Your Corbyn/Sultana Party - Discussion thread

[fromorbit]

The new left party is going to have significant implications for gender and sex discussions on the left in the UK and in wider political debate as well. Lets talk about it.

Four of its prospective MPs are Gaza independents whose votes and comments in the Commons indicate a social conservative background . One of them Adnan Hussain has already got into a row on X with prospective members over his social conservatism.

The hilarious breakdown of the Islamo-left alliance
The progressive left has suddenly noticed that most British Muslims are not exactly woke.
This uneasy marriage got a reality check last week when a Green Party councillor and practising Muslim, Mothin Ali, appeared reluctant to sign a set of ‘pledges’ on behalf of the LGBTQIA+ Greens, Feminist Greens and other similar groups. The MP for Blackburn, ‘Gaza Independent’ Adnan Hussain, then waded into the debate. ‘It’s no secret that Muslims tend to be socially conservative’, Hussain said. ‘Is there a space on the left to create a broad enough church to allow Muslims an authentic space, just as it does other minority groups?’
https://www.spiked-online.com/2025/08/04/the-hilarious-breakdown-of-the-islamo-left-alliance/

The initial statement for Your Party focuses on poverty, fighting the system and Gaza, but makes no mention of progressive social issues, . This already signals something significant.
https://www.yourparty.uk/statement

Zarah Sultana on the other hand has already signaled out trans rights as a key principal in a recent interview which has received push back from others. Discussion here:

The Elephant in the Room for Zara Sultana’s “Your Party”
https://labourheartlands.com/the-elephant-in-the-room/
But here’s the rub. Sultana also pledged to “resolutely” advocate for a pro-trans socialist programme. She insists these discussions must happen openly and democratically.

That sounds fine in theory. In practice, the left has already shown itself utterly incapable of having this conversation without collapsing into authoritarian cancel culture.

Can the Left Have an Honest Trans Debate Without Cancelling Women?

For years, women who raise legitimate questions about the impact of gender self-ID on female-only spaces, or about the safeguarding implications highlighted by the Cass Review, have been branded as bigots and driven out of the movement. “Demonising trans people” is often code for “asking difficult but necessary questions.” If Your Party repeats this mistake, it will bleed support from countless socialist women before it even begins.

The truth is, many women will not get involved in this project precisely because of the Corbyn–Sultana line on trans issues. Others may hope the problem quietly goes away. It won’t. Nor is this a side issue: women’s rights are not negotiable add-ons to socialism; they are foundational. To ignore them is to build on sand.

TAs online and who are planning to join are already girding up for war, it is looking messy.

I can see a number of factions inside the new party who are going to make things complicated:

Muslim social conservatives - as mentioned they will be a major part of the party's voting bloc.

Old school Marxists who regard gender ideology as neo liberal capitalist identity politics and a distraction from class.

Realists who will see gender stuff as a marginal issue which needs to be sidelined because it is so toxic and unpopular with the general public.

Last but certainly not least actual left wing feminists who see through gender nonsense and are not going to be quiet about it !!

I expect fireworks over gender at the the party's initial conference supposedly to be held in November. TAs will attempt to make genderism a key principal of the party and will face resistance. Whether it happens or not it will be another nail in the TAs attempt to pretend the left inherently back neoliberal capitalist ideas like genderism. The big terfy mother elephant is going to be at the conference because women keep doing awkward things like existing and saying things.

Corbyn's position is going to be a focus in this because for all his occasional signalling on trans issues like stating pronouns and saying mantras it is not a core issue for him, and moreover he doesn't believe in it narrowly . His circles have long contained gender critical people who he has refused to cancel, because Corbyn for all his faults believes in open debate. So I think this could be a wedge issue between those around Sultana and Corbyn. There are already signs of disagreements between them over other issues like antisemitism:
Sultana: Corbyn 'capitulated' on antisemitism definition
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c79lr40rqelo

I wonder if this is where Trump learned his shtick?

An exceptionally long thread 🧵 on twitter (workaround pasted here) updated seemingly daily about party formation

https://nitter.net/charliemansell/status/1960726699215077549#m

Charlie Mansell

Sep 5

108. New Party Update. Amidst all the other news today of a woman being out of office, another woman, Zarah Sultana, seems to have been excluded by her party colleagues from a letter she would have likely supported?

Claims Team Corbyn and Team Sultana are not speaking.

I think one of the overlooked things about Trump is that when he was a boy, his mother dragged him along to the local Presbyterian church, and I don't think much of the religion stayed with him, but the minister was Norman Vincent Peale, author of The Power of Positive Thinking.

This is what Scott Adams picked up on in 2015 - Adams is a trained hypnotist, and he could spot Trump's persuasion tricks a mile off.

That's why I don't quite write Zack Polanski off.

I suspect that as far as radical vs moderate Muslims go, some of it may well be a class issue. That might go for people from some other places as well, India for one.

For example: a doctor local to me, his professional parents immigrated to a small, 99.9% white local born, Christian town. And sent heir kids to Catholic school because they thought that was closest to a Muslim education. Right away that tells you something, about their willingness to think outside the box, to integrate, and about their feelings about the west. Their son is a westerner, even as a practising Muslim who is clearly not of European descent. That is fairly reflective of a lot of the Muslim families, or Hindu families, who have been here for a generation or so, and I think it continues to be true of those from more urban, educated, and in some cases entrepreneurial classes.

More recently where I live we have seen huge masses of immigration from much differernt people, often rural, peasants really, which is a class of people who no longer exist in many western countries, often not well educated, often with poor English, and many are very inclined to religious sectarianism and even tribalism. Their ability to integrate, their values, the way they want to live, their religious beliefs, are very differernt, even when they are members of the same religions.

