Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Are we extremist and fanatical?

598 replies

RogueFemale · 19/12/2025 20:06

We, as in gender critical/sex realist women.

I saw an old schoolfriend today, to exchange Christmas gifts over tea and biscuits. She's highly educated and intelligent, v. firmly feminist (in the sense of anti-patriarchy, and wanting women to use Ms not Miss or Mrs). Has travelled widely, knows a lot about other cultures etc.

Politics came up and I mentioned Phillipson blocking the ECHR guidance, and how I wasn't happy about it.

Turns out she thinks my gender critical views are extremist and fanatical. Actual words. I knew already she was inclined to the 'be kind' end of the spectrum, and that we disagreed, but this was new - that I'm an extremist.

That I was being unkind and TiM had a right to exist (I said of course they do, but...). That I should keep my views to myself, if I didn't want to be regarded as a nasty person, essentially.

I said, 'you don't understand'. She was having none of it, said she understands very well, and how there's been gender fluidity since time began. (And these poor TiM have nowhere to pee if they can't go in the ladies, as they'll get abused if they go in the mens).

But she really doesn't understand what is happening now.

I tried to tell her about autogynophilia, about how TiM have been attacking women who protest, the pattern these men have of abuse convictions, same as all men, etc. I said I could send her stuff to prove my points, she said, please don't.

Just a bit depressed to be told by an old friend that I'm a fanatical extremist weirdo, really.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
8
Helleofabore · 24/12/2025 07:47

Waitwhat23 · 24/12/2025 07:42

Something in the way of a Google doc must be possible. With a big siren and flashing lights alert sent as a notification to the chosen poster's phone, with a loud voice announcement which bellows 'your turn! Post quickly! And *no swearing!!'

That'll learn us to post in an orderly fashion.

Will the google doc also pre assess the posts to make sure they don’t express negative reaction to the wrong person though?

Shedmistress · 24/12/2025 07:54

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 07:18

Maybe that’s a regional use that didn’t translate. I used it in the sense ‘one of those threads everyone anticipates with eagerness’. Not ‘good’ as in ‘great’.

I am afraid I completely lose track of user names, there have been so many here over the years I just tune them all out and even people I've had stinking several day long arguments with I don't remember their user names and I certainly don't cross reference posting styles with their new names. I don't anticipate any poster, batshit crazy or not, with eagerness [or any poster in particular apart from the poems or one liners that I write down for future use in my pottery].

You accuse me of disingenousness but you are projecting your own whatevers onto me. So if you are accusing people on here of a deluge of hate you really do need to give some examples.

Waitwhat23 · 24/12/2025 07:58

Helleofabore · 24/12/2025 07:47

Will the google doc also pre assess the posts to make sure they don’t express negative reaction to the wrong person though?

Ooh, bit more complicated. A scanning system for negativity, cross referenced with a flouncing/'don't @ me' list, perhaps?

bumblingbovine49 · 24/12/2025 08:25

DontGoJasonWaterfalls · 20/12/2025 10:16

Different moderation policies 🤷‍♀️ Mumsnet could turn around and ban anyone who says trans women are women, they just choose not to. The mods on trans Reddit have chosen to ban gender critical voices.

The different moderation policies doesn't change the fact that both spaces are echo chambers; whether it's enforced through moderation or ridicule.

I'm sorry but are you really equating banning someone with ridiculing their views? In the context of a political , cultural and/or religious belief? I don't mean aggressive direct personal threats or threats of violence, I just mean ridiculing and making fun of ,or dismissing as ridiculous someone's belief ?

I am aware that the latter is not nice behaviour and may well not be welcoming or be conducive to convincing someone of your views but really banning and ridiculing are the same?

People can ridicule my beliefs if they want to and that might upset me but as long as I am able ( or want ) to engage with the person ridiculing me, I have the right and ability to defend myself. I just need the courage and will to do so. Once I am banned, my choice on whether to reply to the ridicule or not is taken from me

They really are not and they don't have the same result either

Brefugee · 24/12/2025 08:40

ArabellaSaurus · 24/12/2025 07:32

I've always thought a rota would be good but nobody listens. 😔

nah - typical "women's work" arranging rotas and acting kindly and playing nice

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 09:15

Shedmistress · 24/12/2025 07:54

I am afraid I completely lose track of user names, there have been so many here over the years I just tune them all out and even people I've had stinking several day long arguments with I don't remember their user names and I certainly don't cross reference posting styles with their new names. I don't anticipate any poster, batshit crazy or not, with eagerness [or any poster in particular apart from the poems or one liners that I write down for future use in my pottery].

