Transwomen - pseudumenopausal symptoms due to hrt - asked to approve work policy

[GrimDamnFanjo]

I have to comment on a paper that’s come for approval. It’s a policy regarding menopause at work.
theres detail regarding the experience of black women, women with disabilities, trans men and those who identify as non binary and a line that transwomen may experience pseudomenopausal symptoms due to taking hrt.
is this true?
is this any different to anyone having side effects for drugs they take or am I missing something?

But could you imagine (rightly) the uproar if someone decided that because a woman is Asian, they shouldn't get as much accommodation because they are 'on average' going to have a less severe menopause? This could be neatly covered by 'Every woman will have an individual experience of menopause and may require workplace adjustments during this time.'

@GrimDamnFanjo could you approach it by saying 'I'm sure that there are negative symptoms associated with the use of cross-sex hormones, but including these in a policy about the menopause is likely to be confusing and may lead to both groups receiving inadequate consideration. I suggest that if you want to write a policy for transgender staff who are using cross-sex hormones, that is kept separate from the policy about biological women reaching the end of their fertile years.'

Sex realists have the most wonderful imaginations. I'm surprised more aren't hugely successful in the creative fields...

Back to the OP: If you are seeking a political solution to your workplace question, these women have provided numerous angles to remove trans women from the policy/process. If you are looking for an equitable medically-based answer, you will not find it here.

“If you are looking for an equitable medically-based answer, you will not find it here.”

When is it medically based to treat a male person’s personal and elective decision to take hormones in levels not meant for the male body and be treated as if that person was in fact going through a uniquely female body process? That is neither ‘equitable’ nor should it be considered ‘medically based as a female body process’.

It’s posts like this that make me grateful I don’t work in an office environment 🤦‍♀️ sorry you’re having to deal with this nonsense OP.

Trans medical care involves treatments and diagnoses across sex boundaries. If the OP's goal here is to start building walls limiting women's access to accommodations in the workplace, then they have found the right place to form the foundations.

What is needed here: an ‘equitable medically-based’ answer, or an answer that reflects UK law?

Pointing out that men lack entirely the ability to pause the menses they never possessed the anatomy for is going to 'limit women's access' to menopause support is it. Mhm. Yes.

I'll file that in the same box as John McDonnal MP declaring beating up women as a respectably left wing thing.

Pretending that men can be women limits women’s access to accommodations in the workplace.

Pretending that men can experience bodily processes that occur exclusively in the female sex limits women’s access to accommodations for those processes.

I suppose that might mean 'if women don't shut up and pretend men pause menses they never had and lack all the mechanics for, then men with gender identities will just burn all menopause provision down and leave them with nothing'?

I mean it's not an uncommon belief, but it's a little lacking in secure hinges.

If 'trans medical care' involves falsehoods such as treating a male person’s personal and elective decision to take hormones in levels not meant for the male body and be treated as if that person was in fact going through a uniquely female body process, then people receiving that medical care should be campaigning for better standards of care.

Your attempts to characterise female people expecting and asking for policy decisions based on accurate information as being somehow being the problem is very telling. If you cannot be honest with yourself, I guess no one should expect accuracy from you.

"If the OP's goal here is to start building walls limiting women's access to accommodations in the workplace".

In what way explicitly does accurately describing female body processes 'limit female people's access to accommodations in the workplace'?

Please list the exact ways this limits us.

Otherwise, this is just more sparple from you.

As Billings says very clearly 'who is going to stop them?'

The menacing and threatening that comes with female people saying 'no' is consistent. If you don't agree with us, then bad things will happen to you and you will deserve it.

The law is based on equality. The problem is the dickheads who insist that biology isn't an issue and that women don't have sex based issues and that men can be women and vice versa.

The SC agreed there could only be equality and equity if you recognise sex - because the only way you can have legal protection for women, men, homosexuals and transpeople is by recognising sex - otherwise the very definition is meaningless.

Trans people have no rights if they erase sex because no one can see they are trans and have legal protections that stem from that.

Sex realists lack the ability to acknowledge any facts relating to trans medical treatment, or trans lives in general. I would not rely on their beliefs of trans experience within any venue, especially one involving bodily function.

See Lundy Bancroft for details.

Why does he do it?

I look forward to us being informed about exactly what will happen to us that will 'limit women's access to menopause support' if we don't include male people who demand to be included in menopause support when they in no way experience menopause.

sea lion photo here

Sex realists focused on provision for menopause are not thinking about men with gender identities very unique medical needs because they are wholly irrelevant to that provision.

In about the same way that the kidney unit is not dealing with teeth.

I think he means it limits women's access because it doesn't expand it to include men.

Sorry about your thread, OP. Hope you got some useful answers in the early pages.

So, you have nothing?

Just empty accusations to emotionally manipulate female people to be kind and nice and allow some male people's subjective reality to be treated as if it is an accurate representation of facts.

I think you will find that quite a few of us, including me, advocated that male people who have the need for a policy that specifically covers them should have that discussion. So, at this point your emotional manipulation tactics of making vague false representations must be making you feel better, but shows that you seem to have not read that actual thread.

You need to write this in your submission on this policy @GrimDamnFanjo
Says it all, succinctly.

Mate, if you cannot answer questions to clarify your own accusations I suspect that this is yet another emotionally manipulative accusation.

A biological male cannot go through menopause so whatever they are experiencing it has no place in a menopause policy. Having said that the world has gone mad and I'm no legal expert

A reminder of the chilling and menacing response to women saying 'no' here.

https://x.com/knownheretic/status/2032639781658833142?s=46

Worth watching all the way through.

Sex realists have the most wonderful imaginations.

I'm confused @onepostwonder - are you a sex realist now? Because your fertile imagination causes you to act out being a woman ...