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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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nauticant · 07/11/2025 13:46

The content of the script is relevant. If she had been presented with a racist diatribe should she have read it like a robot?

Dollymylove · 07/11/2025 13:50

Very quiet on the editing of the Donald Trump speech though, yep?

NoFineBalance · 07/11/2025 14:20

Grammarnut · 07/11/2025 12:56

I agree and I support her correction. But she also screwed up her face which many will have interpreted as showing an opinion re 'pregnant people', which she should not have shown because the phrase is political and she showed she had chosen a side. No matter how much I agree with her, and she's right it's an expression that erases women in the most important function our bodies have, she still showed bias and people will have complained, some of whom agree that it's a demeaning phrase but still picking up on bias. The BBC needs to get shot of the ideologues who produce this rubbish, of course, and go back to using the proper words - because not doing so shows that the BBC is biased, too.

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She didn't screw up her face. She raised her eyebrow slightly and her eyes widened slightly. That could easily have been a reaction to her correcting the script on the hop because it contained a typo/mistake - rather than her making a value judgment on the mistake.

StarlightRobot · 07/11/2025 14:27

Shelagh Fogarty right now ❤️❤️❤️

BundleBoogie · 07/11/2025 14:29

NoFineBalance · 07/11/2025 14:20

She didn't screw up her face. She raised her eyebrow slightly and her eyes widened slightly. That could easily have been a reaction to her correcting the script on the hop because it contained a typo/mistake - rather than her making a value judgment on the mistake.

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Yes, I think it might be called an ‘eyebrow flash’ where you just widen your eyes and raise your eyebrows for a split second.

BoreOfWhabylon · 07/11/2025 14:30

Bloody man telling Shelagh that he doesn't see why "cis" women should object to transwomen in their spaces!

NoFineBalance · 07/11/2025 14:31

BundleBoogie · 07/11/2025 14:29

Yes, I think it might be called an ‘eyebrow flash’ where you just widen your eyes and raise your eyebrows for a split second.

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Thank you! Eyebrow flash, exactly!

Floisme · 07/11/2025 14:33

Grammarnut · 07/11/2025 13:01

I do see it as factually correct and I support the correction. It's her expression which shows that she has chosen a side in a political debate which she is not supposed to do. It infuriates me when other commentators, readers, interviewers clearly agree with a political position I don't agree with and I would like them to be impartial. That means objecting all bias not just the bias I don't agree with. The BBC needs now to stop pandering to a vociferous minority of a minorty and use the proper words, remembering that women are the majority of their viewers and a growing number of them are fed-up with being erased.

Edited
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It's her expression which shows that she has chosen a side in a political debate which she is not supposed to do.
I think that's a fair point actually. I'm still inclined to think it's unreasonable to expect someone to spot and then immediately correct an egregious piece of activist nonsense while all the time keeping a poker straight face. But I do see what you're saying.

Brefugee · 07/11/2025 14:37

Dianaofthelakeofshiningwaters · 06/11/2025 14:08

The BBC are so out of touch with what people actually think. They are their very own echo chamber. I used to have respect for them, now they are just an embarrassment.

Your BBC - you're joking!!

to be fair: you wouldn't want a newsreader reporting on Nigel Farage's activities with a huge grin and nodding along?

They are absolutely completely and utterly wrong in this case. But there are standards of neutrality that need to be kept. (so Pregnant Women is correct and neutral, pregnant people isn't common parlance)

Brefugee · 07/11/2025 14:38

TheCatsTongue · 06/11/2025 14:16

So when she said she was excited that Boris Johnson had resigned as PM that was OK and impartial, but to correct "pregnant people" as "women" is not impartial?

did she say that during a news broadcast? Was she disciplined for it?

HaveYouActuallyDoneAnyWashingThisWeekMum · 07/11/2025 14:41

@Grammarnut How could any thinking person not show bias when being required to read the words pregnant people?

The BBC is acting as if pregnant people is a common phrase that makes sense but it’s not and it doesn’t, which means it doesn’t readily trip off the tongue. It’d be like having to read the words gin and coke or fish and spaghetti rather than gin and tonic and fish and chips.

The organisation is showing bias by using pregnant people in the first place because it’s not a neutral phrase, it’s ideologically loaded and actually makes no sense but has decided to victim switch here and try to gaslight not only Martine but all of us.

(edited to remove some strange arrows)

EasternStandard · 07/11/2025 14:59

HaveYouActuallyDoneAnyWashingThisWeekMum · 07/11/2025 14:41

@Grammarnut How could any thinking person not show bias when being required to read the words pregnant people?