You accuse me of disingenousness but you are projecting your own whatevers onto me. So if you are accusing people on here of a deluge of hate you really do need to give some examples.

Sorry, I don’t believe you. You just want an argument here. I’d be most surprised if you don’t know who Tandora is.

Shedmistress · 24/12/2025 09:23

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 09:15

Sorry, I don’t believe you. You just want an argument here. I’d be most surprised if you don’t know who Tandora is.

I know Tandora is some TRA but I stopped reading their words yonks ago. I mean I saw that name and thought 'blast from the past'. Had no idea they were still knocking about here.

Maybe if you'd just posted your evidence instead of keeping on posting how we should go and search every thread until we find it for you, it would have saved you some time? You seem to know all the threads with all the 'abuse' so just post a link to one.

5128gap · 24/12/2025 09:40

I'm sure Tandora knows from experience that when she starts threads or joins discussions her posts will recieve a lot of engagement, and that the majority of people will be in disagreement with her on this board. She is not a new person, tentatively finding there way onto this board, saying something 'wrong' and being hunted down for it, which I think is where we came in?
She is a poster who has things she wants to say to GC people, posts at length, and presumably intends people to read and engage, question and 'unpick' or why bother? This is after all a discussion forum not a lecture theatre.
How @MobyTick would it be better for people to respond? For people to ignore her? For people to pretend to agree with her? Obviously there should be no ad hom attacks, but beyond that, what should be different?

KitWyn · 24/12/2025 10:09

5128gap · 24/12/2025 09:40

I'm sure Tandora knows from experience that when she starts threads or joins discussions her posts will recieve a lot of engagement, and that the majority of people will be in disagreement with her on this board. She is not a new person, tentatively finding there way onto this board, saying something 'wrong' and being hunted down for it, which I think is where we came in?
She is a poster who has things she wants to say to GC people, posts at length, and presumably intends people to read and engage, question and 'unpick' or why bother? This is after all a discussion forum not a lecture theatre.
How @MobyTick would it be better for people to respond? For people to ignore her? For people to pretend to agree with her? Obviously there should be no ad hom attacks, but beyond that, what should be different?

Possibly our new mantra should be, if ever anyone posts something we disagree with (however dangerous, nonsensical and without any evidence):

'No debate. Only placate!'

And if we still want to make a reply that isn't warm and supportive, we should stop and reflect on these violent unfeminine impulses. First we must read all the existing replies and remember no more than 3 meanie responses are permitted. And there must be a minimum of 60 minutes delay between their times of posting.

Anything else would be coordinated bullying.

Helleofabore · 24/12/2025 10:19

5128gap · 24/12/2025 09:40

I'm sure Tandora knows from experience that when she starts threads or joins discussions her posts will recieve a lot of engagement, and that the majority of people will be in disagreement with her on this board. She is not a new person, tentatively finding there way onto this board, saying something 'wrong' and being hunted down for it, which I think is where we came in?
She is a poster who has things she wants to say to GC people, posts at length, and presumably intends people to read and engage, question and 'unpick' or why bother? This is after all a discussion forum not a lecture theatre.
How @MobyTick would it be better for people to respond? For people to ignore her? For people to pretend to agree with her? Obviously there should be no ad hom attacks, but beyond that, what should be different?

Tandora has stated very clearly that Tandora’s reason for posting on FWR is to educate us. I believe also there has been a statement about clearing up ‘misinformation’. Both of these requires interaction otherwise is it is a one way broadcast.

So yes, you are very right to point that out. Tandora participates on threads with the full expectation of interaction that will be negative and positive.

MyAmpleSheep · 24/12/2025 10:19

KitWyn · 24/12/2025 10:09

Possibly our new mantra should be, if ever anyone posts something we disagree with (however dangerous, nonsensical and without any evidence):

'No debate. Only placate!'

And if we still want to make a reply that isn't warm and supportive, we should stop and reflect on these violent unfeminine impulses. First we must read all the existing replies and remember no more than 3 meanie responses are permitted. And there must be a minimum of 60 minutes delay between their times of posting.

