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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Are We Really 'Women' On The Inside?

1000 replies

HazelLemur · 27/04/2026 17:39

Dear friends,

As anyone paying attention to current trans affairs knows, the anti-trans brigade like to throw around what they think is the “killer question”.

"What is a woman, then?"

These people will often engage in triumphal sneering as they further insist "Your chromosomes are what you are; XX are women and XY are men. It's science, innit?"

And as a confident trans-woman I say to these people "Absolutely! What is a woman? Great question! Let's examine that".

To begin, let's consult three definitive sources:

First, the Cambridge Dictionary of the English Language.
Then, modern genetics and neurophysiology.
And finally, up to date research on brain structure in cisgender and transgender women.

First, the dictionary.
For this, let's go with the Cambridge Dictionary of the English Language:

Woman (noun)

  1. an adult female human being
  2. an adult who lives and identifies as female though they may have been said to have a different sex at birth

As we can see from #2, despite the recent social backlash and disproportionately loud screeching from certain murky corners of the internet, Western culture as a whole is moving toward accepting the validity of trans peoples' inner gender identity. No person with a working moral compass would consider this a bad thing.

Next, let’s summarize genetics and neurophysiology.

Modern society routinely treats all the following “XY” humans as WOMEN, however...
-You can be a woman because you have X & Y chromosomes but your body is insensitive to androgens and you have female anatomy & gender identity.
Ah, so much for the childishly simplistic “But women = XX and men = XY".
-You can be a woman with X & Y chromosomes but your Y is missing the SRY gene, so you have a female body and gender identity (yes, this is a real thing despite your denials).

People who have X & Y chromosomes, but their Y is missing the SRY gene, develop a female body.
Should we treat such people as men, in society, when they have the body of a woman, simply because simpletons insist that XY = Male?
Only an inveterate bigot with some weird religious and/or psychosexual axe to grind would say yes.

You can be a woman with XXY or XXXY chromosomes, giving you a male body but female brain/body map and gender identity.
-You can be a woman with XY chromosomes but a mutation called CBX2 that blocks the influence of the SRY gene.
-You can be a woman because you have 46,XY in some cells but 46,XX in other cells, or 47, XXY.

These are all valid, scientifically obervable genetic variations that highlight the "But XX = women and XY = men" mantra for the simplistic, unscientific nonsense that it is.

And lastly, there are studies of brain structure.
These show that in the section of the brain that determines one’s sense of gender identity.

The brains of transgender women are almost identical to those of cisgender women.
The brains of trans men also align more with cisgender men than they do with women.

And so, to summarize

Modern science, which is how rational people resolve differences of opinion.
It is not about referring to holy books, written in pre-scientific ages past.
It is not about regurgitating simplistic, binary statements that you learnt in the 4th grade.

This shows us that, genetically and biologically speaking, there are many types of women; including transgender women like me.

P.S. In this essay we have a summary of the cutting edge science which validates transgender womens' biologically determined, inner sense of gender identity.

As I’ve said, a rational society follows rational explanations, and doesn’t define its people via outdated religious or cultural ideas.
But beyond that, there is simply human courtesy and kindness.

It’s cruel, hateful and rude for the transphobic bigots to demand that people be forced to conform to their anti-scientific notions.

No one's life is affected negatively by honoring a transwoman as a woman, as the historical record of many trans accepting societies have shown.

Good people will see the very challenging dilemma that transwomen are in, and their natural empathy, coupled with scientific insight, will make them want to support their fellow human beings in being who they know they are.

And so, I ask all of you:

Should we as a society treat trans-women as the women their brain and neurobiology tells us they are? And, if not, why on earth wouldn’t we?

P.P.S. The image in this post is of women who have XY chromosomes, but an androgen insensitivity syndrome which causes their bodies to develop as female.
Would anyone in their right mind insist we treat them as males, simply because of their chromosomal makeup?
The bigots might, but you know you're better than that, right?

Are We Really 'Women' On The Inside?
OP posts:
Thread gallery
39
HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 09:02

DialSquare · 28/04/2026 09:00

Yep. We’re not dick pandering handmaidens. And you can’t stand it.

"dick pandering handmaidens"... trans-women...

Are there any women, besides other members of the cult, that you don't hate?

OP posts:
DialSquare · 28/04/2026 09:03

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 09:02

"dick pandering handmaidens"... trans-women...

Are there any women, besides other members of the cult, that you don't hate?

Judge Judy Eye Roll GIF

.

Alltheprettyseahorses · 28/04/2026 09:04

It's like it's 2017 again. Lol that having a penis doesn't make him a man because a few electrons in a small area of the brain means he's really a woman. The world has moved on.

Leavesandthings · 28/04/2026 09:04

You haven't backed up your crucial claim that "scientific studies show the brains or transwomen are identical to those of cis women"

Because you can't.

PrizedPickledPopcorn · 28/04/2026 09:05

Perhaps this is another humiliation fetishist?

