Trans Ex-Judge on BBC Newscast

[CaveMum]

Can’t bear to listen to it mussels, but if anyone has a string stomach/wants to take one for the team, today’s Newscast is a 43 minute long interview by Laura Kuenssberg of Victoria McCloud who is planning a challenge to overturn the Supreme Court ruling that a woman is defined by biological sex under equalities law.

There aren’t enough 🙄 emoji’s in the world!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0lh0c9r?partner=uk.co.bbc&origin=share-mobile

(Although to add, I'm not sure this was intentional on LK's part )

I had gender reassignment surgery – then the Supreme Court said I wasn’t a woman

This is where someone down the line isn't telling the truth.

TRA posters here, when reassuring us about the robustness of the diagnosis process, say that therapist ensure that patients understand that sex isnt the same as gender, surgeons make it clear that surgery does not change their sex. Overall patients understand the limits of what medicine, surgery and a GRC can do.

Then a TRA will say that they are shocked the courts dont see them as a women?

The conflation of sex and gender is always used to obfuscate. VM claiming that he doesn’t know what sex he is, is plainly ridiculous (oh I need hormones and surgery because my possibly female body is a bit too masculine - really?!)

The wording that the Gender Recognition Act changes people’s sex is another fail. Once again, we’re back to the ‘words have meanings’ issue, and the gender ideologues (to borrow VM’s language) need to define the words they are using, and stick to that definition.

I think the people who said this claimed to have had surgery about 30 years ago. It's quite likely that things have changed.

He wasn’t senior I think he was a pretty junior judge

i haven’t listened to it. I guess no recognition that women also have rights?

The hyperbole from so many men who demand to be called women regarding the chances of them being the victims of male violence is quite telling...almost as if it's crucial to their idea of what it is to be a woman.

I'm only 2 minutes and 6 seconds in and LK has just referred to the equalities act.

I'm assuming it's not going to get any better.

I had gender reassignment surgery – then the Supreme Court said I wasn’t a woman

Per the ECHR and U.K. law, a GRC cannot be and is not dependent on gender reassignment surgery, so the relevance isn’t clear.

Neither a GRC nor gender reassignment surgery can change somebody’s sex, and there will always be circumstances where sex is relevant.

I was just thinking that. With Nick Griffin, there would be careful distancing going on that is never evident with the likes of McCloud.

Someone earlier in the thread thought LK might have been pussyfooting round recognizable narcissism (or something like that) but if she was, she wasn’t doing her job, which is to weave a pathway that allows him to really show himself up and demonstrate the weakness of his arguments in a way that shows she recognizes them herself.

How many times did VM say VM was anatomically female? What does VM even mean by that?

She assumes that she was anatomically male at birth but she may very well not have been, because intersex people are so common and people may not even know they are intersex. (I assume she's talking about DSD.)

This is utterly batshit. Of course he cannot know or remember what happened when he was born but I suspect there were ample opportunities after that for him to learn that he was male. For example when he noticed that he had a willy and had those conversations with his parents that all children have about the difference between girls and boys. And when he went through a typically male puberty, I don’t suppose he wondered then whether he was anatomically male.

I hate it when TRAs suggest that they are or might have a DSD. I’m pretty sure they would know if they had.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/contact/complaints/make-a-complaint/

The coercive nature of it all is hard to miss. When a man says to an interviewer 'I am a woman' they are demanding and coercing that she soothingly repeats the lie he wants to hear. He knows it will be very difficult for her to say no. He knows she will be afraid of the consequences of not doing what he is implictly demanding of her. It isn't 'kindness' he's demanding in a very masked way, it's submission.

It increasingly looks fantastically unkind to enable any men at all in the belief that they can be anything other than men who choose trans identities. Sooner or later they have to hit the boundaries of reality, and reach that 'no', and it is harder for them to have been enabled so far than perhaps it would be had people been firm about the line from the beginning.

I’m guessing VM agrees with that fella who dresses like a character Alice in Wonderland, who said ‘it wouldn’t matter if there was a slight spike’.

Him saying that his hormone pills stop him getting pregnant is so funny. Why are radio producers inviting people on who are clearly quite mentally unwell?

Next week: a plumber from Basingstoke says he's Napoleon - are the French government violating his human rights by not handing him power?

@Waitingfordoggo I hate it when TRAs suggest that they are or might have a DSD. I’m pretty sure they would know if they had.

