Any recommended genderist writers?

[bonfireoftheverities]

"He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that." - John Stuart Mill

This is something I've tried to keep in mind over the last half dozen or so years since I heard TWAW, thought "What?" and fairly quickly found FWR. So I've made sure to read as much as I can take from those who truly believe that men can be women, or if they don't actually believe it (because how can you, deep down?), desperately want it to be true. I say as much as I can take because after a while you've seen and heard it all before, and it never starts being convincing.

The latest pile of nonsense I dove into is this: The End of Trans Rights in the UK Is the Start of Democratic Collapse. Dear god, that almost made my brain melt. The links alone show you that he never strays outside an idiotic bubble (Helen Webberley being the first I clicked into).

Is there anyone you can recommend who makes their case without lying and relying on liars?

Are you using AI? So if no behaviour is exclusive to one sex or the other, and transpeople are just relying on “typical” behaviours, how do they know they are not just a GNC member of their sex? What frame of reference are they using to determine they are not the sex they are?

So transpeople are basing their identity on sexist regressive stereotypes rejected by everyone else? That still does not make them anything but GNC members of their sex does it? And therefore, as they are not members of the opposite sex, they do not belong in the spaces designated for the sex class to which they do not belong. You said sex and gender were different. So they can use the gender neutral, single sex spaces designated for their sex can’t they?

No I'm saying that an irrational reaction to a phenomena like pretending it doesn't exist when it clearly does particularly where one feels 'excluded' can be attributed to a complex. This isn't at all controversial in psychology.

Still not getting the difference between expectations & associations……

excluded from the phenomena of being a trad wife?

But what the expectations based on? Surely if society expects me to act a certain way/ like certain things etc then it's because those things are associated with being female?

But no one is pretending tradwives don’t exist. We know they do. Are you saying I’m now upset because I’m “excluded” from being a tradwife? The thing is, I can be a tradwife if I want. I just choose not to.

I admit that the difference does escape me.

However, more than anything I don't understand the relevance.

Women are generally shorter than men, but a tall woman is not a man.

Until 50 years ago, going to university was associated with being male, but women didn't change sex when they went to university and now more women than men go to university in the UK.

Apparently so! I’m sobbing into my coffee here. My life is meaningless now.

Because that's where self identification matters. What an individual identifies with more in terms of sex or gender can vary. IE a butch reproductive female may consider her reproductive traits a defining characteristic & identify as a cis woman or they may consider themselves a trans man because gender is their defining characteristic. Ultimately personal identity is a values based system.

‘Typical’ behaviours are only ‘typical’ within specific cultural, geographical and/or historical contexts. That suggests someone’s transness is dependent on when and where they were born. Unlike their sex.

Ewwwww that is the grossest, most sexist thing I’ve ever heard. REPRODUCTIVE FEMALE!!!! Did you mean to be so offensive? That is the most misogynistic thing the TRA has ever said. Reducing women to the ur reproductive organs? Wow!

TBH I'm so worn down by having been the only parent for so long, and having to make all the decisions, and worry about how I'm going to pay all the bills, and what I do when the DC are ill, that being a trad wife for a few days might be quite nice.

Only a few days mind you, I'm not very good at behaving myself either. But the break does sound tempting.

This might surprise you, but many, many women do not spend any time thinking about whether they identify with feminine stereotypes. They just wear what they want to wear and do what they want to do.

I think I might just identify as a tradwife and tell DH he’s now responsible for the money 😁

Um, typical behaviours aren't expectations they are simply the most common behaviours to a particular sex so they are hardly rejected by everyone else.

So they can use the gender neutral, single sex spaces designated for their sex can’t they?

Like I said sex & gender are ultimately values based systems so one doesn't necessarily trump the other. Different countries globally have differing policies so there's no objectively correct action.

To be fair, I am quite happy to agree that the thing that makes me female is my reproductive system. The rest of me is just plain old human.

a butch reproductive female may consider her reproductive traits a defining characteristic & identify as a cis woman or they may consider themselves a trans man because gender is their defining characteristic.

Or she may consider that the term cis & the concept of gender overall, whether referring to expectations or associations, are linked to sexist stereotypes which the world would be better off without.

I seem to remember India Willoughby claiming that he hadn’t just changed sex but had grown a cervix. And claiming to be genuinely not understand why JK Rowling invited GNC lesbians to lunch but didn’t invite him. Even though he wore dresses &makeup.

So again, you’re claiming someone is men or woman depending on how strictly they adhere to regressive sexist stereotypes? How is sex a value based system? So who decided these behaviours are “typical”? If enough people do not adhere to them, surely that makes them “atypical”? What gendered behaviours are “typical” for women then that would determine if someone is seen as a woman or not?

Research on gendered choices is usually conducted in most egalitarian countries like Sweden to allow for more organic gendered inclinations to be measured which interestingly show even bigger differences than those with less freedom.

Yes but Emily is not talking about sex. Emily is stating that only adherence to sexist stereotypes determines whether someone is a woman or not and therefore allowed into female spaces.

Do it, and I'll live vicariously through you. As my husband is imaginary I can't make him pay any bills. Unless invisible man that he is

Sex is not a value based system.

It's a system to classify reproductive class across species based on scientific understanding.

Sex has consequences for male and female mammals, so in a limited number of situations we provide sex specific services.

We never provide gender specific services because there is no need.

AI is so cool isn’t it. When you have no argument, reach for AI and let the word salad commence. But as you’ve said no one can determine who is a man or a woman, how can you be sure those results are correct?

I’m also concerned that Emily seems to only have gender stereotypes for men and women? What about the demi greybois? Or the Quoigender? What are the gender stereotypes for those @EmilyinEverton ?