burdens women have to bear - as a direct result of our biology- into being a feminist. I wish you and your daughter all the very best.

murasaki · 28/06/2026 23:31

Baileyonice · 28/06/2026 23:26

'Man' and 'woman' are perfectly fine for identifying who belongs to which sex category - if they weren't why would the terms need to be appropriated by transgender ideology?

There's thing called a 'prefix' that distinguishes words & for trans people its 'trans' & 'cis'. Of course that's not enough for those obsessed with territorial word ownership.

If 'male' and 'female' were truly interchangeable nobody would need to transition would they?. Ultimately, there is no getting around the body and its deeper and wider implications - no matter how we'd like to.

You could say the same about women who adopt a butch presentation. The answer is they like trans people are just expressing their personal inclinations towards an aesthetic.

Of course a woman expressing gender non conformity is totally acceptable & 'within the realm of female expression' according to GC doctrine but a man? Not so much. He would is instantly labelled a deluded 'cross dresser sex pest' by them….& society So don't gimme that 'no need to transition' hypocrisy.

Not if he stays out of female spaces. He can wear what he likes. It's the people who claim to 'transition' and go into spaces that aren't meant for them that are labelled 'deluded cross dresser sex pests', as you so charmingly put it, and quite reasonably so.

NellieBly · 28/06/2026 23:31

Shortshriftandlethal · 28/06/2026 10:37

You frequently see these sorts of personality quizzes or tests on-line: "Are you an introvert or an extrovert?"."Take this test to see if you have ADHD". " "Are you a pragmatist or an idealist?", and so on. Tick boxes, and lots of labels and new identities to inahbit.

Edited

Yes ... click bait tests ... if you are unwary enough to complete them, the organisation that put them online wants your personal information so they can bombard you with some guff they want to sell you.

I've never come across a test asking which gender I might identify with, though. Perhaps the market for wrong sex hormones is quite limited.

Hedgehogforshort · 28/06/2026 23:37

I really do not understand why people bother engaging with someone who either is using AI to bait.

or quite possibly is an AI bot.

Baileyonice · 28/06/2026 23:39

borntobequiet · 28/06/2026 13:59

You can't have it both ways. Either males & females overlap or they don't AND that was/is the main takeaway that could only legitimise equality.

There’s so much wrong with this on every level that it’s impossible to address.

Many years ago I asked a Maths class, what was the probability of their being seriously injured on their way home from school. 50/50, they replied - either they would or they wouldn’t. After a little while they discovered that in fact, it wasn’t that simple.

And that’s only the start of the faulty reasoning and misinterpretation of language in this post.

Edited

This is about as dumb as it gets particularly because it's been made clear on this thread. No one is suggesting individuals who are not reflective of group differences don't exist.

Again, its as dumb as saying categories like poverty crime demographics can't exist because everyone who is poor doesn't commit a crime.

BlueSherbet · 28/06/2026 23:41

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Titsywoo · 28/06/2026 23:42

My 19 year old son is currently going through this and has told us all he is a transwoman and is on hormones and will have surgery in the next few years. After watching him for the last 2 years of this, quite frankly, hellish situation I can uncategorically say he is seriously very mentally unwell. He is also autistic.

Everyone has a lot of opinions on this and unless you have experienced this with someone close to you it is hard to understand what it is like. For us it has been very upsetting and stressful and we are all still convinced he is going to regret the path he is set on.

Are all transpeople mentally unwell? I have no idea but the ones I have met through my son (all very young people) absolutely are.

There is a very dark side to all of this which we have seen over the last 2 years (due to some snooping) and I am certain there is a huge amount of grooming via the internet.

murasaki · 28/06/2026 23:44

I'm sorry you are all going through this, it sounds very worrying.

MarieDeGournay · 28/06/2026 23:51

Baileyonice You could say the same about women who adopt a butch presentation. The answer is they like trans people are just expressing their personal inclinations towards an aesthetic.

As a matter of fact, I say exactly that about myself - I nicked the phrase 'personal aesthetic' from another poster the other daySmile
I adopt a butch presentation as my personal aesthetic, but I don't think that's the same as trans people - in their case, it's not simply personal, they are also making a very public claim that they somehow become/demand to be treated as/acquire the rights specific to the opposite sex.

