Reform gets confused by men in dresses

[fromorbit]

Looks like we need a thread to discuss how Reform finds it difficult to work out the difference between men and women after recent developments. This is not surprising at all remember it was the Tories who were key playing is promoting this stuff in the first place. Trump was previously fine with trans stuff. Gender ideas are regressive and conservative so they will always have a place on the right, though the left are pushing it hard as well.

Nigel Farage will NOT pledge to ban trans inmates from women's jails
By CLAIRE ELLICOTT WHITEHALL EDITOR

Nigel Farage has failed to commit to banning trans women from female prisons after his new justice adviser said they should not be automatically barred.

Vanessa Frake, a former prison governor who oversaw the detention of Rose West, said decisions on where to house inmates should be made on an 'individual basis'.

Asked for his views on her comments yesterday, the Reform UK leader told the Daily Mail: 'I've personally never worked in a prison so I can't answer [the question] but I think you'll find that the answer that you'll get from somebody who has worked in prisons at the highest possible level is, I think, basically it's about risk assessment, isn't it?

'But in terms of the problems in prisons, it's a relatively small one.'

A Reform spokesman later added of Ms Frake: 'An ex-prison governor... has a different opinion. That does not constitute party policy.'

In an interview to mark her appointment, Ms Frake said decisions about trans prisoners should be made on a case-by-case basis. But she told The Times that sexual offenders may need to be held in male prisons.

'It's all about the risk assessments for me, and each has to be done on an individual basis,' she said.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14970333/Nigel-Farage-NOT-pledge-ban-trans-inmates-womens-jails.html

Some sense from Joan Smith

Even Reform UK is falling prey to gender ideology Joan Smith
https://archive.ph/pIjQj

Even Reform UK, which has tried to position itself as a refuge for voters who are fed up with the trans-obsessed rhetoric of other parties, can’t keep its recruits on-message. A former prison governor, Vanessa Frake, had barely been announced as the party’s new justice advisor when she <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/pIjQj/www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/08/04/reform-prison-tsar-vanessa-frake-trans-women-female-jails/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">declared that trans women should not be barred from women’s prisons. Her argument, which is unusual to say the least, seems to be that some female prisoners are horrible people, so it makes no sense to exclude trans-identified males.

I’m not sure the Tories and they would be so averse to teaming up if it meant they were in power. But I guess we will see, won’t we? I doubt Starmer will last the course so we’ll see who we have as Labour leader. Maybe Streeting would be a good pick, much as I’ve never trusted him.

I haven't read her book, but this gives a lot of key words, and the word 'trans' never appears. books.google.co.uk/books/about/The_Governor_My_Life_Inside_Britain_s_Mo.html?id=aZX6DwAAQBAJ&source=kp_author_description&redir_esc=y

I can't say I see it that way, myself.

Wes streeting has a majority of around 500. I dont think they could risk him as leader. There's always talk of Andy Burnham, and hes been away from Westminster for so long, he can claim the issues are none of his doing. Whether he understands whats wrong and can do anything about it is another matter.

Jenrick could be the Conservative leader by the election, and if he is seen as more right wing than reform, could win seats if reform continue to disillusion voters.

The problem all parties have is that we don't have good people in politics right now. So no one can gather a good team together.

Good points.

I seriously hope Jenrick is not the leader. He has no principles apart from career progression. His wife is like Lady Macbeth.

Andy Burnham can't just become leader because he has no seat in the Commons which would make it very difficult for him.

He would have to resign as mayor and then run in a by-election. By-elections don't just pop up when you want one. If he's parachuted into a constituency which he has no real connection with he runs the risk of looking like a career politician which wouldn't do him many favours either.

Tbh he's doing well where he is, he doesn't have the stresses of commuting. Why would he want to ditch all that and become an MP again? He's got a good set up in Manchester and can influence national politics through that.

Apart from Wes streeting, what about Shabana Mahmood as a new leader? I quite like what i've seen and heard from her.

I suspect that was when Trump thought it was a male sexual expression and sexual experience thing. Who really knows with these men?

I'm not so sure. The Welsh and Scottish assembly elections are in 2026, and because they both use forms of PR, there is a very good chance that Reform will make a strong showing, especially in Wales. If that happens, then even allowing for the first-past-the-post system in UK elections, I think there's a very good chance that it will give them the momentum they need to win an election in 2029.

I agree. I live in rural Wales and am seeing quite a lot of signs of support for Reform. At last year's parliamentary election Reform came second to Labour, displacing our then Tory MP into 3rd place. I fully expect Reform to do well in next year's Senedd election, especially as our current Tory Senedd member is retiring.

Update:

It is getting more crazy.

We now have Ann Widdecombe Former Prison's Minster attempting to explain things for Reform. Saying that while criminal men in dresses should not "routinely" be in women's prisons, but criminal men with surgery and in dresses should be in women's prisons. TalkTV Interview see discussion at 2:11
https://www.youtube.com/live/4Nz3FyY-DUQ

Ann Widdecombe specifically uses the example of saying IW should not be in men's prisons . Is this because Willoughby is a Farage fan?

The law currently says that men should not be in women's prisons after the Supreme Court ruling. So are Reform going to pass a bill to change that?

Oh ffs.

Does she not understand the rule of law, the Supreme Court ruling, the role of Parliament, the meaning of ‘biological sex at birth’?

I was absolutely stunned by this

Particularly ironic that he preceded it by saying that politicians comment on things they don't know anything about. Because I was then left wondering if he'd misunderstood the entire issue. Baffling.

Ok, didn't have her down as a cocks in women's prisons type.

This ideology made utter fools of Theresa May and Penny Mordaunt too.

(As well as Amber Rudd, Nicky Morgan, Maria Miller, Caroline Nokes and the rest. Inspired presumably by the APPG led by the likes of Crispin Blunt.)

I thought IW claimed to have had all the surgery. Including having a cervix implanted (so perhaps all the rest is also a figment of his imagination). So according to Widdecombe's criteria, he should be allowed in a women's prison if convicted of a crime.

Pretty much.

I suppose we ought to be grateful they've not got India in a spokesman.

I’d almost forgotten about her but I seem to remember her generally not being supportive of other women.

Oh absolutely, and may her decision to shackle a woman in childbirth follow her around forever. But I didnt clock that she was this particular type of unsupportive.

It seems like a non-answer to me. I'd interpret it as, he isn't sure about the details of the issue, doesn't know much about how prisons run, so is trying to avoid saying anything much.

In an ideal world, I do think a lot of regulations like this should be made by the experts in charge, unfortunately they seem to have been making some really stupid decisions in recent years.

It also occurred to me to wonder if NF is sure whether a transwoman is a male or female and was trying not to look like an idiot, but maybe that's not the issue.

If NF doesn’t even know a TW is male then he’s hopelessly out of touch. Politically inept.

Is this the same woman that said Reform may consider reintroducing the death penalty..News for you its never going to happen.
Sorry don't have a link I probably saw it in the Daily heil.

Maybe she thinks that this surgery is literally a "sex change" as that's what it used to be touted as.

Someone should inform her that it just changes a man with a normal penis into a man with an inside-out penis, bordered with ballsack.

Watch the interview - this is exactly what she thinks - she thinks surgery is magic.

Meanwhile the Conservatives are now making adverts:

Conservatives

Farage thinks men being put in women's prisons should be based on "risk assessments." We think that's mad.