who menstruates?

[OriginalPunchbowl]

Seen in a wokeworkplace toilet in Scotland (I have NCd for this) The label on the tampon basket says:
Who menstruates?
girls menstruate as well as women
intersex people, who have both male and female reproductive organs
non-binary people with female reproductive organs
some transgender men

The second one doesn't feel correct to me: I'm aware that "intersex" is no longer used, but even in ovotesticular dsd, is it right to say "both male and female reproductive organs"? can anyone advise please, then I can pass it on to the wokesters management?

So they are females? Are there any male dsd's which menstruate?
Could the sign just say "anyone who menstruates is female" or "who menstruates? - females!" (Simples)?

Do they have a sign next to the toilet paper explaining who poos?

I'm guessing that if you need to be told who menstruates then you probably don't have a gush of blood currently making its way through your pants, so you don't really need to know who the basket of freebies is for.

No, none of the DSDs that have a Y chromosome menstruate. Any phenotypical females with XY never go through the female puberty.

The sign could say anyone who menstruates is female.

I am just reminded of a nurse telling me about the number of transwomen that call and demand a cervical smear is ridiculous. They don’t have cervixes. But they think they do.

Some of these TW think they are women and might think ooo I have a surgically created pseudo vagina, I am taking hormones, I have fake boobs, so I should probably take some because I am going to menstruate.

Never underestimate the ignorance of biological men regarding the female body.

Where I live, a Cumbrian message would do...if ye need owt, tek it

All this faff!

And yet on the tampon boxes themselves it clearly says 'hey girls....'

So I take it trans men wouldn't be able to avail themselves of those particular tampons if they were to need them then? They are for girls, after all. It says so on the box.

Are the trans men even in that bathoom, or are they trying to style it out in the Gents?

Why the hell this organisation, whoever they are, feels the need to educate the rest of us about who does and doesn't need tampons is beyond me. We all understand perfectly well who probably menstruates and who most definitely doesn't. Just put the bloody things out and let the people who need them use them. Job done. There is really no need for the patronising and vaguely inaccurate lectures.

Intersex is a range. They can have full reproductive systems of both sexes with either both, ambiguous or a single external genitalia. They may have ambiguous external genitalia and a single set of sex organs. They may have identifiably female genitalia with male reproductive organs or and many other combos. There isn't a single "type" of intersex person.

I have 2 friends, one with ambiguous, almost non-existant external genitalia. Raised male (born early 60s) and found out they were female when they got ovarian cancer in their 30s. They were born without a vagina or uterus.

I have another friend who has total androgen insensitivity. It was discovered in puberty after 15 years of being presumed female. Looks 100% female. Is 100% male.

Well it would wouldn't it? Transwomen categorically do not menstruate. The list covers people who do.

It's not entirely accurate when it states that 'intersex people with both male and female reproductive organs' menstruate though.

Women with Turners come under the umbrella of 'intersex' but they have female genitalia and female sexual organs only, albeit their ovaries are underdeveloped and non-functioning. However, most are given growth hormones and HRT to induce puberty so they will usually menstruate normally even though they cannot conceive. It's inaccurate to suggest that all intersex people have both male and female reproductive organs.

I’d have taken that off the box and binned it.

The sign doesn’t suggest all intersex people have both male and female organs.

However, I take your point that the list could be improved by saying
intersex people with female organs or female and male organs.

They don’t have cervixes. But they think they do.

Well I'm prepared to accept that some might be dim or deluded enough to think they do. I'll bet plenty more just love an opportunity to act out the charade of pretending they need a smear. And they'd love that other people would be forced to collude in that charade. Smear tests are what real women get, so they think they should be in on the act as well, as a point of principle. Like it's a fun, girlie day out.

I've no doubt there will be others who would actually get off on a rare opportunity to have some female nurse obliged to root around in their faux-fanny, even if it's for the most pointless of reasons.

Some XX people have said they identify as trans women. Are they wrong? Why? What makes a woman trans?

And plenty of agender people don;t identify as non-binary - me for a start. Who are you to decide that some identities are worth naming and some are just subsets of another?

Seems to me like there's an awful lot of hierachies hidden within Genderist beliefs.

Yes, fair point, I appreciate it doesn't say 'all'. However, if you are going to take it upon yourself to lecture/preach/educate on this subject, completely uninvited, then you should at least try to make sure you get it right.

XX people don’t identify as transwomen

Why not? It's just as logical as men identifying as women.

If a man can identify as a woman then I can, and shall, identify as a woman identifying as a man who identifies as a woman.

