"Darlington Nurses" vs County Durham and Darlington NHS Trust Tribunal Thread 6

[ThreeWordHarpy]

Thread 1, 7-Oct to 23-Oct; pre-hearing discussion, KD (day 1 of evidence) and BH (day 2).
Thread 2, 23-Oct to 28-Oct; BH (day 2), CH, JP, MG (day 3&4), TH, SS, ST, LL (day 4), JS, AT (day 5)
Thread 3, 28-Oct to 29-Oct; AT (day 5&6), TA (day 6&7)
Thread 4, 29-Oct to 31-Oct; TA, AM (day 7) JB (day 8)
Thread 5, 31-Oct to 04-Nov; JB (day 8), SW, CG, JR (day 9)

Five nurses working at Darlington Memorial Hospital have filed a legal case suing their employer, an NHS trust, for sexual harassment and sex discrimination. The nurses object to sharing the women’s changing facilities with a male colleague, Rose, who identifies as female. The hearing started on October 20th, with evidence starting on October 22nd and is scheduled to last 3 weeks. To view the hearing online requests for access had to be made by October 17th. The hearing is being live tweeted by Tribunal Tweets who have background to this case on their substack. An alternative to X is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

The Judge made clear at the start of the public hearing on Day 1 that only TT or press have permission to tweet. If online observers see/hear something in the court that isn’t reported by TT, we don’t mention it until the next time there’s a break. This is a very cautious approach to avoid any accusations of “live reporting” on MN. Commentary on the content of TT tweets is fine as soon as they’re posted on X.

Key people:
C/Ns - Claimants, the Darlington nurses
R/T/Trust - Respondent, County Durham and Darlington NHS Foundation Trust
J/EJ – Judge/Employment Judge Seamus Sweeney
NF - Niazi Fetto KC, barrister for claimants
SC - Simon Cheetham, KC, barrister for respondents
RH - Rose Henderson, trans identifying nurse
CG – Clare Gregory, NHS ward manager
SW - Sue Williams, NHS Trust HR
KD – Karen Danson, first claimant to give evidence.
BH – Bethany Hutchison, claimant
AH – Alistair Hutchison, husband of Bethany
CH – Carly Hoy, claimant
JP – Jane Peveller, claimant
MG – Mary Anne (aka Annice) Grundy, claimant
TH – Tracy Hooper, claimant
SS – Siobhan Sinclair, witness for the claimants, retired from Trust
ST – Sharron Trevarrow, witness for the claimants, retired from Trust, former housekeeper and wellbeing officer
LL – Lisa Lockey, claimant
JP – Professor Jo Phoenix, expert witness
JS – Jane Shields, witness for the claimants
AT - Andrew Thacker, NHS trust Head of HR
TA – Tracy Atkinson, NHS trust HR.
AM – Andrew Moore, NHS Head of Workforce Experience
JB – Jillian Bailey, NHS Workforce Experience Manager
AT – Anna Telfer, NHS Deputy Director of Nursing
SW – Sandra Watson, Matron for General and Elective Surgery
JR – Jodie Robinson, manager of Rose

how can you have dysphoria about the lack of something!!

I see the BBC has gone for the most trans friendly supporting headline it could muster 🙄

"Trans medic used changing room for years" the trouble is that what's some of the management kept saying too.

www.bbc.com/news/articles/c8dr0geyp1mo

Presumably when CC say 'Rose admitted today' they mean by swearing oath on statement from which this is taken, because we didn't hear this?

Why?
She willingly married him.

This Gender Identity fuckery has caused untold damage and misery to women.

BUT… if it weren’t for GI and its spectacular excesses, exquisite little gems like this post would never have come into being. I would never have discovered the joys of Mumsnet and the camaraderie and humour of these superb threads. And I (being but a lowly innocent migrant) would never have learned the word “norkage”.

There was that brief period in 1979 when I was really pissed off I had to use an old washing up bottle filled with coloured water to write my name in the snow whilst all the boys used their willies.

Not sure If I'd call it dysphoric though. More envious!

They must do. They will have the statements.