The BBC is acting as if pregnant people is a common phrase that makes sense but it’s not and it doesn’t, which means it doesn’t readily trip off the tongue. It’d be like having to read the words gin and coke or fish and spaghetti rather than gin and tonic and fish and chips.

The organisation is showing bias by using pregnant people in the first place because it’s not a neutral phrase, it’s ideologically loaded and actually makes no sense but has decided to victim switch here and try to gaslight not only Martine but all of us.

(edited to remove some strange arrows)

Edited

Yes it’s incorrect. It’s like asking someone to say 2+2=5 then monitoring their facial reaction.

The whole set up is madness. Why are we even continuing with the Orwellian situation at this point

UnintentionalArcher · 07/11/2025 14:59

Heggettypeg · 06/11/2025 14:06

The phrase pregnant people "indicates a particular viewpoint". It's not normal, natural or neutral usage

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I agree. I am not ‘gender critical’, as I believe the phrase is, but this is ridiculous.

SternJoyousBeev2 · 07/11/2025 15:06

BunfightBetty · 06/11/2025 14:08

Exactly!

The BBC do themselves no favours with this. It’s like those in charge are trying to lose public confidence and the licence fee.

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I’ve already said on a similar thread that as soon as I am out of contract with Sky TV I will be cancelling my tv licence.

Brefugee · 07/11/2025 15:26

Kimura · 07/11/2025 13:34

Croxall's answer to the complaint was that the language in her script had been lifted directly from an external press release, rather than being rewritten in the BBC house style, which is what threw her off and caused her to react.

And again, the content of the script was irrelevant - her job was to read it impartially, she didn't, and that's what this telling off was for.

People seem desperate to frame this as her being dragged over the coals for showing distain towards the 'pregnant people' language, when that simply isn't the case.

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you keep flogging that dead sheep. Horse. Donkey. Whatever it is.

We all know that only women get pregnant, and anyone with a trans identity who says they are is lying to themselves and everyone else.

And as i keep saying: ANY transman in posession of a GRC who then gets pregnant and gives birth should have that GRC revoked permanently.

EasternStandard · 07/11/2025 16:14

SternJoyousBeev2 · 07/11/2025 15:06

I’ve already said on a similar thread that as soon as I am out of contract with Sky TV I will be cancelling my tv licence.

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Yep it helps to be free from it.

hellowhaaat3632 · 07/11/2025 16:24

Politicians247UnderwearExtinguishingService · 06/11/2025 14:21

If they don't think that viewers want their news read by human people with normal human expressions on their normal human faces, why don't they just build some kind of newsbot, plug it straight into their computer and be done with it all?

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God don't give them ideas

NorthernBogbean · 07/11/2025 17:10

Kimura · 07/11/2025 13:34

Croxall's answer to the complaint was that the language in her script had been lifted directly from an external press release, rather than being rewritten in the BBC house style, which is what threw her off and caused her to react.

And again, the content of the script was irrelevant - her job was to read it impartially, she didn't, and that's what this telling off was for.

People seem desperate to frame this as her being dragged over the coals for showing distain towards the 'pregnant people' language, when that simply isn't the case.

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Okay. I can't think of any other instances in which a newsreader has been complained about and then investigated by their employer for being briefly flummoxed by an unexpected word on the autocue.

The content isn't irrelevant.

Lulumush · 07/11/2025 17:13

🫶🫶🫶🫶 I 😍 Martine. Screw the BBC. Makes me so angry they are bowing to such bollocks.

DuesToTheDirt · 07/11/2025 17:50

Just saw this...

Martine Croxall was out of order, says the BBC
Grammarnut · 07/11/2025 19:56

HaveYouActuallyDoneAnyWashingThisWeekMum · 07/11/2025 14:41

@Grammarnut How could any thinking person not show bias when being required to read the words pregnant people?

The BBC is acting as if pregnant people is a common phrase that makes sense but it’s not and it doesn’t, which means it doesn’t readily trip off the tongue. It’d be like having to read the words gin and coke or fish and spaghetti rather than gin and tonic and fish and chips.

The organisation is showing bias by using pregnant people in the first place because it’s not a neutral phrase, it’s ideologically loaded and actually makes no sense but has decided to victim switch here and try to gaslight not only Martine but all of us.

(edited to remove some strange arrows)

Edited

I agree. But she's not supposed to show that. She's meant to be impartial.

ItsCoolForCats · 07/11/2025 20:34

Igneococcus · 07/11/2025 19:56

Fantastic article, thanks for the share token. I didn't realise Michael Prescott would be presenting his report to the culture, media and sport select committee next week.

Hopefully that means this story is not going to quietly go away and be dismissed as a smear by right-wing media.

borntobequiet · 07/11/2025 20:42

Great article. Everything we’ve been saying about the BBC for years.