Anything else would be coordinated bullying.

no more than 3 meanie responses are permitted.

Two. Three is a pile on.

Waitwhat23 · 24/12/2025 10:26

No debate!
Otherwise it's a 'pile on'!
Thus, only placate!

Wait your turn, ladies!
As your allocated time
Has not started yet!

5128gap · 24/12/2025 10:30

I think its also useful to remember that the bar for self expression and accurate language on this board is very high. It may feel a bit like 'a pile on' if you use phrases such as 'living as a woman' or 'gender' in place of 'sex', casually as part of a wider point, and then get half a dozen people asking you 'how do you live as a woman?' Or 'define gender'.
However, this is an issue where language has been absolutely central and has been used as a tool and a weapon. So what might appear to be pedantry for the sake of 'belittling' or 'picking over' a post, is actually someone flagging up sonething really important to the debate.

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 11:13

Shedmistress · 24/12/2025 09:23

I know Tandora is some TRA but I stopped reading their words yonks ago. I mean I saw that name and thought 'blast from the past'. Had no idea they were still knocking about here.

Maybe if you'd just posted your evidence instead of keeping on posting how we should go and search every thread until we find it for you, it would have saved you some time? You seem to know all the threads with all the 'abuse' so just post a link to one.

Sigh

ArabellaSaurus · 24/12/2025 11:22

Waitwhat23 · 24/12/2025 07:42

Something in the way of a Google doc must be possible. With a big siren and flashing lights alert sent as a notification to the chosen poster's phone, with a loud voice announcement which bellows 'your turn! Post quickly! And *no swearing!!'

That'll learn us to post in an orderly fashion.

Tannoy announcement:

Polite rebuttal in Aisle 3, Sex and Gendah, ai repeat, polite rebuttal needed.

We could also have a '6 comments or fewer' aisle thread.

And 'self service' where we just argue with ourselves.

ArabellaSaurus · 24/12/2025 11:29

5128gap · 24/12/2025 10:30

I think its also useful to remember that the bar for self expression and accurate language on this board is very high. It may feel a bit like 'a pile on' if you use phrases such as 'living as a woman' or 'gender' in place of 'sex', casually as part of a wider point, and then get half a dozen people asking you 'how do you live as a woman?' Or 'define gender'.
However, this is an issue where language has been absolutely central and has been used as a tool and a weapon. So what might appear to be pedantry for the sake of 'belittling' or 'picking over' a post, is actually someone flagging up sonething really important to the debate.

Also some of us are just pedantic. 😁

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 11:30

ArabellaSaurus · 24/12/2025 11:22

Tannoy announcement:

Polite rebuttal in Aisle 3, Sex and Gendah, ai repeat, polite rebuttal needed.

We could also have a '6 comments or fewer' aisle thread.

And 'self service' where we just argue with ourselves.

So is this belittling? Just asking. It doesn’t really encourage further engagement. Does it give you a feeling of satisfaction?

Waitwhat23 · 24/12/2025 11:32

Uh oh, Arabella! You're failing in your role as discussion support human!

To the 'be kind' chamber for reeducation!

Shedmistress · 24/12/2025 11:44

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 11:30

So is this belittling? Just asking. It doesn’t really encourage further engagement. Does it give you a feeling of satisfaction?

Sigh

5128gap · 24/12/2025 12:00

ArabellaSaurus · 24/12/2025 11:29

Also some of us are just pedantic. 😁

Define pedantic.

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 12:01

Waitwhat23 · 24/12/2025 11:32

Uh oh, Arabella! You're failing in your role as discussion support human!

To the 'be kind' chamber for reeducation!

Yep. Great standard of debate! The best robustness! 🙄

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 12:06

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Shedmistress · 24/12/2025 12:06

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 12:01

Yep. Great standard of debate! The best robustness! 🙄

Is it as robust as 'You are all evil abusers'...'Show us where'...Sigh?

PrettyDamnCosmic · 24/12/2025 12:08

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

To me, this is just childish. I just want to be able to have a discussion without wading through nonsense like this. Not possible here then?

Not for those without a sense of humour.

MobyTick · 24/12/2025 12:09

Shedmistress · 24/12/2025 12:06

Is it as robust as 'You are all evil abusers'...'Show us where'...Sigh?

Never said “You are all evil abusers” - why lie?

Swipe left for the next trending thread