Please help — tween now trans?

[StrugglingMama2]

Hi there. I’m really struggling and wonder if others have been in this place. We’re a family of three and my daughter and I have always been close. She’s always been more on the “tomboy” side but also enjoyed “girlie” things and now watches “girlie” YouTubers and gets really into their shopping, cute characters, crochet, etc. She’s never seemed upset by her body but does protest about bras. In fourth grade she decided to go by her initials and “they/them”. Everyone now knows them by that new name. Well, earlier in the week, they texted me that they are trans, now use he/him pronouns and a third name. They have two close friends who are not trans (one now uses xi/she pronouns and I’m told the other is pansexual). These two friends were very excited about the text and apparently already use their new name and pronouns. We are an LGBT-friendly family but these two friends are thoroughly obsessed with all things LGBT to the point where it’s all they talk about and anything they see with any colors on it they refer to it as gay and cheer. But anyway, my main concern is losing my child. I feel like I’m having a nervous breakdown. Though it hurt, It made sense to me when they wanted to drop their given name in favor of initials and use they/them. But this I am really struggling with. Anyone out there on the other side of this? I love my child . Please help 🩷

{mention:lechiffre55}@lechiffre55 your post is completely unhelpful. I hope whatever made you grumpy today resolves itself.

What is an LGBT-friendly family? Why are you concerned about losing your child?

I don’t know what you mean exactly, but know that you’ve said this to someone who is struggling to even eat right now and your comment has pushed me further into despair 😢

OP what are you despairing about?

We are in a similar situation. Ther is good advice on evidence based support on a website that is often recomended on her but i cant remeber the name of it at the moment sorry! Will pop back and post when i remember it.

I am adopting a non affirming watch and wait aporoach. So lots of talking about it and showing interest to keep communication channels open and to try to understand more about it. We have also asked for a referral to gender services, which can only be done via camhs or a paediatrician. We have agreed thwy can used a different name as a sort of nick name with their friends but we wont be using it at home or in any official capacity.

My kiddo becoming a totally different person. We struggled for years to conceive, lost two babies, and then had this precious child. Infancy was difficult. They also have adhd and dyslexia so we’ve had our trials like many others. I’m just worried I don’t have what it takes to get through this. 🥺

This group is usually recommended: https://www.bayswatersupport.org.uk/

It sounds like a very difficult situation. Can you get your daughter away from the two other girls? It sounds like they are not a good influence on your daughter.

What do you mean by it made sense that your daughter used they/them pronouns and went by initials? What does an LGBT friendly family mean? I think you need to clarify your position and thoughts, so that you know what is bothering you.

How old is she?

Ow dear, social contagion of the highest order. Your right to be concerned op. Just be honest, tell you child she is a she and she is perfect as she is. If I were you I'd be getting her as far away from these nut jobs as possible.

She is 11, emotionally more 9/10 due to ADHD. To clarify, what I meant by it made sense that she wanted to use they/them pronouns is because she’s always been a “tomboy” in dress, etc. and enjoyed stereotypically boy activities. What I meant about being LGBT-friendly as a family basically means she’s never heard us say anything negative about acquaintances, etc. who are lesbian and gay. Her Dad and I have been married 20 yrs, both straight/cysgender. A few friends are same sex parents households. We have a neighbor who transitioned male to female snd that has been fine in the neighborhood. I truly see what she’s going through as a sexuality thing and I’m so worried others will convince her otherwise. I talked to her about it last night and she said it was how she felt and not up to me. When we talked about the 100-plus names for gender now and I said that seemed like a lot and that she was more than a label, she said I was small minded.

Can you explain the gender is a social construct, but biology is unchangeable. She is female, but that doesn’t mean she has to stick feminine stereotypes. She can wear any clothes she likes, have her hair short, take up any hobby, study any subject, none of this is restricted by her biological sex. Nothing she does will ever make her a boy, but if she wants to go by her initials instead of her (stereotypically?) girls name that’s fine, but her pronouns are not, and never will be he/him. She/her or they/them.

Hi OP. Im sorry to hear about your situation which must be very worrying. I don’t have personal experience of this - my two ADHD kids swing the other way and spend their time fearing they’ll be harassed for being Gender Critical.

However im a regular listener of the GENSPECT podcast. They’re run by psychologists who disagree with the affirmative model. They understand that there are many reasons why people might feel different in their bodies and I believe they offer therapy to explore that (internationally). One of the founders had gender dysphoria as a teen and recovered. They run groups for detransitioners and have learned a lot about why people turn to genderism and therefore how that need might be met in a way that won’t result in medical interventions. Might be worth a look - in the first instance someone to coach you on what to do/say and then maybe later child therapy?

