Women & Equalities Committee 2.30pm Today, 9th June, Mary-Ann Stephenson Chair at EHRC giving oral evidence

[TheNoWord]

Work of the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) 20026-27 - Oral evidence, Mary-Ann Stephenson, Chair at Equality and Human Rights Commission and John Kirkpatrick, Chief Executive Officer at Equality and Human Rights Commission.

Considering the absolute balloons on this committee, it will be well worth a watch. Only Rosie Duffield and Rebecca Paul have any sense.

You can watch live on Parliament TV from 2.30pm

https://committees.parliament.uk/event/27280/formal-meeting-oral-evidence-session/

Hospitals have to make difficult arrangements in stressed conditions all of the time. The point is that the code provides guidance so that an individual staff member does not have to make their own judgement on the spot.

Would that staff member not have to make a judgement call if a separate space wasn’t available? Yes the code sets out the legal position, but there is still a very big question of how this actually works in reality

What happens when all the side rooms are full and another patient arrives with an infection? A solution has to be found - and it’s not bung the infectious patient in with the female patients on the women’s open ward, any more than it is bung the trans-IDed male patient in with the female patients on the women’s open ward. The fact that the NHS runs hospitals at too high percentage of capacity is not women’s problem to solve, just like the fact that a man does not like being a man is not women’s problem.

At what point do you decide that a man has been too long transitioned to be nursed on a men’s ward? What are the criteria for ‘passing’? If a male patient does not like to be seen by or among other male patients, there is already a solution for him: cubicle curtains.

Yes, so what is your workable solution to how this works in reality?

Who was the batshit woman - slim, shorter silver hair who unconvincingly claimed to have been repeatedly misgendered? And I noticed one of the male MPs was overkeen on the "if women can bring their toddler sons into women's changing rooms "WHERE DOES THE AGE LIMIT END 😱?" 😂

It was a bit depressing that xome of our supposed leaders did so much emoting but suppose as they've nothing to go on intellectually to support demands to wedge men into women's spaces, we shouldn't expect much from them.

In the parts that I heard I thought that MAS and her colleague were excellent and completely on top of the brief with women's rights to privacy, safety and fairness in sport etc being repeatedly mentioned in response to the numerous "why won't you prioritise the trans" bleating.

I didn’t say the solution was to put the infectious patient on the female ward or put the trans woman on the ward. The only thing I am saying is that the solution isn’t to put the trans woman on the male ward.

Of course there's a question of how this works in reality in our dysfunctional NHS. But now, for the first time, the law is explicit that trans demands don't automatically go to the top of the pile with the rights of women and girls not being considered.
All the dangerous policies wedging trans male sex offenders onto women's wards must be dumped. And the endless numbers of DEI appointments in the NHS will finally have to earn their keep and consider how to balance the rights of different groups rather than priositising just the one group.

What's your solution then?

In an ideal world the NHS will invest in alternative spaces, but we all know it’s not an ideal world. I can easily see this leading to trans people either being forced on the ward of their bio sex or being denied care.

But what's your actual solution? We an all see what the problems might be, but what do you suggest the answer is?

For the fifth time of asking @toyl9876

I suspect you want to say "put TW on the women's ward" but you're not saying it

Gah, poor MAS having to listen to this absolute tosh.

I actually don’t want to say that because I don’t believe that is the right thing. As much as I know I’d be no harm of a women’s ward, I know I can’t speak for all trans women so exclusion is necessary.

The solution is for the NHS to build a lot more individual rooms. Separate wards would be impractical because you’d have to build a trans woman and trans man ward because it would be mixed sex provision otherwise.

Thanks for this thread. I had no idea this was happening today.

What was the supposed purpose of the meeting?

Will try to catch up later today and hope that there will be more contributions on this thread than it getting clogged up by the whatabouteries.

Hope we can name and shame the MPs who have the nerve to sit on the Women & Equalities Committee and use it to deny women's rights.

Sorry - have now seen the title of the session.

Is it normal to have sessions on the work of EHRC so often.

Are MAS etc., allowed to say they could get on with doing their work if the Government didn't constantly obstruct and try to undermine them.

Answers will have to be found.

Those answers can never include stick him in the women's facilities.

Which, let's be honest, is what all the 'its complicated' is trying to get to.

Women and their resources are entirely off limits. End of. They matter too.

Most men in a hospital gown will be indistinguishable from any other man in a hospital gown, regardless of their ‘gender identity’.

Their preference for accommodation should never be put above clinical need. There is no reason that they wouldn’t be fine in the men’s ward.

Gah the waaah I was misgendered nonsense gives me the rage

I mean so fucking what?! I've been misgendered in the past and I just laughed at the bloke who was hugely embarrassed and carried on with my life because I'm an adult and not 6!!!

The last ditch solution would, yes, have to be some kind of provision on the ward of their sex.

Because you cannot sacrifice the rights and needs of all the women to those of one man. Obviously.

Also obviously, no one is ever going to be denied care, that's ridiculous. A man I suppose may choose to leave rather than accept care if he's not happy with the accommodation he's offered - which is the situation women have been put in for years, deal with this man in the room or go without health care, why is it worse when it happens to a man?

And women have never had huge groups of MPs flapping and running around and large charities behind them, or in fact really anyone who gives a fuck at all, these men will be fine - funding will be found, it will have to be.

Women still cannot be sacrificed and he STILL can't go in the women's facilities. Because they have equal rights to his.

Until of course the mad left destroy women's rights.

Sure, If you ignore distress and dignity there is no reason they can’t go on that mens ward

You mean the way that women's distress and dignity has been overlooked by putting TW on women's wards?

I think you mean put the trans-identified male on the male ward. That clarity of phrasing really helps with solutions.

I never said that was right. It was wrong for that to happen to you, and it would also be wrong for it to happen to a trans person.

Please don’t police my language. Thank you!

stillcantfindreverse: ...Also obviously, no one is ever going to be denied care, that's ridiculous. A man I suppose may choose to leave rather than accept care if he's not happy with the accommodation he's offered - which is the situation women have been put in for years, deal with this man in the room or go without health care, why is it worse when it happens to a man?

Please answer. Why is it important to consider men's distress and dignity, but it is fine to ignore women's? In a hospital setting a male patient, trans or not, is there for care. He can be cared for in a men's ward when no side rooms are available, with the privacy curtain. It's not a hotel.