Oh that's fascinating.

I used to wonder if Trump was in fact some sort of idiot, I have come to the conclusion he really isn't, his public persona is very carefully crafted and it's clearly effective.

It's a bit of a weird way to speak, but I also think the media purposefully shows him in a way intended to make him look dumb.

No, that's the thing about Trump. He seems so outrageous etc, but I think it's actually v smart of him. He's crafted a persona which clearly appeals to lots of people of varying backgrounds, and imo his outwardly crazy behaviour makes his opponents underestimate him.

@SionnachRuadh I think they listen to a woke leftist like Zarah Sultana, who's about as Muslim as John McDonnell is Catholic...
John McDonnell's alternative career was the priesthood, per an interview he gave to Nick Robinson for Political Thinking (probably still in the BBC archive if you want to check).

But it's presumably right and normal and proper that 70% of Tory MPs in the last government were members of Conservative Friends of Israel, yeah?

That's one group they've joined. The Gaza MPs are making it central to what they offer. Not the same as joining a 'Friends of Gaza' group.

Interesting. As I said tho, he's atheist now. Although he is still a church goer.

I didn't know 80% of Tory MPs are members of the CFI, at least when it was investigated in 2009m That is interesting. I don't think it's necessarily bad, I support Israel's existence strongly. But something to be aware of.

www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/episode-guide/series-42/episode-1

here we go again

Fair point, but OTOH it's not like those MPs are seeking any extraordinary special privileges for Gaza. They just want us to stop supporting the genocide of it, which you'd think ought to be a pretty reasonable request.

Interesting - the Kent lady, is that Linden Kemkaran?

Laila Cunningham is Muslim, she seems to have similar concerns about Islam in general to the women I posted about earlier. Hopefully they will do useful work.

It's not genocide imo. It is terrible though & I strongly oppose a LOT of Netanyahu's actions. I do think the CFI's mission to create ties w the Likud Party is not ideal given the way many in there seem to be, at the moment.

25% of Labour are members of Labour Friends Of Israel, I wish it were more. I hop it may increase if Your Party hoovers up some fanatically anti-Israel people. Starmer did a least do a good job weeding out anti Semitism at least somewhat.

@AliasGrace47 As I said tho, he's [McDonnell's] atheist now. Although he is still a church goer.
Not incompatible with what I said. You seem to think your own assertions were important or unlikely enough to need repeating, so by implication also important or unlikely enough to require evidence.

Yes Ibthink this is absolutely correct. It is a class issue. And the thing with class issues in India and Pakistan is that the gap between the educated urban middle classes and the peasant/rural poor is so enormous it can be seen from space. It put the class/education/wealth divide in this country to shame.

Urban rural is also the main division obvs in the US with Trump etc

As long as that's a small part of what they do. They are constituency MP's who should be representing all of their constituents and helping them with their local concerns as well. What other things do they lobby for in Parliament? What do they do for people who couldnt give a damn about Gaza? What are they doing to highlight issues in their constituency? I'm not saying they are not doing that ( I don't know) but that's what they should be doing.

@fromorbit the PoliticsHome article you linked has gone down as well as could be expected on UK trans Reddit

https://www.reddit.com/r/transgenderUK/s/WkIixrWHSe

Thread started by obvious Green Party fan, to stir the pot, I imagine.

It's a good article. And Sienna Rogers is pretty perceptive, and has loads of contacts in that world.

One detail that I think is small but important is, we all know Corbyn is the most stubborn man in the world and never changes his mind about anything, but also he'll talk to anybody (fgs I've met Corbyn) and knows he has to speak to a broad audience. Sultana never speaks to anyone outside her political tribe. I don't think I've ever seen her do the Sunday shows.

I'd add that she has acquired a big following on X, and I think that can be dangerous for an inexperienced politician. It goes to their heads. (If you look at Reform, Rupert Lowe got a big X following thanks to Elon liking the cut of his jib, and that seems to have convinced Rupert that he was in a position to oust Nigel. He wasn't.) Sultana's fans have been hyping her as the British AOC, and I don't particularly rate AOC as a politician but she's got a certain charisma and a Trumpian genius for social media. Sultana hasn't, but I think she's come to believe her own hype and act as if she's the leader of the gang.

It all falls apart when someone like Adnan Hussain says, I've got a mandate from the voters of Blackburn, and who exactly are you to tell me what beliefs are acceptable for my constituents to hold.

Sure, but they've been democratically elected like anyone else, and having done that by taking a line on Gaza that is not supported by any of the main parties or any of the mainstream media probably means many of their constituents voted for them precisely for that reason. It's not like they just campaigned on other issues and the once elected, turned around and said "haha, tricked you, I'm going to focus on Gaza now".

In fact their position is surely more of a genuine example of democracy in action than the fact that most Tory MPs and many Labour ones explicitly belong to groups serving the Israel lobby - which the vast majority of their constituents probably don't know and didn't consider one way or the other as a reason for voting for them. Those MPs are being just as active as the Gaza-supporting ones in using their position to affect foreign policy, but because they're doing it to support the status quo it doesn't draw attention.

Fair point actually. As long as everyone has an equal right to vote (no voter fraud, right to make a free decision etc which isnt a given-see Lutfer Rahman, now back doing his dodgy dealings after being re elected as Tower Hamlets mayor immediately after serving his suspension for voter fraud) the people in those constituencies will have to live with the person they voted for or live with the person they now have because they couldn't be bothered to/ didn't want to vote for, anyone else.

Well, that's another thing about the New Party. It will provide a space for the people who see the hidden hand of Israel pulling the strings in British politics.

Those who aren't already in the Greens of course.

And people like disgraced professor David Miller, who is busy warning his X following against a party led by Zionist Jeremy Corbyn.