Joyce addresses this in her book:

"She < Anne Fausto-Sterling> gives startling estimates for the prevalence of intersex <DSD> conditions : 4 percent in the essay; 1.7 percent in Sexing the Body: Gender Politics and the Construction of Sexuality , a book published in 2000.

"Such figures are nonsense. To get to even 1.7 percent you must include people with developmental anomalies that are so minor they may never become apparent, as well as more serious conditions that still create no difficulty in classifying a person as male or female. The share of people whose chromosomes do not match their body type (the XY karyotype that normally builds a male body together with breasts and a vagina, for example), or whose physiology is so ambiguous that medical investigation is required to class them as male or female, is more than a hundred times lower."

So, even if all people with ambiguous sex classification were trans, only about one percent of the trans population could possibly have the condition because it's so much rarer than the prevalence of trans identification. And conversely we know that many people who do have the condition (very likely the vast majority) reject any association with being trans and in fact find it offensive. So, in effect, the probability of McCloud having a significant enough degree of DSD for misclassification is practically nil.

But wait! Let's assume for a moment that McCloud did have a DSD and that that disorder was severe enough that his sex was misclassified. Then McCloud, by definition, is not trans! Surely his concern should be about advocating for the cause of the intersex and to do that surely he should seek a comprehensive, authoritative clinical diagnosis for severe DSD. Something that, by only causally speculating on the possibility, he's tacitly admitting he has not done. What could explain his lack of curiosity? 🤔

He certainly shouldn't be the one using his lived experience to inform the public of the plight of trans people on national broadcast -- it's not his story to tell. Nor would he be the best candidate to present the impact of the legislation (from a personal perspective) in court. This whole DSD argument doesn't just fail to be convincing, on close inspection it doesn't even make sense, and it's just one faulty argument that make up web of incoherent arguments.

I wasn’t going to annoy myself by listening, but I had to, to hear that. Yes, he does say it - it’s unclear whether he says “me” or “you” - might I suppose claim that he was making a general point about the Pill - but it did sound very wishful thinking and an attempt to make people think he could in fact become pregnant. I now think LK was just letting him talk himself into complete absurdity. Her “mmms” were doing quite a lot of heavy lifting there.

Do complain about this awful man - he said on air that the pill stops him from getting pregnant!!

Here is the clip, with subtitles: https://x.com/LegalGengar/status/1931724550825218133

I hope Sofia said this just before she instructed Juno in the art of caring for her new genitals “ Juno, this is your dilation kit, remember three times a day, minimum, otherwise it will just try to heal. And don’t forget it won’t be self cleaning or lubricating like a real vagina, so to stop it smelling and getting infected you will need to instigate a clear and regular routine of cleaning especially if you are planning on using it for sex. And if you are planning sex then don’t be disappointed if a) it hurts like crazy because it won’t have the capacity and elasticity of a real vagina and b ) apart from the hurting there won’t be any sexual satisfaction because unlike a female vagina and clitoris the nerve endings involved in your new genitals are sadly lacking in both number and sensitivity. But enjoy, as much as you can that is! So sorry you didn’t get a cervix, apparently the surgical skill involved in creating that bit of anatomy appears to have been lost, India’s surgeon won’t explain how they did it for him and it does seem a tad pointless since you haven’t got a uterus,ovaries or Fallopian tubes. But look on the bright side, no periods! Oh, and about your urethra? Mr X needs to have a chat with you about potential issues to watch out for, he’s popping by later, just a reminder, if you are a bit dribbly as sadly so many of our genital reconstruction patients are post surgery , then incontinence pads are available in every chemist and supermarket.”

It's the airy claim that there are "so many" people with DSD that I find wild. There just aren't - it's a medical fact! And the idea that people might just not have noticed is ridiculous. I don't understand how someone can believe that.

Excellent. My new username is born.

Juno Dawson is a selfish, sexist cockwomble.

Reveals his sex with every word typed.

That is all.

I feel similarly. I listen to virtually every episode and now they've ruined it. They've never interviewed any of the ACTUAL women involved in the ACTUAL supreme court case either from FWS or the interveners. Just this non story.

It would be lovely if all of his ilk left the country.

I didn't need a picture of JD when words are enough but thanks
VMcC sounds ... deluded I think. Pregnancy? Wtf? And the shameless co-opting of DSDs into the argument is beginning to really irritate me.
And the "checking of chromosomes"
Just stop now
I'm not a maggot either JD; nor a 'transphobe'- oh but maybe only in the sense of being a Slipknot fan 🤔