It was all a fever dream guys, don't know what you are all on about...<whistles and kicks floor>

[Shedmistress]

Stephen Whittle the Ex President of WPATH declares it never happened.

And if it did happen you made it up to make her and her ilk look bad.

I would never celebrate anyone else's medical problems, not even if it was someone trans who was suffering from a medical problem that sex realists had warned them about, and not even if that trans person had insulted, threatened and accused of lying the very people who warned them. Partly because I am not a nasty and cruel person, partly because the next stage of all this - I fear - is a bunch of seriously damaged people who were warned not to self-harm getting massive payouts from our NHS to compensate them for the damage done.

BUT -

(1) It seems to me almost certain that PBs and wrong sex hormones (let alone surgeries) do all sorts of damage. How much brain damage we do not know, nor do we know for sure whether it can bring on dementia. In a world where I am practically certain the harms are massive (albeit without the very good evidence I would like to see) then having the harms shown or better still proven is a good thing. Either we go on harming new trans people every single day indefinitely, or we see harms publicized and those harms eventually lead to regulation and new harms to new transitioners stopping. One could make a strong argument that every example of harm is good because it causes the end to be nearer.

(2) I believe that the wider societal harms of gender ideology are massive, and (to some extent) the more medical harm is shown to be done to trans people, the more likely it is that the wider societal harms of gender ideology are reduced as a side effect of future reductions in levels of medicalization.

Whittle is a nasty evil piece of work. I don’t wish ill on many people, but I fully make an exception for her.

Recent exchange on X:

Whittle: 'Some people, all too quickly, forget the promise they made when their baby was born “I will do anything for you to be happy” - a commitment to letting a child grow, boundaries that do not destroy their imagination, & make no expectations of them beyond becoming a good citizen'

Other Xer:( No one is telling children that they are not valued- growing up is confusing for many children & it’s the role of parents to help & support their children them And some that support may involve saying “no”)

Whittle: 'I have no problem with that, but good parenting also includes recognising a young person’s developing autonomy. How do we support their mental as well as physical wellbeing? By being open to many possibilities, with our hands outstretched. & ready to catch them when they fall'

I mean these are platitudes. But bear in mind the discussion in question is whether a two year old child shoudl be affirmed when he says he's a girl.

“I will do anything for you to be happy”

Is a strangely controlling and pointless phrase. One can't make one's child happy. One can ensure their safety, do one's best, nurture, coach, teach, care for them.

'By being open to many possibilities'

Yes. But changing sex is not a possibility.

I must be a crap mother. I never made that promise to my child. I don’t tend to make empty promises that I know I cannot keep.

“I will do anything for you to be happy” means ice cream for every meal until your child develops scurvy.

Being a parent means knowing that children haven’t a clue about the long term effects of their ever changing desires. And your job as a parent is to be the boundary until they learn these things for themselves.

Whittle hasn’t the faintest clue. Idiot, as well as evil.

OMG that was amazing!

Ben Leo did a phenomenal job here. His pauses and his calmness (in contrast to his Webberley interview).... followed by "you are off your rocker. You are mad" were spot on.

He doesn't need an in depth knowledge of the subject here to expose how utterly bonkers it sounds, just common sense.

boundaries that do not destroy their imagination

I'm finding this hilarious... is it a tacit acknowledgment that "what sex they think they are" is based in the imagination?

What if they imagined that the boiling kettle was full of magic sparkles that should be sprinkled all over them? I'm really happy to destroy that aspect of their imagination.

I know it's a breathtakingly stupid comment anyway but still made me chuckle.

It's nuts. Imagination needs no boundaries. Imagination is free and unfettered. Real life, meanwhile, has boundaries, and part of those are learning to discern what is real life and what is imagination.

Whittle definitely seems to lack the ability to tell the difference.

Whittle thinks that cutting her breasts off and growing a beard means she is a man, so very much lacking in ability to tell the difference between make believe and reality.

Whittle is also remembered for suggesting on an MN thread that if Girl Guides / Guide officers on camp were wary of sharing sleeping space with males, they could protect themselves by wearing sturdy pyjamas.

WHAT?

Whittle also is upfront in stating how much sex she used to have at Scout camps where she (was she a GG?) would have sex with different scouts at the camp. I do wonder about that and what that might have been an indicator of.

Unlike her, we remember things.

And we keep receipts. We didn’t have the quote function back in 2018, so standard procedure was to copy the comment you were replying to & bold it. The bolded comment is from another MNer. Whittle’s reply is from Really? onwards.

There are plenty of people out there with very strange, misguided beliefs. The crucial thing is why the government and NHS supported these beliefs and listened to these people when making law and policy.

As I said above, Whittle and Press for Change were heavily involved in the NHS trans-related policies that came out under cover of darkness in 2007-ish. Inquiring minds would like to know how this happened.

https://translucent.org.uk/welcome-to-translucent-stephen-whittle

'From 2014-2018 Stephen served on NHS England’s Gender Identity Services Clinical Strategic Commissioning Group for the Department of Health. He is now Chair and Non-Executive Director of Indigo, Greater Manchester’s NHS Transgender Health service.

Article from two years ago.

https://transactual.org.uk/nhse-adult-service-review/

'Expected in January – March 2025:

Report into the responses to the survey.
Reports on each of the NHS England gender clinics
An overall report of the findings of the independent review into the clinics.
Review of the evidence around hormone therapy for trans people.

Later in 2025:

Consultation a draft version of the updated non-surgical service specification.
Publication of the updated non-surgical service specification.
Consultation on a new national policy on masculinising and feminising hormones.
Publication of the national policy on masculinising and feminising hormones.

There has also been a lot of talk about an 18-25s ‘follow through’ gender service. We are seeking clarity on what this will be and who it will be for.'

It's all gone very quiet on the Levy Review front.

Can't find any mention of Whittle (or anyone, for that matter) on the NHS Indigo Services webpage.

https://indigogenderservice.uk/search?search_paths%5B%5D=&query=whittle

FOI here shares evaluations of three gender clinics, but maybe worth a different thread.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/pilotgenderclinicevaluationr

I see the NHS are still signposting to 'naked weekends'.

https://indigogenderservice.uk/further-information-and-support/additional-support/trans-non-binary-support

https://www.transbareall.co.uk/weekends

Whatever could go wrong?

Oh my goodness!! TWO!!

I am lost for words.

She needs to understand that it is not healthcare and there are no ‘trans’ two year olds - that is shocking.

She seems to hate female people as much as Webberley does.

She seems to hate female people as much as Webberley does.