TRA Trolls - can we just say NO?

[BlueEyedBogWitch]

A full thread of NO’s might be more powerful than trying to reason with someone who is not interested in reason.

Just one ‘NO’ each, until they get bored and go away. Every time.

After all, it sums up our arguments very succinctly.

So you don’t accept that there are women with trauma caused by rape, or SA, or religiously observant women, or women in abusive relationships or women who want single sex hospital wards or want women’s sports that mean there is a need for single sex spaces?

"A question containing an unjustified or controversial assumption is known as a loaded question or complex question fallacy. This type of fallacy is a manipulative tactic that forces the respondent to either accept the unproven premise by answering, or appear guilty or evasive by refusing to answer."

Exactly what is happening here.

How is that what I have done?

I’ve attempted to summarise your reasoning with no manipulation at all. I made a statement as to what I think your beliefs are. I made no value judgement on those beliefs.

no manipulation from
me.

It's a logical fallacy because in order to answer it I would have to accept its inbuilt assumption that your position on trans issues (exclusion) is somehow justified by the "needs" of "women" and to preserve "single sex" spaces.
In other words this is taken as given and then my only choice is to answer whether I believe that to be transphobic or not.
Logical fallacy.

So you don’t believe there is any need or justification for any single sex spaces?

I was talking to Helle r.e. her insistence I answer her question. I haven't followed what you have posted.

You didn’t quote her.

In fact you quoted yourself.

what I think is that this is a far more complicated / nuanced discussion that people would want it to be:

Yes I was clarifying my post to her.

In what sense?

for example I believe that female sports should absolutely be retained due to the innate advantages that the male frame has.

I competed in a sport to international level at u18 and my children in a different one also to international u18 level, with one child still competing in an international squad. And there’s no doubt that a female can’t come next to a bloke in either of them. And that in fact it would be positively dangerous for a female to compete against males.

It’s funny, almost every post you make contains behaviour whereby you accuse me of something I haven’t done. I’m not stamping my feet and getting angry, replicating posts and questions, often in oversized texts, towards the same poster because I am so desperate to force her to answer a question. All the posters goading @Tandora want to do is continue creating arguments, twisting her words and berating her. There is no genuine curiosity or desire to engage in good faith, that is crystal clear. I’m surprised she gives any of you the time of day, given the vile personal attacks launched against her on multiple threads. Pathetic behaviour from grown women who should know better.

My suggestion is that certain obsessive posters take some time away from this echo chamber and engage in real life is exactly that - a suggestion. One that would undoubtedly be better for their mental wellbeing and ability to form a coherent argument that isn’t based on name calling, bullying and hyperbole - but hey ho.

So for sports I think it would be much better for everyone , especially women, if we developed a broader range of more nuanced categories .

Also, I think the trans issue is a complete irrelevance/ distraction regarding sports.
competitions already have rules re hormone treatments etc, and there are exceptionally few trans women participating in women's sports in general, especially at a professional level

I have a coherent argument
transidentified males are not allowed in female spaces because they are male. They are not women. A woman is an adult human female Trans identifying females are allowed in female spaces because they are female. They are not men. A man is an adult human male
sorted. Now we can stop all the arguing and go abd do something fun.

No. No males in women’s sports. Not one. Sorted.

I'm so so relieved someone else can see it. Sometimes I feel like I'm going mad!

What would that broader range of more nuanced categories look like?

However there's nothing wrong with being transphobic, so it doesn't matter if it is or not.

thank you for your honesty.

So women can in some instances have single sex spaces and thats cool?

Happy days!

There could be a range of categories based on both performance and physiological metrics similar to how Paralympic categories are determined.

This post is mischaracterising people, assigning motives that are untrue, smearing, maligning, insulting, and making false accusations and assertions.

Yet more insults, smears, defamation, lies and hyperbole.

do you realise that many sportswomen postulate that that will mean that the great strides that have been made in recent years in equalising the prominence of women’s sport will be undone?