It doesn't stay personal, and it goes beyond the aesthetic.

Me? I'm just a woman-loving woman who likes to dress sharply with a butch aesthetic, without making any unscientific and unreasonable claims to be something I'm not.

Baileyonice · 29/06/2026 00:00

Imdunfer · 28/06/2026 14:38

I'll tell you what scientific study I want to see BoI. The one that does an analysis of whether trans people are happier after transition and if not explores exactly why suicide rates and mental health problems remain sky high compared to the population as a whole.

But those studies can't be done because funding is withdrawn every time the trans activists realise what is being proposed.

So the trans movement can conveniently go on ignoring de-transitioners and continue claiming that the reason that trans people are still unhappy after transition is because of how badly society treats them, not because they've found out that transition itself has not solved their mental health problems.

I'll tell you what scientific study I want to see BoI. The one that does an analysis of whether trans people are happier after transition and if not explores exactly why suicide rates and mental health problems remain sky high compared to the population as a whole.

Maybe think of it this way, a woman who has life long depression & anxiety from school bullying or child abuse or social & familial rejection ALSO prefers to have breast implants because of an aesthetic preference. Will this cure her depression & anxiety?

In terms of suicide & mental health risk factors, generally social & familial rejection is a big one. Add to that multiple other risk factors like addiction, homelessness & unemployment which trans people are likely to experience creates an even bigger risk.

Transition/'passing' isn't just about aesthetic preference but an avenue to accelerate social acceptance which reduces social rejection. Just ask a trans woman who clearly can't pass how confident she is about venturing out.

Also the study you maybe referencing (or not) has been criticised for its flawed methodology of comparing the cis population to trans. For the study to be meaningful it needs compare trans people who don't transition against those that do. Experiences of marginalisation by gender minority people may predispose them to poorer mental health outcomes than their cisgender peers so comparing the outcomes between the two groups is erroneous.

So the trans movement can conveniently go on ignoring de-transitioners and continue claiming that the reason that trans people are still unhappy after transition is because of how badly society treats them, not because they've found out that transition itself has not solved their mental health problems.

Detransitioners are presently are comparatively a huge minority group to transition so they hardly qualify as a repudiation of trans people. And studies point to trans people having 1% regret after surgery.

Baileyonice · 29/06/2026 00:07

Helleofabore · 28/06/2026 15:06

Who is trying to convince people that “men & women are exactly the same!

If you are accusing people of wilful misunderstanding and hypocrisy that really is projection from you.

Or … is it that you don’t understand what Greer said and you don’t understand the feminist campaign for equality of opportunity through equitable solutions?

is that it? You thought that women and girls asking to be treated as equals was a blunt and false statement that female people were ‘equal’ meaning there were no differences?

Her statement IS self explanatory about the family dynamics that allowed Jenner to be a successful man in his career. She doesn’t think Jenner is female because he isn’t, and he has benefited in being able to concentrate on his success because he had a wife who took on the role of primary carer. The statistics show that this is a decision that is common in families and often driven by the inequality in pay rates between male and female employees.

Now, not every female person makes those decisions, I have a number of friends where it was the other way around. But it is ridiculous to deny that it is a common decision.

Greer also did not say that if Jenner did take the role of primary carer that Jenner would be a female either. Because that would be another absurd assertion to make.

I think at this stage you are stuck trying to make your personal theories sound plausible. You are heavily invested in trying to find some aspect to leverage some male people into the female sex class.

I understand exactly what she said because I have lived it. But that is irrelevant to my point that Greer implies there is a typical female experience that qualifies people as women which you are conveniently avoiding because you know that spells H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-S-Y.

noblegiraffe · 29/06/2026 00:09

And studies point to trans people having 1% regret after surgery.

And yet you claim to care about flawed methodology.

ScrollingLeaves · 29/06/2026 00:09

Baileyonice · 29/06/2026 00:00

I'll tell you what scientific study I want to see BoI. The one that does an analysis of whether trans people are happier after transition and if not explores exactly why suicide rates and mental health problems remain sky high compared to the population as a whole.

