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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Good Law Project suing the EHRC and Bridget Phillipson - letter before action

410 replies

OhBuggerandArse · 16/05/2025 15:30

Sorry if this has already been shared - here are the links to their letter and statement. Looking forward to the Mumsnet analysis :-)

https://goodlawproject.org/were-bringing-a-legal-challenge-to-the-ehrcs-interim-update

https://goodlawproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/05/Letter-to-the-Equality-and-Human-Rights-Commission-16-May-2025_Redacted.pdf

OP posts:
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SionnachRuadh · 16/05/2025 20:13

There's a good possibility they've taken legal advice from themselves.

Which works in our favour, because Jolyon's legal expertise is mostly in the area of helping Gary Barlow minimise his tax bill, and when he says eminent KCs have told him he's got a slam dunk, they're probably just saying that to get rid of him.

proximalhumerous · 16/05/2025 20:21

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 16/05/2025 18:23

Maugham is not just a former tax lawyer. Although he doesn't practise as a barrister any more he still identifies as a KC, i.e. supposedly one of the most senior and skilled barristers in the UK. In other circumstances, I suppose he might have tried to become a judge, so we should probably be very grateful that he's gone off in this other direction.

Haven't watched the video or read the letter. There seems little point. Is it all about transwomen, or do transmen get a look in?

If I had a young girl or woman close to me who identified as male or non-binary, I would be worried sick about her going into male changing rooms, toilets etc, over and above all the worry about possible medical and surgical treatments she might want to inflict on herself. I can't imagine advocating for reverting to the pre-SC days when Stonewall law said transmen were fine in all-male settings. But there we are, we're all different.

Although he doesn't practise as a barrister any more he still identifies as a KC...

So he's familiar with the idea of identifying as something that you're not, then.

RareGoalsVerge · 16/05/2025 20:25

Theeyeballsinthesky · 16/05/2025 15:50

Never interrupt your enemy in the midst of making a mistake

I can’t wait for the fox botherer and his band of merry thems to have their day in court

This is the thing I am really needing to remind myself. It's far better that they waste their money and time on this futile tantrum rather than doing anything that might actually make a difference.

NecessaryScene · 16/05/2025 20:27

when he says eminent KCs have told him he's got a slam dunk, they're probably just saying that to get rid of him.

"So he's got £500,000 of crowdfunding money, he's desperate for any advice on how to get the ECtHR to declare a bad court thingy on the UK Supreme Court, and we get to keep our names off it?"

"Yep."

"Go for it. Just for god's sake don't even hint that we'd actually represent him in court - there's a remote chance he might actually try it for real. You know my wife reads Tribunal Tweets."

CarefulN0w · 16/05/2025 20:50

The trouble when people back themselves into a corner so publicly is that is hard to find a route out. Which Helen Joyce explains a lot more elegantly than me.

Teens can change their minds. And quietly crack on with their lives (at least they can if they haven’t been harmed by cross hormones). Their parents not so much.

fromorbit · 16/05/2025 21:06

GLP already screwing up not even clear if they are going do anything;

Richard Dunstan
Sending a letter before action is not "starting legal proceedings". The very point of a Pre-Action Protocol LBA is to "try to settle the dispute without [legal] proceedings".

The Good Law Project have previously had to apologise for making such misleading statements:
https://x.com/Wonkypolicywonk/status/1923399139758313775

Maya Forstater
The Good Law Project's 32 page letter before action to the EHRC

The whole thing is answered by Art 8(2) - govts (and regulated bodies etc…) infringe on people’s private life and autonomy all the time. They have to so by a means that is lawful & proportionate for a reason under 8(2) - this requires clear rules (and yes they apply to you).

A couple of years ago we held a legal seminar where I presented the Sex Matters argument that sex in the Equality Act means biological sex. A senior lawyer presented the case that sex in the EqA means "legal sex" but that it creates problems, and there was discussion with the audience (I know, radical idea, right?)

A judge who was in the audience crossed his arms and leaned back and said to me, as if he had dropped the mic "you will have to deal with Article 8".

He was right. Trans rights are privacy rights. But people's privacy and autonomy is curtailed all of the time for lawful reasons, as provided for by the qualifications in Art8(2).

The FWS judgment does deal with Art 8 (the right to respect for private and family life). Article 8 doesn't require magic, and it can't do magic.