Leavesandthings · 28/04/2026 09:08

I don't even think it's that deep. I think some men just really think they are cleverer and more informed than women, and need to spray their superiority around.
This person is obviously either young or lacking intelligence/critical thinking skills so I'm trying not to be too harsh.

Waitingfordoggo · 28/04/2026 09:12

Thank you for telling us all that stuff about DSDs that we already knew.

It’s a distraction technique but it’s not working. It’s completely irrelevant to the question of whether trans people are the sex they say they are.

You don’t have a DSD do you? You are a transwoman. The only way to be a transwoman is to be male. A man. You are a man. And that’s ok- there’s nothing wrong with being a man. You can also wear what you like. Still not a woman though.

KG74 · 28/04/2026 09:12

This post is great. Really breaks it all down. The fact some people can only post snarky insults in return shows that they haven't actually read or understood it or if they have, they just don't want to acknowledge it.

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 28/04/2026 09:13

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 08:54

Thank you for your show of support; a lone light of compassion amidst the self-congratulatory baying of the cult.

It was intended as educational more than patronising, but you are absolutely right on point 2.

Although, I'd suggest that mumsnet is a wee bit more than "a bit TERF-y".
Inherently TERF-y, perhaps.
Aggressively TERF-y would also be nearer the mark.

I'm not sure that I would characterise my reply to you as ' support ' - I am proudly pro-trans, yes, but I thought your opening post was patronising, confrontational and ill-judged.

You've not convinced anyone here with your arguments. They were weakly presented, and lacked scientific sources.

I'm heartily sick of this debate. Every time I see it, it plays out into aggression, insults, and lack of any attempt - by either side - to reach any kind of understanding.

I do believe that trans women are women, and deserve kindness, respect and accommodation.

I also believe that biological women have a right to preserve certain women-only spaces, especially in sports, prisons, rape shelters. Not bathrooms or changing rooms.

I don't believe in this ' wrongly assigned male at birth ' nonsense. And I hate the word ' cis ' .

I don't think your opening post has helped move this debate on in the slightest.

EmpressaurusKitty · 28/04/2026 09:13

DialSquare · 28/04/2026 09:00

Yep. We’re not dick pandering handmaidens. And you can’t stand it.

If we take in dick pandas as well as reverse ferrets we’re going to need a bigger park.

abracadabra1980 · 28/04/2026 09:16

DontBuyANewMumCashmere · 27/04/2026 17:50

Only a man would have to type out such a long essay about why he's really a "woman".
🙄

Fuck all the way off.

This.

Igneococcus · 28/04/2026 09:16

KG74 · 28/04/2026 09:12

This post is great. Really breaks it all down. The fact some people can only post snarky insults in return shows that they haven't actually read or understood it or if they have, they just don't want to acknowledge it.

Oh good, can you point us into the direction of the "cutting edge science" that the OP has promised us and so far failed to provide?

Leavesandthings · 28/04/2026 09:18

I would really like to see the studies proving trans "women's" brains are identical to women's brains.

Please provide your sources.

abracadabra1980 · 28/04/2026 09:18

A woman is a baby who is born female. Everyone else is male. What you decide act as, when a grown man or woman, is entirely up to you, but you are the aex you were born, unless sadly born a hermaphrodite.

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 09:19

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 28/04/2026 09:13

I'm not sure that I would characterise my reply to you as ' support ' - I am proudly pro-trans, yes, but I thought your opening post was patronising, confrontational and ill-judged.

You've not convinced anyone here with your arguments. They were weakly presented, and lacked scientific sources.

I'm heartily sick of this debate. Every time I see it, it plays out into aggression, insults, and lack of any attempt - by either side - to reach any kind of understanding.

I do believe that trans women are women, and deserve kindness, respect and accommodation.

I also believe that biological women have a right to preserve certain women-only spaces, especially in sports, prisons, rape shelters. Not bathrooms or changing rooms.

I don't believe in this ' wrongly assigned male at birth ' nonsense. And I hate the word ' cis ' .

I don't think your opening post has helped move this debate on in the slightest.

Thank you.

Your support for us, if not for me personally, is admirable, sensible, rational, and welcome.

I repeat; you are a lone light of compassion amidst the self-congratulatory baying of the cult.

OP posts:
IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 28/04/2026 09:21

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 09:19

Thank you.

Your support for us, if not for me personally, is admirable, sensible, rational, and welcome.

I repeat; you are a lone light of compassion amidst the self-congratulatory baying of the cult.

" a lone light of compassion amidst the self-congratulatory baying of the cult. "

Marvellous. Can I get that on a t-shirt?

Riverpaddling · 28/04/2026 09:21

I also believe that biological women have a right to preserve certain women-only spaces, especially in sports, prisons, rape shelters. Not bathrooms or changing rooms.

