How to talk about 'trans-girl' in my son's class.

[user1471471849]

Hello,

My son is 7 and there is a 6 year old trans-girl (aka a boy who identifies as a girl) in his school. It's a small school so everyone interacts with each other a lot. When the boy first socially transitioned and started wearing girls clothes and changed their name it was hard to know how to explain this to my son. He's a clever guy who asks hard questions and he was confused about what was going on. I went with the line that the child is a boy but is confused and feels he's a girl and not to bring it up to avoid arguments or hurt feelings.
Just to be clear, I don't agree with the parents' choice to socially transition such a young kid, I feel the kid is being pushed into this.. But it's not my place to say and I'm conscious of the poor kid's mental health and not wanting to make his life harder. To me, sex is binary and immutable but I knew that I'd eventually run into problems. Unfortunately, my son doesn't get on well with this kid and has made comments about him really being a boy. So we were called into the principal's office today saying the boy (or girl in the child's mind) is transgender and is a girl now. I explained what I'd told my son- that the child is biologically a boy but is confused and feels he's a girl and to not bring it up. I also said I wasn't willing to lie to my child and say that you can change sex and I got the impression that they agreed but said it's the school policy ( here and nationwide- in Ireland) to accept this.

Obviously, we don't want our son to be upsetting anyone so we'll make sure he knows to be very mindful of people's feelings but it's such a hard road to navigate (being truthful with him and trying to make sure he doesn't upset the child by passing on his thoughts on the matter- it's not a nice situation for anyone). I know we're going to come up against this again. The parents haven't said anything to us but I reckon it's only a matter of time.
If anyone has any advice on how I could manage this situation better please let me know.

Thanks.

Have a read through this, it’s the DofE gender questioning guidance for schools.

https://consult.education.gov.uk/equalities-political-impartiality-anti-bullying-team/gender-questioning-children-proposed-guidance/supporting_documents/Gender%20Questioning%20Children%20%20nonstatutory%20guidance.pdf consult.education.gov.uk/equalities-political-impartiality-anti-bullying-team/gender-questioning-children-proposed-guidance/supporting_documents/Gender%20Questioning%20Children%20%20nonstatutory%20guidance.pdf]]]]

they should be using the term gender questioning and not the term trans.

The school has no duty to allow the child to socially transition and there are very few times when a school should allow a change of pronouns. No one can be compelled to use different pronouns, so that meeting with the head shouldn’t have happened.

a child’s legal sex is the same as their birth sex and they must use the single sex facilities for their birth sex.

@HeyWiggle
OP is in Ireland, not the UK, so the guidance doesn’t apply.

I think you're doing the right thing.
Having been a girl (!), what I'm concerned about is this "boy" in relation to toilets and changing rooms. Even at the age of 4 or 5, I and my friends were very aware of "differences" and the need for privacy away from the boys.
I hope this "boy" is not to be allowed anywhere near the female-designated areas.

So in short tell your son the child is a boy and he can’t change sex but it’s kind just to call him by his new first name as he wants to look like a girl.

I don’t know. I believe the majority of schools in Ireland are faith schools, and I just wondered if this was how they handled different beliefs between pupils. I suppose the question still stands in a non-religious school.

There is absolutely no way I’d indoctrinate my child with such nonsense. I’d be upfront with my son and explain he’s a boy who wishes to dress as a girl. I think the school are way out of line for allowing and endorsing this.

Your issue isn't whether the other child is confused, a boy, or a girl or anything else.

Your issue is that your son says things to upset children he doesn't get on with. It seems there was no need to talk about whether this child was a girl or really a boy, but your son knew it would be dismissive or hurtful, and did.

If they're not friends, it's not your son's place to comment on something so personal, regardless of your views.

You can have friends you think the same way as, friends you see things differently from but talk to respectfully on the issues, people you don't get on with or have anything in common with, and people you choose to have nothing to do with for whatever reasons. You can't interfere in the affairs of those you actively dislike, unless you want to be a bully.

‘The boy who wants to pretend he is a girl’

Children don’t have to buy into this nonsense any more than adults do. He is not a girl.

Really, I’d be telling my DC to just stay away from the child, especially if they don’t get on anyway. You don’t need any of this catching on.

Damn, that’s so young to transition - I feel it’s a safeguarding issue…

This. He is, by very definition, confused.

Oh give over being so self-righteous.

Have you ever dealt with 6 year-olds? Do you understand anything at all about child development? They are not mini-adults.
This is such a bullshit ideology, throwing out everything we know about childhood development, and talking crap about being “really” a girl when in every material respect, this child is a boy. Social transition is NOT a neutral act, and can concretise an idea that the child would have grown out of.

But those are things whereby there is a clearly negative perception to the situation, which people will be understandably upset for others to specifically tell them so.

Most people would prefer to be good at a sport they enjoy, rather than bad at it. Most people would prefer to be thought of as clever rather than stupid.

But there's no positive or negative about being either a boy or a girl; you're either one or the other, but you can't be the one that you aren't. Just like there's nothing bad, wrong or negative with being of one racial heritage or another; but you are what you are, and you can never become what you aren't.

He is 6 for fuck’s sake. You are so judgemental about a 6 year old who has just been presented with something that is mind-boggling. A boy who is “really” a girl??? I’m not surprised he is asking questions, it’s what 6 year olds do.

