"We have always been here"

[DiamondThrone]

Been noticing this a lot. It seems to be the new #TWAW #nodebate #bekind, after those didn't work.

I mean - lots of things have "always been here". Like women, for instance 😄

Just interested in new terms that arise, and how they are used to try and shut down comment.

It also omits the fact that the Supreme Being was 3 aliens with a wicked sense of humour.

It was very hard being a T-Rex but identifying as a Brachiosaurus!

😂 it’s so kind that you understand the struggles of our dinosaur trans siblings sisters etc etc

Maybe they have always been 'here'.
But they haven't always wanted to get into "my" changing rooms and toilets.
Because they used to understand that they have a p and I've got a v. And the two only meet when BOTH want to!

They're just Big Words.

It is sadly that childish. Anything that might successfully manipulate is grabbed and used, regardless of whether it's been understood. You can, seriously, feed this movement a word on MN and wait for it to pop up. If Mummy said it.....

I can't help but feel like you're all being a bit purposely obtuse here.

When trans people say 'we have always existed', it's to combat the argument that transgenderism is a new phenomena/craze.

There is evidence of individuals as far back as the Medieval period living as the opposite gender.

I think that's all they mean by it.

I'm trying to be obtuse, but it's really uncomfortable at my age!

I hope they start bringing up Elagabalus again, to prove there was a trans emperor in Ancient Rome. The appropriation of Elagabalus is always fun, in a bonkers way, and makes up for Nero being shamefully overlooked during LGBT History Month.

I can't help but feel like you're being a bit naive here.

It is their new "shut down debate from the wimmins" position.

If you think that's all they mean by it, this is definitely your first rodeo.

We need to big up Nero a bit more. Especially the bit where he transitioned someone to be his wife.

I mean, yes, my post dealt with exactly that?

And surely Caligula would fit within the Q+ part of the acronym.

well one was with me in a work changing room in around 1975. I didn’t want it then and I don’t want it now.

The mind boggles as to how Caligula would have dealt with the trans issue. I can see him sending cross dressers into the arena to see if they fought bears any better than men.

Of course in reality you can't move a sentence or two in Greek or Roman mythology before you run into all sorts of weirdness.

Just remembered the stories about Hadrian and Antinous

Sorry, you have just said all or most trans people want the age of consent to 12? So calling them peadophiles?
Any fair and correct points you had have just been ruined by that.

No, I said neither of those things. And even if I had, none of my "fair and correct" points would have been ruined by that.

Off you pop, "I'm just being reasonable" TRA!

Honestly, do they think we're new here!

How about women as men? Quite a few of them around (yes the percentage is smaller, but it is slowly closing)

There have always been transvestites, but the ‘born in the wrong body’ nonsense is a very new phenomenon. If you can ignore the harmful, regressive, misogynistic and homophobic ideology that is encapsulated by this ‘movement’, then good for you. Some of us actually object to the lies being told by activists in order to facilitate the horrifying and completely unnecessary, experimental and irreversible medicalisation of young people, and the removal of women’s rights. HTH.

‘I’ve also noticed that GC phrases…are now being used by TRAs against GC arguments’

Yes @MarieDeGournay, I’ve noticed this too- in fact I saw it on MN yesterday! I’ll see if I can find the thread, though I read a lot of threads yesterday and may not be able to find it- but there were several phrases and approaches which I recognised as being those of clever GC women that I have seen on here, Twitter and in articles, but twisted to their own arguments.

Wonder what the next slogan will be...
"Ignore us or be warned"?
Or maybe...
"Fingers in our ears not listening"?

Yes I believe that men have probably always dressed up as women to mock or gain sexual pleasure.
But "trans kids" didn't exist until they were invented by evil people in the 2020s. There were no "trans kids" at my school.

Perhaps Prof. Alice Roberts could do an episode of 'Digging for Britain' on Stone Age trans finds?

Yes, women as men as well. Funnily enough though , they're not the ones insisting on access to male spaces or exhibiting violence and aggression to anywhere near the same levels as the trans identifying males.

What I find amusing is that they think that "We have always been here" is some kind of - positive? - statement.

Anyway, it seems like they're thrashing around to find a new phrase to scold us with. And to try and convince the public.

It's not happening, mates!

Well, there was that transman who wrote how awful it was when they attended a gay mens' sex party and were ignored.

Edit - having said that, I think they cried rather than making any threats of violence.