From the things I’ve read parents say that the worst thing they did was to agree to new names and pronouns. As once that happens it’s a slippery slope. Im afraid I don’t know what the advice is about how to do this and maintain a good relationship.

There are quite a few people who post on this board who have gone through this; stick around and hopefully some of them will turn up to talk to you.

It sounds like she is very much being influenced but these friends and stuff she’s seeing online.
I would cut all internet access apart from with direct supervision for homework.
Don’t affirm, she is a girl so stick to she/her pronouns.
Reinforce that she’s perfect the way she is, she can wear whatever she likes but she will never be a boy

I would point her towards alternative trans YouTubers like buck angel and Marcus ‘theoffensivetranny’ both call out the cult for exactly what it is and the harm it is doing young people.

As you seem to be in the US, try https://genspect.org/ they have some vocal conservative supporters &, like everyone who isn't instantly Affirming, they get baselessly accused of "transphobia" but don't be scared off by any of that, they've been a great help to many parents in situations like yours.

There's a book, When Kids Say They're Trans, by Sasha Ayad https://sashaayad.com/ Lisa Marchianno https://lisamarchiano.com/ & Stella O'Malley of Genspect that you might find helpful.

If you want to read about the theory & politics of trans beyond the PR, Alex Byrne's Trouble with Gender & the Substacks by Jesse Singal & Ben Ryan are particularly helpful from a US perspective.

Be as normal as you can, worrying yourself into flakiness won't help either you or her; deep breaths, regular meals, exercise, hydration, & sensible bedtimes. The more this announcement visibly affects you, the more powerful it will seem to your daughter. Stay normie!

Good luck.

Are you in America OP? I ask because of the mention of fourth grade. If so, some of the resources posters usually refer to on here might be of limited use (but give them a look).

In the immediate term, I wouldn't argue or push her away, or try to isolate her from her friends. That is likely to backfire and cement you in her head as the enemy who is not to be listened to.

I would, for now, simply say that it is too big a decision to make at this age and you love her but will be continuing to use her name etc. And then I would get her some age-appropriate books about puberty / her body / sexuality.

At this age I expect this is likely to be more of a transient phase, so until it proves otherwise I would continue gently pushing back and subtly providing guidance in the form of books etc and seeing where it goes.

Being a woman means you have the potential to produce large gametes and that's about it, I think.

I would introduce her to research about the sexes, eg. researchers found four personality/interest types:

1. neither stereotypically male nor female,
2. mixed male- and female-stereotyped traits,
3. stereotypically male,
4. stereotypically female.

Men were more common at the extreme end of the “male-stereotyped” group and women at the extreme end of the “female-stereotyped” group, but people of each sex appeared in every group pretty evenly. Overall, differences within men or within women were much larger than the average difference between men and women. Given this, where would she locate non-binary people? Who is male and female given that only at the extreme ends "gender" neatly maps onto sex? Are we all trans?

What I meant about being LGBT-friendly as a family basically means she’s never heard us say anything negative about acquaintances, etc. who are lesbian and gay.
LGB is very different to being trans or non-binary since the latter aren’t sexualities.

I’d be concerned about her friends too. I wouldn’t be concerned about her being called “AJ” rather than “Amelia Jane” since many preteens experiment with a new variation of their name but it sounds like she wants to fit in with her friends rather than enjoy being her actual self. Peer pressure is tough but this could all end up in a place where she can’t go back which would be sad for her and you.

I'd try and keep gender out of the conversation entirely and focus on your child's own individuality as a person and the things they are good at and enjoy. I'd stick with calling them their initials or another nickname though.

It sounds like you know quite a few people in that community. I mean someone saying they're 'pansexual' is just a modern attention seeking way of saying you're bi. And why even talk about the fact you fancy both sexes? It's not like it's revolutionary or Avant Garde.

So just treat the trans thing like it doesn't really matter. It's not of any interest. If she gets lots of attention about it it could reinforce the idea that to believe irrational things about your body makes you cool or special.

There's some good advice already OP. She's 11 so still a young child and this is an adult ideology. It does sound as if she's being impacted by her 2 friends from what you say. While it's right to be cautious about simply forbidding her to see them, as her parent it's your responsibility to guide her through this and steering her away from a self obsession with gender confusion is the responsible thing to do. If she's busy with hobbies, interests and family activities then she's less time to spend with these self obsessed children.
Making sure that she is involved in family life as much as is possible. Doing things with her, restricting online as much as is possible and finding opportunities to get her involved in activities, hobbies, anything that helps her look outwards and see herself as part of groups /communities rather than self obsessing about pronouns.

I attach a couple of useful pieces about the negative psychological impact of pretending to children that they can change sex. The first is for younger children and the second's about teenagers:

https://www.transgendertrend.com/childhood-social-transition/

https://www.transgendertrend.com/teenager-says-theyre-transgender/

Good luck.