Your Corbyn/Sultana Party - Discussion thread

[fromorbit]

The new left party is going to have significant implications for gender and sex discussions on the left in the UK and in wider political debate as well. Lets talk about it.

Four of its prospective MPs are Gaza independents whose votes and comments in the Commons indicate a social conservative background . One of them Adnan Hussain has already got into a row on X with prospective members over his social conservatism.

The hilarious breakdown of the Islamo-left alliance
The progressive left has suddenly noticed that most British Muslims are not exactly woke.
This uneasy marriage got a reality check last week when a Green Party councillor and practising Muslim, Mothin Ali, appeared reluctant to sign a set of ‘pledges’ on behalf of the LGBTQIA+ Greens, Feminist Greens and other similar groups. The MP for Blackburn, ‘Gaza Independent’ Adnan Hussain, then waded into the debate. ‘It’s no secret that Muslims tend to be socially conservative’, Hussain said. ‘Is there a space on the left to create a broad enough church to allow Muslims an authentic space, just as it does other minority groups?’
https://www.spiked-online.com/2025/08/04/the-hilarious-breakdown-of-the-islamo-left-alliance/

The initial statement for Your Party focuses on poverty, fighting the system and Gaza, but makes no mention of progressive social issues, . This already signals something significant.
https://www.yourparty.uk/statement

Zarah Sultana on the other hand has already signaled out trans rights as a key principal in a recent interview which has received push back from others. Discussion here:

The Elephant in the Room for Zara Sultana’s “Your Party”
https://labourheartlands.com/the-elephant-in-the-room/
But here’s the rub. Sultana also pledged to “resolutely” advocate for a pro-trans socialist programme. She insists these discussions must happen openly and democratically.

That sounds fine in theory. In practice, the left has already shown itself utterly incapable of having this conversation without collapsing into authoritarian cancel culture.

Can the Left Have an Honest Trans Debate Without Cancelling Women?

For years, women who raise legitimate questions about the impact of gender self-ID on female-only spaces, or about the safeguarding implications highlighted by the Cass Review, have been branded as bigots and driven out of the movement. “Demonising trans people” is often code for “asking difficult but necessary questions.” If Your Party repeats this mistake, it will bleed support from countless socialist women before it even begins.

The truth is, many women will not get involved in this project precisely because of the Corbyn–Sultana line on trans issues. Others may hope the problem quietly goes away. It won’t. Nor is this a side issue: women’s rights are not negotiable add-ons to socialism; they are foundational. To ignore them is to build on sand.

TAs online and who are planning to join are already girding up for war, it is looking messy.

I can see a number of factions inside the new party who are going to make things complicated:

Muslim social conservatives - as mentioned they will be a major part of the party's voting bloc.

Old school Marxists who regard gender ideology as neo liberal capitalist identity politics and a distraction from class.

Realists who will see gender stuff as a marginal issue which needs to be sidelined because it is so toxic and unpopular with the general public.

Last but certainly not least actual left wing feminists who see through gender nonsense and are not going to be quiet about it !!

I expect fireworks over gender at the the party's initial conference supposedly to be held in November. TAs will attempt to make genderism a key principal of the party and will face resistance. Whether it happens or not it will be another nail in the TAs attempt to pretend the left inherently back neoliberal capitalist ideas like genderism. The big terfy mother elephant is going to be at the conference because women keep doing awkward things like existing and saying things.

Corbyn's position is going to be a focus in this because for all his occasional signalling on trans issues like stating pronouns and saying mantras it is not a core issue for him, and moreover he doesn't believe in it narrowly . His circles have long contained gender critical people who he has refused to cancel, because Corbyn for all his faults believes in open debate. So I think this could be a wedge issue between those around Sultana and Corbyn. There are already signs of disagreements between them over other issues like antisemitism:
Sultana: Corbyn 'capitulated' on antisemitism definition
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c79lr40rqelo

Re Islam it may not be true of everyone ( It clearly isn't when you look at Ask Sarkar and Zahra Sultana) but they aren't religious Muslims, they are atheists with a Muslim background. I'd be interested in seeing how well received a woman would be if they self identified as men and sat next to them in the local Mosque!

One stereotype about the Jewish community that's absolutely true is that it's incredibly disputatious. That's very much part of the religion - the Talmud is thousands of pages of ancient rabbis arguing with each other over what seem like very minor points of doctrine. (If that sounds a bit like Trotskyism, go back 100 years and look at the ethnic backgrounds of early Trotskyists.)

I've heard this from past and present members of the Board of Deputies. There are 300 deputies, so that means at least 300 opinions, and the BOD leadership is in a constant struggle to win consensus among people who agree on almost nothing.