I did wonder if I'd momentarily zoned out as I didn't think I'd heard him say it.

I've always regretted not being able to write my name in the snow 😩

The washing up bottle filled with water with added food colouring held at crotch level works exceedingly well.

But it needs to be one of the old big Fairy ones if you have a long name.

Makes notes...

I have been informed that (in childhood) my MIL managed to pee up a wall. Apparently, there's a knack to it.

This sort...

Ooh, a couple of things for a dull evening.

Thanks Largesso. I guess my concern is that the alleged staring and comments can easily be framed as over-sensitivity, paranoia or bigotry, even from a group of individual witnesses.

He suggested Karen Danson, who heard him asking if she was going to undress, overheard an innocent convo between him and a friend. The implication being that her childhood experience of abuse primed her to misinterpret his words. Karen herself stated she was alone with him, so this is a clear instance of he said vs she said (unless they manage to call this friend as a witness I guess?)

I think with this story, he's seeding the notion that even if individual nurses sincerely believed these events happened, he wasn't the cause - in the same way that the innocent actions of a black man are interpreted as threatening by racists.

That's why I feel whatever happened inside the changing room is a red herring. His very presence as a male is the issue - not whether he was well behaved, intact or castrated, or wearing frilly knickers or boxers at the time.

I get why the nurses' team are emphasising his maleness through these details - his presence in a female changing room was clearly outrageous - but I also feel going down this path gets us into "trutrans v faketrans".

Someone tried to describe his jewellery earlier.
The pendant is Arwen Evenstar's, from the films of the Lord of the Rings.

The most beautiful woman/elf in Middle Earth.

Given to Aragon as a sign of her love.

Completely made up for the film, it's simply described as a "white gem on a chain" in the books.

The whole image is carefully curated, from the jewellery to the hair flicks to the handbag that none of the female witnesses took to the stand to the nails he checked while waiting for the judge to decide if he had any questions.

It's fakery. All of it.

The articles where Rose is quoted as saying that "I'm not the person I've been painted to be"...well mate, since you've shoved yourself where women didn't want you, and you didn't give a toss for their discomfort and unhappiness about it - obviously YOUR feelings matter more - I'd say you're EXACTLY the sort of entitled selfish little prick of a man you've been depicted as.

With a hefty dollop of "Oh, I don't know who they were" with the implication - to my mind - that they were beneath his notice.

Play stupid games win stupid prizes.

The Telegraph's take

https://archive.ph/onuEp

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/11/04/trans-nurse-didnt-think-using-female-changing-room-would-be/

Squeezing water, or whatever, out of a washing up liquid bottle isn't the same.

There was a scene in The Full Monty with a woman peeing up a wall.

That is a great double-edged headline for an article where Rose appears wearing make-up.

From the Telegraph article:

Niazi Fetto KC, on behalf of the claimants, asked: “Did you consider their perspective? What it was that was upsetting them?”
Henderson replied: “I considered their reasoning, but not to any great extent.”

Translation: "I didn't give a toss what they thought; my whims, need for validation and perceived rights were more important".

Cunt.

From the Telegraph article:

Newcastle Employment Tribunal has previously heard allegations that Henderson, who was bearded...

I don't remember that. Obviously not following closely enough.

The attempts to explain away the individual complaints as misunderstandings (they heard wrong, they saw wrong) makes him appear even more dishonest.

It's so unlikely that he would remember the exact moment and that he was talking to a colleague instead.

If that was true they would have been unremarkable and forgettable every day moments. They wouldn't be etched in his mind in that way.

Just wanting to comment on the perceptions of the women in the changing room, compared to cross exam of Rose and what his excuse /reasonings/perceptions were.

The judge can make findings of fact on what did or did not happen. But he can also side step it.

because it was obvious that distress was caused or they would not have complained on masse.

A gathering of distressed “transphobes” is neither here nor there as far as the law is concerned

And it was obvious as with Uppity, Rose had little understanding or care for that possibility.

and note of that appears to be enquired about.

in the final analysis the NHS failed to balance the protected characteristics of all the parties concerned and caused distress to all parties.

not that i give a flying fuck about rose.