But the other thing that is often forgotten is that everyone has the same Art 8 rights.

And the primary purpose of article 8 is to protect against arbitrary interferences with private and family life, home, and correspondence by a public authority.

Clarity about the law is important to article 8, since without clarity the state may capriciously intervene in people’s private life.

The phrase “in accordance with the law” in Art 8(2) implies that the law must be sufficiently foreseeable that individuals have an adequate indication as to the circumstances in which the authorities are entitled to limit their freedoms (such as by putting up signs telling them not to go into places).

Legal ambiguity over whether sex and other associated words mean biological sex or sex as modified by a gender recognition certificate (or even self-declared “gender identity”) put the foreseeability of the law in question.

The same is true about lawful rules (including those that are communicated with simple symbols 🚹🚺🚻).

If you put up this sign 🚺 that means no men allowed in.

➡️ It is lawful to discriminate against men in this situation.
➡️ It is reasonable for women to expect that there will be no men trying to come in, and they can challenge or report any that try it on.

So if you are a man - this sign 🚺 (and the expectation that you comply with it just like everyone else) is not an unlawful infringement on your Article 8 rights.

In fact the clarity of the rule supports your Art 8 rights.

https://x.com/Wonkypolicywonk/status/1923399139758313775

Grumpsy · 16/05/2025 21:16

A fool and his money are easily parted. All those that donated to this would have been better off having a bonfire with it, it leads to the same end.

SlackJawedDisbeliefXY · 16/05/2025 21:18

Just out of interest - when Maugham pursues these cases, does he do it at some reduced rate or is he essentially drumming up hopeless business for himself?

How much does he charge?

Has he already paid himself a nice dollop of cash for the holidays for preparing the letter to send to the EHRC and Bridget Phillipson?

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 16/05/2025 21:21

eatfigs · 16/05/2025 16:51

Jolyon has posted a video here for his fans: https://x.com/GoodLawProject/status/1923371695210893724

What’s with the incessant blinking?! He looks like someone on the edge of sanity.

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 16/05/2025 21:23

TracyCruz · 16/05/2025 17:07

He's a tax lawyer. Tax and Toilets both start with a T, as does Trans. It's a tenuous link but all I've got.

Twat also begins with T, and he’s definitely one of those.

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 16/05/2025 21:25

NecessaryScene · 16/05/2025 20:27

when he says eminent KCs have told him he's got a slam dunk, they're probably just saying that to get rid of him.

"So he's got £500,000 of crowdfunding money, he's desperate for any advice on how to get the ECtHR to declare a bad court thingy on the UK Supreme Court, and we get to keep our names off it?"

"Yep."

"Go for it. Just for god's sake don't even hint that we'd actually represent him in court - there's a remote chance he might actually try it for real. You know my wife reads Tribunal Tweets."

Edited

Are these the same KC’s that told him FWS definitely wouldn’t win? Do you think they’re in the room with him now?! 😂

SlackJawedDisbeliefXY · 16/05/2025 21:30

How about Greed Flaw Project?

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 16/05/2025 21:30

LittleBitofBread · 16/05/2025 18:04

Precisely this. What a lot of sound and fury. Why aren't they fundraising and campaigning for, say, awareness-raising about how gender-non-conforming men in men's spaces shouldn't be subjected to violence or ridicule? I mean, I might even support that.

Because it’s ultimately about forcing women to submit to them, that’s the kink, the fetish, the power trip. In general, they’re not going to get the reaction they want from men, it’s only women they want to dominate.

Lalgarh · 16/05/2025 21:33

Imma spamming this now. Hat tip @greenup who set up another thread on this. The LSE Law School dissecting the implications of the Supreme Court ruling. 2 hours.

Sarah Vine KC who specialises in vulnerable defendants cases v interesting. Also at the end they note that the Gender Recognition Act meant this ruling seemed to flow naturally from the relevant legislation. In Australia and other countries that don't have that, it would actually be far harder to distinguish for single sex service etc

Nameychangington · 16/05/2025 21:38

SlackJawedDisbeliefXY · 16/05/2025 21:18

Just out of interest - when Maugham pursues these cases, does he do it at some reduced rate or is he essentially drumming up hopeless business for himself?

How much does he charge?

