Well, hello Emma Watson

[crumpet]

www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-15130209/Harry-Potter-Emma-Watson-treasures-J-K-Rowling-trans-rights.html

So is that the same for transpeople then? You’re saying that transpeople complaining about feeling excluded should just accept society won’t bend to their will abd let them access spaces designated for the opposite sex?

I have no doubt there are quite a few celebrities who promoted trans rights because they hadn't thought it through, and essentially saw it as an extension of gay rights. Then, when cases like Lia Thomas and Isla Bryson hit the news, they privately thought, "...oh. Maybe the women I called fascists actually had a point." But they were so vociferous in criticising GC women that now they don't know how to backtrack.

(Before anyone accuses me of lumping Lia Thomas in with a rapist - I'm not saying Thomas is anywhere near as bad as Bryson. But they both brought a lot of visibility to the consequences of pretending sex doesn't exist, and they both peaked a lot of people.)

Don't be silly.

Real women should put up and shut up and accept that the world doesn't revolve around them.

Special trans women should be given everything they want, wrapped in a beautiful rainbow ribbon.

And that, my friend, is how we know they are men.

I don't know, Lia exposed himself to his female teammates in the women's locker rooms and showers. That's not equivalent to rape on the spectrum of sexual misdemeanours, but I would say it was on the spectrum.

Just because you as an individual declares that something negatively affects you - it doesn't follow that society must therefore automatically be organised in ways that also impact others. Surely you understand this basic principle?

So if a trans woman declares that having to use the male facilities negatively affects him - it doesn't follow that society must therefore automatically be organised in ways that also impact others?

I find EW annoying and incoherent, and think she should just hire a driver, given she's rich.

But I find the response to her harsh, given that she's endorsing a worldview that we'll all have to adopt en route to actual all-round sanity. Which is that TWAW and TWANW are two different belief systems whose adherents can nevertheless hold each other in esteem and affection.

TWANW people think that TWAW people (of whom EW is still one)have mistaken beliefs that harm just about everyone, and can get pretty frustrated, and criticise the beliefs as misogynistic, homophobic etc.

But TRAs think that TWANW belief is morally disgusting and an actual crime (see the recent Helen Joyce thread). That's a big difference and EW is moving away from that.

A future in which TW stick to their beliefs, and their lifestyle, but accept constraints necessitated, not just by their sex, but by other people's knowledge of their sex, is not just pie in the sky, but the only feasible outcome. And that means encouraging a pluralistic approach, not pinning our hopes on deprogramming all the believers.

TL;DR every little helps.

Did you actually read what Watson and the others said at the time about JK and how rude they were? To them JK was wrong, there was no tolerance then for them for those with differing views to them, JK was wrong, end of story

Now she changes her mind?

Surely as a democratic society we have elected representatives who have enacted laws based upon the will of the people. Things like the Equality Act that recognise the need for single sex spaces.

If you want to change the law of the land you are welcome to campaign and petition like everyone else. Maybe try honestly this time rather no debate or misconstruing the law.

Until then your opinions on what makes a woman carries no weight

Yup. One notices that even the most ardent TWAWers don't remotely believe it, because if they truly did, every now and again they'd make a decision that works out better for the Mk1 boring old cunty kind of woman.

What actually happens? They make sure that the Mk2 stunning and brave penisy kind are the ones that get pandered to. Every. Single. Fucking. Time.

Absolutely.

If trans women really were women, no one would give a shit about what they want.

Firstly, they were relatively young when they all condemned JKR and secondly I’ll refer to them how I please, thank you very much, so don’t police my language.

Do you think all 16 year old humans that haven't menstruated should be checked by a medical professional, that no 16 year old humans that haven't menstruated should be checked by a medical professional or that there is a particular group of 16 year old humans that should seek medical checks if they haven't menstruated? If the latter do you think this group is defined by biology or by liking pink things? If you acknowledge that there is a distinct category of humans that should be menstruating why do you think some people whose bodies are not of the type designed to menstruate belong in the circle of the venn diagram along with those who do a body of the type designed for menstruation? What is the grounds for their inclusion in this group?

It certainly is a science-denialist religion.

Imagine having the balls to admit it on a public forum.

It certainly is a science-denialist religion.

This was posted on Reddit about Richard Dawkins

'Look how old he is. Why are we not asking young and forward thinking scientists for their views?'

Move over Einstein, let the new kids have a crack at it 😂

It's just wall to wall Emma coverage today. Her PR does seem to know what they're doing.

I may be a bit of a sucker but I would roll out that golden bridge for Emma Watson in a heartbeat. It took some guts to attempt a reverse ferret, as she has now opened herself up to a pile-on. Certain TRAs are merciless when it comes to women who fail to toe the party line. It can’t be easy to veer from the ‘JKR is a baddie’ script when you know you’re going to upset a lot of people.

By extending a little olive branch to JKR, Emma loses her trans allyship status and puts herself at risk of TRA wrath - I think that’s a big deal. It would be huge if she and JK could be reconciled but I think it will take a lot more than this semi-reverse ferret.

No doubt.

Someone with Emma's resources and the option to just live quietly doesn't do an interview like this without substantial PR expertise and a planned strategy. She's done all this for a reason and she'll have had the best professional advice.

This is what ‘trans healthcare’ for children is though.
No human being can change sex

Children are not emotionally mature enough to make these life changing decisions.

I know which side I hear ‘ranting and raving’ and it’s not what you’re quoting

The thing is, you are allowed to decide that in your opinion, science and reality don't exist. You are allowed to pretend to believe any old shite you like. That's freedom.

But the absolute chutzpah of deciding that everyone else must play along with your nonsense opinion! That women should be legally prohibited from being able to gather without men! That they should lose their medals and their safeguards and their legal existence because of your opinion that reality doesn't matter!

I don't think any other religion has tried to force itself on people like this. They create their own spaces and don't interfere with other religions' spaces.

Oh, that one!

Yep, definitely not changing my opinion about the type of education Oxford provides

I see your point and in a way I do agree. But the amount of abuse JKR has taken, her family home address published with a bomb making guide, countless death and rape threats, sexist abuse wall to wall. In all that time, Watson stood with the bullshit, made digs and I do not recall her ever calling for the abuse to stop or acknowledging it (I guess she was worried about acknowledging that many TRAs are indeed this vicious and misogynistic). And she never had to worry about losing her job; she's a big enough name with enough millions behind her and she's a shitty actress anyway.

I can see why JKR is all out of fucks to give.

Good, because her acting and singing coaches never did.

Oh lord, it doesn't matter whether you agree with it, it's science, it's fact. Male and female just are, you can't change facts because you don't like them.