I don't care what you believe. I, as a female, have a legal right to single sex spaces, including toilets and changing rooms. All women and girls deserve that.

You need to educate yourself by reading the Target study before blthely saying that men should be allowed in female toilets and changing rooms.

GrandPlanB · 28/04/2026 09:22

EmpressaurusKitty · 27/04/2026 17:51

Is this AidaP’s replacement?

In a poor disguise more like.

ThisTimeWillBeDifferent · 28/04/2026 09:23

What on Earth possessed you to come onto this board, type out a long, waffly, patronising “but, but, but…intersex” post as some sort of gotcha, and thought it would be received with anything but very rightly deserved mockery? The women on this board certainly don’t need your DSDs for Dummies to explain the concept to them. Did you think any of these “arguments” were news? Or did you think it was just more special because you said it, Dear Friend?

Once again for the hard of thinking: DSDs =/= trans. Stop co-opting a real health condition to explain the feelings of people that don’t bloody have the condition. The fact that actually needs saying is baffling.

Leavesandthings · 28/04/2026 09:23

Did you think you could come in going "ACTUALLY SCIENCE SAYS"

and then not provide any science?

Secretsquirrelshh · 28/04/2026 09:23

HazelLemur · 28/04/2026 08:59

Delightful of you to post, Ms Bechdel, but there are no men here I'm aware of.

But you said, and I quote, "And as a confident trans-woman I say to these people "Absolutely! What is a woman? Great question! Let's examine that".

You say you are a trans-woman. This means you have XY chromosomes. This means you are a man.

Don't worry though, I know some men struggle with science so we are here to help you. Even at GCSE level, girls (XX chromosomes) outperform boys (XY chromosomes) at science, so it's understandably difficult for some men to grasp.

BackToLurk · 28/04/2026 09:24

ThisTimeWillBeDifferent · 28/04/2026 09:23

What on Earth possessed you to come onto this board, type out a long, waffly, patronising “but, but, but…intersex” post as some sort of gotcha, and thought it would be received with anything but very rightly deserved mockery? The women on this board certainly don’t need your DSDs for Dummies to explain the concept to them. Did you think any of these “arguments” were news? Or did you think it was just more special because you said it, Dear Friend?

Once again for the hard of thinking: DSDs =/= trans. Stop co-opting a real health condition to explain the feelings of people that don’t bloody have the condition. The fact that actually needs saying is baffling.

Not ‘typed out’, ‘copy and pasted’.

TheHereticalOne · 28/04/2026 09:24

IggyPopsPlasticTrousers · 28/04/2026 09:13

I'm not sure that I would characterise my reply to you as ' support ' - I am proudly pro-trans, yes, but I thought your opening post was patronising, confrontational and ill-judged.

You've not convinced anyone here with your arguments. They were weakly presented, and lacked scientific sources.

I'm heartily sick of this debate. Every time I see it, it plays out into aggression, insults, and lack of any attempt - by either side - to reach any kind of understanding.

I do believe that trans women are women, and deserve kindness, respect and accommodation.

I also believe that biological women have a right to preserve certain women-only spaces, especially in sports, prisons, rape shelters. Not bathrooms or changing rooms.

I don't believe in this ' wrongly assigned male at birth ' nonsense. And I hate the word ' cis ' .

I don't think your opening post has helped move this debate on in the slightest.

I'm with you in being heartily sick of this debate. It is UNBELIEVEABLY boring to go round and round the same points over and over again and I get quite cross fairly regularly at the total waste of intellectual power that has had to be expended over the past 10+ years to establish that water is wet, pope is Catholic, bears relieve themselves in the woods. It's like screaming into the void. Imagine what could have been achieved without this absurd, monumental distraction of nonsense.

It's unfortunately been necessary to have done it from a safeguarding point of view and to ensure the uplholding of basic reasoning as a governing principle of society, but my god it's tedious.

Case in point: I very nearly asked you to explain what you think the necessary and sufficient conditions are to be a 'woman' given that you think it can apply to some (all?) female people and some male people - i.e. what is the unifying principle that group has in common that those outside the group don't - but I just don't think I have the energy to engage today.

Riverpaddling · 28/04/2026 09:24

It was intended as educational more than patronising

The man's here to explain. Sit down and listen everyone Grin

GriseldaandMike · 28/04/2026 09:26

OP do you think knowing other words having an actual meaning would be a killer question?

A gardener knowing a sprout is not a potato?

A vet knowing a hamster is not a canary?

Someone knowing rugby is not a racquet sport?

It's quite usual for words to have meanings, otherwise it would be impossible to communicate so why should the words woman, female and of course girl, because middle aged men always believe themselves to be 'girls', not have a solid definition?

If you believe there are two sexes how can someone members of one sex also be members of the other sex? If you don't believe there are two sexes then there is either only one in which case we are all just human or there are more than two in which case the third, forth etc sexes need their own names but whether you believe there are one, two or many sexes men are not women.

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