Has he already paid himself a nice dollop of cash for the holidays for preparing the letter to send to the EHRC and Bridget Phillipson?

No, yes, lots, yes.

IIRC he was initially crowdfunding £10k for him to look at the judgement. The judgement is available for free on the internet. I've looked at it several times myself.

SlackJawedDisbeliefXY · 16/05/2025 21:43

Nameychangington · 16/05/2025 21:38

No, yes, lots, yes.

IIRC he was initially crowdfunding £10k for him to look at the judgement. The judgement is available for free on the internet. I've looked at it several times myself.

I'm guessing that a crowd-funded-law-practice does not have a whole lot of setup costs (a couple of computers, work from home etc.) so perhaps almost all of the donations will go on 'salaries'?

Is it a charity? Any financial declarations?

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 16/05/2025 21:57

OhBuggerandArse · 16/05/2025 15:30

Interestingly, according to Companies House, JM is no longer a director at the Good Law Project, but he is the only director of the Good Law Practice. 🤔 But they both have the same correspondence address.

AelitaQueenofMars · 16/05/2025 22:01

SlackJawedDisbeliefXY · 16/05/2025 21:43

I'm guessing that a crowd-funded-law-practice does not have a whole lot of setup costs (a couple of computers, work from home etc.) so perhaps almost all of the donations will go on 'salaries'?

Is it a charity? Any financial declarations?

Nope, it’s a limited company. The website claims it’s a ‘non profit.’ Presumably Jolyon pays himself some kind of salary. He’s not wandering around wearing sackcloth, for sure.

GOOD LAW PROJECT LIMITED overview - Find and update company information - GOV.UK

GOOD LAW PROJECT LIMITED - Free company information from Companies House including registered office address, filing history, accounts, annual return, officers, charges, business activity

https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/10556197

Hoardasurass · 16/05/2025 22:06

SionnachRuadh · 16/05/2025 20:13

There's a good possibility they've taken legal advice from themselves.

Which works in our favour, because Jolyon's legal expertise is mostly in the area of helping Gary Barlow minimise his tax bill, and when he says eminent KCs have told him he's got a slam dunk, they're probably just saying that to get rid of him.

I'm sure he's had advice from the likes of rmw whom as we all know (atleast those who heard his women's hour interview) is a "expert" in these matters 🤪

proximalhumerous · 16/05/2025 22:19

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 16/05/2025 21:21

What’s with the incessant blinking?! He looks like someone on the edge of sanity.

Yes! I could tell something felt weird and disturbing about the video (other than the content!) but couldn't put my finger on what it was.

KnottyAuty · 16/05/2025 22:29

Lalgarh · 16/05/2025 21:33

Imma spamming this now. Hat tip @greenup who set up another thread on this. The LSE Law School dissecting the implications of the Supreme Court ruling. 2 hours.

Sarah Vine KC who specialises in vulnerable defendants cases v interesting. Also at the end they note that the Gender Recognition Act meant this ruling seemed to flow naturally from the relevant legislation. In Australia and other countries that don't have that, it would actually be far harder to distinguish for single sex service etc

Yes after hearing that today I thought it would be best if the GRA was not repealed. It is apparently what made the SC ruling on the EA possible and it will remain in itself a useful law.

dubaichocolate · 16/05/2025 22:59

I’m surprised the TRAs don’t want to be strip searched by men, wouldn’t that be part of the sissy humiliation routine? I can’t believe I’m typing that but sadly my brain knows too much about this area these days.

There was a snippet of an interview with two of the kids posted on X, that’s where it was suggested that they were both trans. They were discussing the different attitudes of eg their school between one transitioning and the other transitioning a few years later.

nebulae · 16/05/2025 23:01

🤣🤣🤣

Good Law Project suing the EHRC and Bridget Phillipson - letter before action
ThatsNotMyTeen · 16/05/2025 23:03

Glamourreader · 16/05/2025 15:34

Wow, they really, really, really want to use the ladies, and the ladies in the ladies in order to feel like ladies

Exactly. I thought “they just wanted to pee”? Surely they can do that in the gents. What a lot of absolute nonsense. I really am losing patience rapidly with these ludicrous tantrums.

ArtemisiaTheArtist · 17/05/2025 02:10

TL, DR: Why do people keep being conned out of their money by this fraud?

Stop giving Jo money and hopefully he’ll go away.