All transwomen are to be moved out of Scottish female prisons today. 🙌🏻

[sohard]

https://x.com/forwomenscot/status/2069385340159225981?s=46&t=AjtjSItRj-kgZwRzL-pdyQ

Scotgov will not appeal and the current transgender policy has been withdrawn. At long bloody last!!

Yeah, and they seem to be legitimate addresses, too. I really hope nobody is going to be endangered by the TRAs 😨

Have you wondered why men were moved to women's prison's in the first place? Do you consider that society moving forwards? In what way? Putting transexual men, who statistically commit more sex crimes than the male prisons in with women is progressive ?

Your concern for prison staff and guards is noted. Also noted is your lack of concern for women prisoners. Who statistically are very poor women, uneducated women, abused women. Most of whom have a dreaded fear of all men.

Until this thread, which I only spotted today, I didn't see a whisper of any of this in the news. Following this thread I had to go into The Telegraph, Time and BBC to search, had to go to the UK sections, then into the Scotland section. Very odd especially since I'm very atunned to this particular issue.

You sound very confused.

Society moved backwards when it was decided, without consultation, to take away women’s hard fought-for rights to their own spaces, and that it was A-ok to endanger women by forcing them to be banged up, trapped and vulnerable, with male rapists.

Women are not sacrificial lambs for the shortcomings of the prison service when it comes to protecting vulnerable males. Women are not of lesser importance than men.

Interesting you're very concerned about males being assaulted, but fine with those males assaulting, harassing and harming women.

There in a nutshell is why as a society we still need rigid protections in law for women. It protects them from those who believe that women having equal rights too is 'backward'.

And just to set you straight on your other claim, that putting men in women’s prisons was not due to campaigning, this is from James Morton, a trans-identified woman, who specifically campaigned for men to be put in women’s prisons:

We strategised that by working intensively with the Scottish Prison Service to support them to include trans women as women on a self-declaration basis within very challenging circumstances, we would be able to ensure that all other public services should be able to do likewise.

And there is of course no question, as you'd know if you'd actually read and understood the judgment, no question of these men being dumped back into the male estate and left in harm's way. The judge shared at length that these men recieve careful and privileged treatment very different to those of other men, and repeatedly emphasised that provision for them must be made with safety in mind. The prison service bends over backwards for them, they are far more cared about and protected than the SPS has ever bothered to do for any women prisoners.

The only difference is that these men will no longer have access to non consenting women as part of their provision. That's the only beef. That the prison service, kicking and screaming all the way, are now forced to extend some safety and equality for women too.

Hi MummyWillow1, it looks like you didn't read my post at 17.51 yesterday:

It's worth noting that transwomen prisoners are not going to be just 'thrown to the wolves' in men's prisons - Lady Ross's judgment made it clear that the PC of gender reassignment applies to trans-IDing men in men's prisons, and that there are already arrangements in place to protect those PC rights in men's prisons:
[124] There are, of course, means of protecting trans prisoners’ rights which do not involve accommodation in a prison for the opposite biological sex. I have referred already, at paragraphs [7] and [112], to the various forms of special provision set out in the Prisons Guidance. In this context, it can be understood that there are arrangements made allowing a trans prisoner to “live in their affirmed gender” and that, with those measures in place, the respondents respect that trans prisoner’s Article 8 right to a private life.
I'm not making a value judgement on that, I'm just heading off any suggestion that transwomen will be placed in danger in vulnerable situations when they are returned to men's prisons. They won't be.

Don't worry, the Prison Guidance has it covered. Transwomen will be safely housed, in the appropriate prisons i.e. men's prisons.

Some women really hate their sex, don't they?

I’ve said before, James and the odious NHSE fiddler Stephen Whittle have a lot to answer for.

Yes, I only saw it on my Twitter feed. I've been on other news sites at least a couple of times a day, but haven't seen it reported anywhere else.

You have this the wrong way round. Putting males in female prisons was society moving backwards. Elizabeth Fry and Nelson Mandela knew the risks of incarcerating males and female together. It’s a disgrace that the authorities tried to gaslight us that there was no risk to women by putting transwomen in female prisons. It was a shameful experiment that resulted in terrible harm to women and thankfully the courts have restored women’s rights and safety.

Very odd. I mean otherwise anyone could give someone a fake name etc
A DBS check etc should always be linked. It does sounds a bit of an anomaly as it was a lawyer looking it up but still. But yeah, clear as mud!

It will be like vegans, they will tell you because they do being a woman so much better.

What about the women being attacked?

Why are women the solution to these men's problems?

Hard agree!
If there is risk in housing TW in mens' prisons then that risk needs addressing in the mens' prison, not just transferring the risk to the female estate!!

I agree, even worse than TiM's, they've been able to project their miserable self-loathing on all of us. 😡

"We strategised that by working intensively with the Scottish Prison Service to support them to include trans women as women on a self-declaration basis within very challenging circumstances, we would be able to ensure that all other public services should be able to do likewise."

Now they've failed in the SPS does that mean they will now fail in all other public services. 🙏

Given that many here have been campaigning for a decade for women’s prisons to be female only, too right we’re celebrating this court victory.

Vulnerable female prisoners are not human shields, validation resources or support humans. The female prison estate is not a convenient resource to be utilised for the benefit of men.

Quite astonishing that a (presumably) grown adult thinks they are, frankly.

Thanks Arabella.

Like @mrshoho , I'd like to think that the details of someone's old name would be automatically linked. But something tells they are not. Unfortunately, I also find the link posted by @Toffeefudgecaramel very unclear.

More generally, I'm not thinking specifically of enquiring after a person's sex. I really can't see why any convictions shouldn't be automatically flagged in someone's record. Whether their sex has been falsified or not. When you change your name you are still the same person.

I find it unbelievable that unless you tell them, they don't know that Andrea Smith used to be called Andrea Jones. Let alone Andrew Jones.

The mind truly boggles. This is an extremely serious situation.

DBS for those with a GRC

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/transgender-applications

'The sensitive applications route gives transgender applicants the choice not to have any gender or name information disclosed on their DBS certificate, that could reveal their previous gender identity.'

We were assured that this wasn't a problem.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c5y93r8n4mdo

'Criminals not able to wipe record with gender change, MSPs told'

Because,

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/trans-killer-criminal-record-wiped-35397482

'Trans killer has criminal record 'wiped clean' after thug self-identified as woman in jail'

This is Alex Stewart, btw. Since charged with sexual assault.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4glne43101o

He accused a woman of 'transphobia' and the subsequent trial delayed her release.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/01/20/four-killers-trans-murderer-misgendered-scotland/

Alex Stewart is a straight male who had a relationship with a woman while he was in prison.

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/scotland/article/prison-let-killer-and-trans-lover-meet-despite-segregation-rule-2nvbk2zq7

Imagine thinking that preventing men from being locked up with vulnerable women is an indication of society moving backwards. What a thoroughly shameful way of thinking.

I definitely think it’s worth celebrating. But then I’ve always put women’s safety before men’s wants.