Maybe think of it this way, a woman who has life long depression & anxiety from school bullying or child abuse or social & familial rejection ALSO prefers to have breast implants because of an aesthetic preference. Will this cure her depression & anxiety?

In terms of suicide & mental health risk factors, generally social & familial rejection is a big one. Add to that multiple other risk factors like addiction, homelessness & unemployment which trans people are likely to experience creates an even bigger risk.

Transition/'passing' isn't just about aesthetic preference but an avenue to accelerate social acceptance which reduces social rejection. Just ask a trans woman who clearly can't pass how confident she is about venturing out.

Also the study you maybe referencing (or not) has been criticised for its flawed methodology of comparing the cis population to trans. For the study to be meaningful it needs compare trans people who don't transition against those that do. Experiences of marginalisation by gender minority people may predispose them to poorer mental health outcomes than their cisgender peers so comparing the outcomes between the two groups is erroneous.

So the trans movement can conveniently go on ignoring de-transitioners and continue claiming that the reason that trans people are still unhappy after transition is because of how badly society treats them, not because they've found out that transition itself has not solved their mental health problems.

Detransitioners are presently are comparatively a huge minority group to transition so they hardly qualify as a repudiation of trans people. And studies point to trans people having 1% regret after surgery.

Edited

And studies point to trans people having 1% regret after surgery.

It would be interesting to see those studies if you have a link. I wonder how many have been followed up and for how long?

Baileyonice · 29/06/2026 00:10

Helleofabore · 28/06/2026 15:19

Errrr

Was this supposed to a witty gotcha?

You are posting papers pointing out some researcher’s self-reporting questionnaire that even the researchers understand the limitations of, that does not do anything to eliminate aspirational bias or answering what the respondents want the researcher to see. Then you are the one trying to argue that those traits are somehow tools for categorising human sex classes all the while never once in months of repeating this same argument coming up with any workable way to define the boundaries of those categories.

What you have been doing is effectively saying ‘but, but… behaviours … traits…’ as if what you are pointing to is in any way relevant to categorising humans into stable, reliable and useful sex classes.

For the gazillionth time, of course there is overlap with personality and behavioural traits of male and female humans. None of those personality and behavioural traits define what sex class they are in.

Again for the gazillionth time, who the fuck arbitrates who is and isn’t at the ‘female’ enough because of their behaviour or personality?

You really are posting about ‘unsupported feelz’ desperately wanting what you say to be true.

Discrediting use of surveys for research (when convenient) won't change the fact that science has concluded gendered personality traits exist & are both nature & nurture influenced.

murasaki · 29/06/2026 00:14

Please show the studies re detranistioners, after all you do like the scientific papers. Allegedly. And peer reviewed ones please if possible. In journals with a decent impact factor by authors with a decent H index.

NellieBly · 29/06/2026 00:26

Baileyonice · 29/06/2026 00:07

I understand exactly what she said because I have lived it. But that is irrelevant to my point that Greer implies there is a typical female experience that qualifies people as women which you are conveniently avoiding because you know that spells H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-S-Y.

I don't understand what you mean. You say you have lived it. What do you mean. What have you lived. You can't have lived her statement.

Greer does not say that there is a typical woman experience in the way that you say she does. She does not say that men and women are the same. She does not believe either of those things.

It is not hypocrisy to say that women share some experiences because they are women, and that men can never share those experiences.

NellieBly · 29/06/2026 00:37

Baileyonice · 29/06/2026 00:10

Discrediting use of surveys for research (when convenient) won't change the fact that science has concluded gendered personality traits exist & are both nature & nurture influenced.

What science has concluded that gendered personality traits exist?

To use your own phrase, you do realise (said in a very patronising tone) that science is not a fixed entity, that a scientific study is always superseded by new evidence, that every scientific study needs to be testable, replicable, and provable, until better evidence turns up and is tested? Every paradigm is temporary. Better understanding follows when new hypotheses and testings occur. Saying that science has stated something is easy to do. You need to back it up with proper evidence.

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