My son is six. He knows the tooth fairy isn't real, and he doesn't believe in a god.

However, he also completely understands that some of his classmates DO believe in these things and that he should "leave it be". Not bring up the topic. Not try to burst their bubble or argue or anything.

If he comes across a transgender child in school I will explain it in a similar way. This is what they believe. Whether it is factual/true or not is irrelevant because it doesn't need to be discussed with them.

They may well be coming at things from a wish to 'be kind' (although clearly not to OP's DS); but as PP said, they are actually gaslighting a young child.

Today, it's telling them off for realising the truth about human sex; how do we know that, tomorrow, it couldn't be somebody abusing them and angrily rebuking them and denouncing them as a horrible liar for speaking up about it?

It's an extremely dangerous precedent to set.

Thanks, that's a great article, harrowing to read but it's my take on the issue too. I wish I could send it to the school or parents but they wouldn't be too happy! At least more people are speaking out about it. I think trans ideology is going to cause irreparable harm to society in general and the knock on effects will be felt for generations.

Just here to agree that you're taking the correct approach so far.
I'll refrain from commenting on the parent's approach though.

I was going to ask was it educate together. They are completely captured. I think you are on a hiding to nothing trying to change that.

I think your approach is sensible and you have excellent advice here on how to approach it with your son. He doesn't have to lie but he shouldn't draw attention to the physical characteristics the child is sensitive to.

One other thing I would do is discuss with your son who he has being saying to the other child is a boy. Is the other child or other children taunting him in to doing it or is it unprovoked? If he's being taunted then the school need to be aware of that and deal with it. If it's unprovoked, he needs to be kinder without giving in to fantasy.

How to talk about 'trans-girl' in my son's class

An abused boy.

Seven year old boys can't make this kind of decision anymore than a vegan cat can. Social transition is abuse. The parents are abusing. So are the school.

I told my son that you can't change sex at 6 and that sometimes teachers are wrong.

If anyone wants to take it up with me they are welcome to. I can quote Cass.

100% this.

I can’t get my head around that you would send your child to a school that supports this madness.

Nope, he's six for fuck's sake in the sense that he knows not to pick on something that makes someone stand out for his own amusement. He's not asking his mum or teacher questions, he's saying things to another child which he knows are cruel.

Other kids will be less good at things and he shouldn't point that out, others might have things that make them look different, some will be less mature e.g. believe in father Christmas / tooth fairy as mentioned by PP. He can't treat people who are different from him as lesser. That is bullying / racist / sexist / ableist whatever he picks on.

I happen to agree with OP's personal views on the matter of the gender questioning child and think there's confusion and a need for adults to deal with it. But if it's a vulnerability / mental health issue etc. all the more reason not to mock someone struggling.

To be fair, how can you possibly know how the school will react until something like this occurs - especially in a school with such young children?

I think all Irish schools would be the same unfortunately. According to the principal they are following educational guidelines!

he has a male body but a female brain,

That is sexist
But if they want to play that idelogical game get the school to list what makes a boy brain different to a girl brain.
Even then that is a faith based belief as the child in question has not been tested and "found" to have a girl brain.

I would be looking at what type of gender woo the school is teaching as fact if they are going with girl brain

The school can have a school ethos but can not force your child to adopt the belief system of girl brain. And there was legislation passed 2015ish??? about schools accepting local students and adjusting ethos to not punish "non-believers" which was mainly aimed at RC schools

They have an obligation to respect your right to educate your child with your beliefs and not to try teach your child that your belief is "wrong".

THE FAMILY
ARTICLE 41
1 1° The State recognises the Family as the natural primary and fundamental unit group of Society, and as a moral institution possessing inalienable and imprescriptible rights, antecedent and superior to all positive law.
2° The State, therefore, guarantees to protect the Family in its constitution and authority, as the necessary basis of social order and as indispensable to the welfare of the Nation and the State.

EDUCATION
ARTICLE 42
1 The State acknowledges that the primary and natural educator of the child is the Family and guarantees to respect the inalienable right and duty of parents to provide, according to their means, for the religious and moral, intellectual, physical and social education of their children.
2 Parents shall be free to provide this education in their homes or in private schools or in schools recognised or established by the State.
3 1° The State shall not oblige parents in violation of their conscience and lawful preference to send their children to schools established by the State, or to any particular type of school designated by the State.
2° The State shall, however, as guardian of the common good, require in view of actual conditions that the children receive a certain minimum education, moral, intellectual and social.
4 The State shall provide for free primary education and shall endeavour to supplement and give reasonable aid to private and corporate educational initiative, and, when the public good requires it, provide other educational facilities or institutions with due regard, however, for the rights of parents, especially in the matter of religious and moral formation.

You have a fundemental objection to this ethos so you need to understand the schools policy and how the school plan to manage
a) "trans children"
b) children who dont believe in "trans children"
The school need to respect and manage both as they accept children of all faiths or none.

Imo the issue is the two children dont get on.

I would be working with the school to separate them as much as possible. And teaching your son not to bring up the issue as a weapon to be used against the other child. He needs to understand that doing that is bullying. So the context of the remarks are important.

If its a small ET school many of the parents will not want to become involved. But you need to look at who is on the BOM and how TRA they may be.

It will be a fine line so I would be pushing back on how the school is going to respect your childs right not to accept "girl brain".