I think it's very revealing that there was near total unanimity over Corbyn's leadership of Labour. And people like Michael Rosen were always kind of tolerated as eccentric members of the family, but after five years of Corbynism that tolerance had worn out.

Owen Jones/The Guardian

Corbyn and Sultana: the needs of the left are greater than any of your differences

“If there’s a God why were there Nazis?"
“How do I know why there were Nazis? I don’t even know how this tin opener works!"

Owen Jones urging humility on both sides🤔.

Meanwhile updates from Charlie Mansell summarised as:

https://nitter.net/charliemansell/status/1970069782109036806#m

• the membership portal has closed, so about 20k paying members
• based on proportion of initial sign ups this could have the potential to have a final membership of 200 thousand
• Mrs Corbyn is still demanding the money back
• more free associating associations. Assemble. Majority. Regional groups are doing their own thing anyway

Blimey, what does OJ know about humility?

Maybe he means humilitiation but he spelled it wrong.

As a prospective member who moves in those circles, that's oversimplistic. Trans is just not high enough on most people's agenda to be worth scuppering the party for, regardless of whether they're TWAW or not.

There'll be some kind of fudge as there is for most of the other parties, and it'll be kicked into the long grass to concentrate on the things that matter.

I was quite the Corbynite back in the day, and considering women's rights not to be a 'thing that matters' is exactly why I won't be joining, and will not vote for whatever the new party decides to call itself.

No self-respecting woman should wish or work for the success of a party who ignores her sex - Susan B. Anthony

Corbyn is a pretty hopeless manager. If he was ruthless, like Johnson , he'd have expelled the likes of Mandelson and the other conspirators. They wouldn't have lasted pissing time in the Tory party. Yet he has plenty of support in the Jewish community. They can't all be lovable eccentrics. No doubt many are indeed Trotskyist as Sionnach has adverted to. But that's a different subject.

Next up : Polanski is anti-Semitic. Sultana is a Mossad plant. Jezza ? Sorry lad , the IRA will have to do. Bit dated....but if the cap fits...

It's actually about womens rights. Not trans. And if people looked at it in that matter; womens rights, the rights of 50% of the population, they'd make it a priority. Re-labelling the feminist struggle and the rights of women and girls as being about 'trans issues' allows womens rights to be ignored. Very convenient for the misogynists.

I see that. But when I say "some kind of fudge" I mean something that leaves things more or less as they are - with sex meaning biological sex as defined by the SC ruling; puberty blockers restricted as they are in the wake of the Cass report; Self-ID not legally A Thing. Just without the confrontational language and affirming the concerns of trans people.

If it went full-on TWAW for all purposes "we will enact self-ID the day we're elected" (as ZS seems to want, and presume she can make happen) I would walk. But I don't believe it will.

They're going to make a 2nd go of it.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/sep/22/corbyn-and-sultana-prepare-new-party-memberships-launch-without-unified-line

Theres almost certainly some mid level sketch writer trying to tag this as an attempt at a Relaxing Weekend Away stage of the marriage co leadership. Someone get them on Couples Therapy

Sketch, I don't know. There's material here for a whole sitcom.

Apart from the PFJ sketches in Life of Brian, nobody's really mined the hard left's comedy potential. There is the novel Redemption by unemployed maharajah Tariq Ali, but it isn't very good and you will be completely lost if you don't know the real life people who the characters are obviously based on.

Citizen Smith, back in the seventies.

Alan Parker Urban Warrior at a push, or more likely some wretch like Super Hans from Peep Show

That was my first thought too!

Bloody hell! With all the drama between Corbyn and Sultana perhaps this thread should be moved to the Relationship board. Can you imagine the AIBU?

😂😂😂

Yes, some of the older, male Left don't consider 'women's issues' to be that important. They don't really matter ( although, of course, Gaza will matter very much and be absolutely central).

They tolerate and go along with TWAW because that is what the younger ones are doing and they just want to encourage 'the movement' to grow. But the problem with that approach is that they then allow the agenda on trans ideology and women's sex based rights to be set by those for whom TWAW is an absolute article of faith.

That's was how Corbyn approached the issue of women's sex based rights in the first place..... simply delegate it to the juniors and then nod along.

Sounds like it will all be left as a big messed up fudge; with a continuing and wilful lack of clarity of the sort that many organisations are still clinging to in the light of the Supreme Court ruling.

They cannot pretend it is not an issue of fundamental importance.

Agree. They just dont care enough. They see some blokes just like them but in a dress and makeup and think ' Why would I be scared of that harmless chap?' Women, as usual, no consideration at all.

As one of the 'older, male Left', 😀I think there's a lot of truth in that.

Please, no more sex fudge.

"Sex fudge" in connection with Corbzy just makes me think of all those exposes the Sunday Sport used to run on him, which the lamestream media were too scared to investigate.