NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #47

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence had been intended to be 28 July with 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing was to have ended on 30 July. However, it became apparent as the hearing progressed that this schedule wouldn't be followed. (Considerable understatement.)

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 42: mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5379820-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-42 25 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 43: mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5379979-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-43 25 July 2025 to 27 July 2025
Thread 44: mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5380196-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-44 25 July 2025 to 28 July 2025
Thread 45: mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5381518-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-45 28 July 2025 to 28 July 2025
Thread 46: mumsnet.com/talk/womensrights/5381640-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-46 28 July 2025 to 29 July 2025

Which year?

Thanks for the new thread.

Bit optimistic.

Maybe 2029!

And will both sides stop on Christmas day for a rousing game of friendly footie?

If they can sort out the changing rooms.

Men v women. Shouldn't be any trouble with that.

The one with the files 😂

I have fallen behind the scurry again, missed most of the discussion in #46, and this mornings tribunal.

I'm really annoyed at JR doing that whole Miss Piggy, Forshatter thing. Is she a five year old? It's fucking childish and completely undermines any professionalism she may otherwise have had!

What’s happening? I feel like tapping my watch with 🤨 expression as time is marching on.

We’re going to be in a perpetual loop of hearings for eternity with this case.

Love it!

What happens when Upton says he's entitled to play on the women's team? We'd have to start all over again!

@Flashout none that I recall being mentioned. It's a while since the CR incident and he wasn't even 2 years in yet so wouldn't have qualified for a GRC.
In fact, my memory is that a lot was made of the belief that none is necessary, and in fact no changes are required in order to live as / be a woman, beyond saying so.

I meant the witnesses and evidence.
Every day a new one seems to pop up

According to ChatGPT:

🔮 Likely Outcome

• Finding in her [SP] favour for unlawful discrimination and failure to accommodate a protected belief.
• Possible damages for reputational harm and distress.
• Strong criticism of NHS Fife’s procedures and leadership judgment—especially their public handling during the tribunal.

Are we counting Appeals - if we include them could go to the 2030s!!! 😮

It reminds me of Alice In Wonderland.
New cup new cup move down move down...
(Or in this case, new tribunal)

A lady boy is exactly as describe, an individual who has both tits and a dick.
I believe that there are special sorts of men who travel to exotic places just to indulge in sex with ladyboys. It is a purely commercial exchange. And just one of many sexual fetishes indulged in.
Happily, pre internet porn, most of us were blissfully ignorant of most fetish behaviour. Maybe S&M or bondage but the truly weird stuff was firmly hidden away.
Now, it’s a free for all. If you can imagine it you can probably do it.

My drink just came out of my nose! That bloody hurt!

😱

@NebulouslyContemporaneous

😆

I may be watching from beyond the grave in that case

I'd be very surprised if anyone would have needed to see him naked, examine his genitals or even see a bulge in his trousers when fully clothed in order to clock that he is male. Most of us can accurately tell a fully-clothed stranger's sex without even having to think about it and develop the ability to do this as young children. Of course there are exceptions where it can be difficult to tell, especially if someone is at extreme of weight range and/or outside of height norm for sex and/or has gone to considerable effort to disguise sex. But I do find it hard to believe that none of Dr Upton's colleagues could tell he was male in normal everyday interactions that didn't involve him undressing.

We're back in empty court room, as remote observers

WTAF? That sounds awful. I am so massively behind I had not even seen this. Can you say more please? #hopelesslybehindwitheverything

Everyone back to their devices. We have images.

It is an empty room though.

Oh tell a lie legal bods coming back in now

will this do?