So you are wrong. XX people DO identify as transwomen.

(Makes a change from identifying as a boiled beetle. Maybe tomorrow I'll identity as a fish and go swimming)

I'm really shocked that the boxes say 'Hey Girls' - that's literal violence to trans men, as it forces them to remember that they were assummed to be as girls at birth, just because they didn't have a penis, crazy doctors jumping to assumptions like that, sure penises are randomly assigned.

It's also very antagonistic to trans women, who do menstruate, I've seen it on Reddit, they get awful cramps too. Imagine not having had their rightful girlhood, as the stupid doctors thought they were boys, that bloody penis focus again, so they never got to called a girl, which was deliberate genocide.

Really could do a lot better.

What makes a woman trans?

Well trans women are men, so being a man?

If the question is what makes a woman identify as a trans man, it's a bit more complicated, but autism is signuficant, as is being assured by others that all of their problems that they don't fit in are due to their being male, not female. Add in fear of the pressures of sexualisition and objectification of girls by boys and men, resistance to fitting the narrow stereotypes of women.

Lots of reasons really

Only women menstruate. But not all women menstruate.

A patronising notice to explain what doesn't need explaining.
In my workplace we provide sanitary supplies. In the womens toilet. 3 or 4 boxes containing pads and tampons.
Not once has anyone needed an explanation. No one has asked for them to be put in the men's toilets.

Intersex is a range. They can have full reproductive systems of both sexes with either both, ambiguous or a single external genitalia.

Did you really mean to say that people can have both full reproductive systems, and both female genitalia and male genitalia?

How do you suppose someone could have a clitoris and a penis at the same time? Did you maybe forget there's more to the female external genitals than the vagina?

I am not an expert here, but we are talking about congenital disorders affecting sexual development. Let's focus on those caused by polyploidy of the 23rd chromosomal pair. Polyploidy is the term for having an extra chromosome over the 46 standard ones, and it's not beneficial on any chromosomal pair. The majority of possible polyploidies in humans end in miscarriage, because the physical issues are incompatible with life. Some of the remaining ones that do not inevitably lead to miscarriage result in extremely sick babies with life-limiting conditions.

The most famous polyploidy in humans that is survivable is Trisomy 21 or Down Syndrome, and the presence of that extra chromosome means people with Down Syndrome are more likely to be born with congenital heart defects, along with being higher risk for many other conditions. The impact of that extra chromosome is multi-systemic and has detrimental effects on ear, nose and throat, gut development and raises their risk of dementia.

An extra copy of a chromosome from that 23rd pair may still result in a viable embryo (as in a fetus that can survive to term without spontaneous miscarriage) where other trisomies don't, but you don't get bonus functioning organs out of being born with it. Don't romanticise it or sexualise this. It's like thinking an extra copy of any of the other pairs will result in the human baby being born with functioning wings.

1. Take sign off and place in bin
2. There isn't a 2

While I agree that it is unnecessary and it should just say take what you need (as a woman who doesn’t menstruate here but is still a woman and doesn’t define my gender by my periods) it seems like maybe you are getting a bit worked up about people’s genitals as often seems to be case on this board. Let people be. No one is forcing YOU to be trans or non binary. Maybe let’s just judge people as individual humans rather than by their genitalia. I thought that’s what feminism was about

I wouldn't be surprised if the sign is unofficial, added by someone silly upset by the "Hey Girls".

Re ovotesticular disorder, this is helpful and from 2016 (I find older things can be more sensible)

it’s a rare disease. Only 500 cases recorded in the entire world.

IF and individual started menstruating they’d be female with a disorder of sexual development via which ever route described below causes this. They’re a woman and really shouldn’t be having their condition plaster over everything. No one else would know they have the condition unless she chose to tell them.

If they don’t menstruate the whole set up around tampons is completely irrelevant.

The individual may well have settled into one sex or the other and the whole thing is irrelevant here again as they’re not trans. It’s a unique situation. It would only be relevant if they were competing in sports. But if sounds like the majority of the 500 cases are female.

TLDR: if someone needs tampons they’re a woman.

https://rarediseases.org/rare-diseases/ovotesticular-disorder-of-sex-development/

I can honestly not tell if this is satire.

The list is not inclusive, adult female chimpanzees menstruate, as do female fruit bats and spiny mice. How dare they be bigoted human centrics 😡

Arent people invited to talk on threads just through their existence as threads?

If not, who does the inviting so we know who is allowed to post?