Are toilets still allowed to be cleaned by members of the opposite sex?

[PoisedRubyLion]

I see signs saying toilets may be cleaned by members of the opposite sex in a lot of places. Is this allowed after the supreme court ruling? If a male cleaner was in there it would be a mixed sex space.

My sons have used the gents since they were 8 or so. Basically since I was happy to let them be independent for 10 minutes or so. So far so good.

I genuinely don’t think men’s loos are dangerous in general (you can tell ‘cos I let my kids go in them). I still don’t want blokes (even ‘lovely’ ones, even ones in frocks) in close proximity to me when I’m partially dressed

stay out of the Ladies fellas. They’re not for you

Children can't enter into contracts - as many people have said, they are not the service user in many cases, the adult accompanying them is.

I agree that most men's toilets are perfectly fine, and if they're not, then I don't let my kids in them. They would be as perfectly safe for a bloke dressed in a feminine manner as they would be for my 11 year old.

I would like to hear the answer to this too

QED

It’s still a very small percentage of women that are trans though, and an even smaller number that are sex offenders. I’ve definitely seen more male toilet cleaners than trans women in toilets. So if trans women and men are just as likely as each other to be sex offenders why is one okay but not the other?

allowing any kind of males into women's loos (except when women are warned that a male worker is doing there to do an essential job, such as cleaning) puts women at risk. All men are a potential risk. Whether they're pretending to be women or not. That's why we have single spaces.

Do you seriously think single sex spaces are just for affirming womanhood?

Because I want to be in charge of whether I have a man in close proximity to me when I’m partially dressed

I don’t consent to some bloke either deceiving or bullying his way into the ladies. It’s really not hard to understand

cleaner doing his job-probably fine
creepy chap who doesn’t understand consent-no thanks

But what about the experiences of the women who works as a toilet cleaner and has been flashed several times? A trans woman should have to go through that every single time they need to use a public toilet?
But that’s justified because us cis women couldn’t possibly share a toilet with a trans woman (who despite being more likely than the average woman to be a sex offender, is still very unlikely to be one) once or twice in our lifetime?
I was assaulted by a man on a busy tram. A door with the symbol of a woman on it isn’t going to stop anyone.

Women get assaulted so let's make it easier for them to get assaulted is a pretty awful take if you don't mind me saying so.

And yet it does. Most men do not go in women's toilets, purely because it's not acceptable in society. Social rules are strong.

Your contention is that because some men flash people (largely women and girls though - do you have any reason to think they'll flash men the same amount?), we should let adult men into the women's (where previously there was no flashing at all due to the total lack of adult penis), and send small boys into the mens where they can also be flashed?

You think that grown men dressed somewhat unusually are more in-need of protection from flashing than women and children?

More likely than your average man too given the number of trans women in jail for sexual assault

Why are trans women creepy but not men? If they’re just as likely to commit sex crimes as them?

Trans women are 4x more likely to be SAd than cis women.

Men with a gender identity are not just more likely to be sex offenders than women, they’re more likely to be sex offenders than other men too.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/02/24/government-figures-70-per-cent-of-transgender-prisoners-are/

I’m not sure how else to word this. I expect to be in charge of whether I’m around men when I’m partially dressed. Men who can’t understand that are creepy

I don't want men in the ladies except if it's to provide a service like cleaning or repair. Little boys are not men.

source please. UK numbers

My point is that it doesn’t make it easier. And if that was actually your argument you would be against male cleaners too!
You’re not against SA you’re against trans people.

The High Court ruling was not about cleaners.

Transwomen are men

moreover if they’re in the women’s bogs then they’re men who like to push women’s boundaries

and that is fucking creepy

How many of them started claiming a trans identify after committing their offence? Or how many of them actually have gender dysphoria?

Of course it makes it easier. Women are disempowered to say anything to predatory men in their spaces. If you can't see that, you're anti-women (well that's obvious anyway).

None of that has anything to do with cleaners, whose presence is clearly communicated and women consent to them being there as they enter.

Women do not consent to transwomen in their spaces, if those spaces are signalled as women only. Why do you think women's consent doesn't matter? 😵‍💫

Just popping a random plumber in here before RubyLion gets worried about potentially dangerous leaks that cant be fixed because the only plumber available is the wrong sex. Also the person whose job it is to change over the sanitary bins. 😳

You are joking aren't you?

Well that's an excellent question. But weren't we told men would never identify as trans for cynical or self interested purposes? 🤔

It's not like men would ever pretend to be women to assault women 🤔. Trans women are men.