Banned from breastfeeding group for objecting to males breastfeeding

[snickerdoodle1990]

Hi everyone,

I gave birth a few months ago and had some breastfeeding difficulties, so joined a local breastfeeding support group in my city. It’s basically a place to go for support with feeding, plus meet other mums/have a cuppa and biscuit etc. They also have a FB group. It’s become a nice, friendly place to go once every couple of weeks.

Recently, a trans-woman (male) has joined the group asking for support because their wife has not long had a baby and the trans-woman is wishing to breastfeed too, apparently through use of hormones and domperidone (?) to stimulate supply (I did not realise this was possible at all)

I really really object to this person being present in a group of women who are seeking breastfeeding support, trying to come together in their breastfeeding experience and also revealing themselves intimately

I told the group leader my concerns and she basically told me to shove it - said that the group is a safe space for everyone and they support all who wish to breastfeed and that I shouldn’t come back because I am a bigot

I am horrified as are the other women, where do we all stand and what would you do?

It is in the hear and now for a minority of trans women but not for men in general

so you believe ( despite 12 hours ago not even knowing it was a possibility) that transwomen can produce breast milk that can nourish a child ?

how does a transwoman differ from other men?

Not a troll at all,
Anyone with a different point of view in relation to these kind of topics on MN and who goes against the general ( narrow minded ) way of thinking is branded a troll in order to quieten them

The usual bullying by narrow minded individuals

You claimed that you were sharing a legal and social definition of mother. They can ID however they want but a TIM cannot legally be a mother.

I haven’t heard that other men ( not trans women) were as yet interested in doing it but there may be some out there that are

There's been enough experimentation on children with experimental drugs and brutal surgery in pursuit of the failed "born in the wrong body" nonsense.
Nobody should be experimenting on babies with male secretions instead of female breast milk.

Women are discouraged from taking paracetamol when pregnant. Anyone who thinks that you can feed the effluent from the secretions of drug induced male lactations to a baby is more than a few sandwiches short of a picnic. 100% child abuse.

It really isn’t likely that the human future near or far includes all fathers being encouraged to take hormones and drugs to grow breasts and lactate. Whatever deranged fantasies that poster has.

(Also a scientist. Not that you need to be one to see this.)

Traditionally LLL core groups were always mothers only.in the last 10 years or so some of their leaders opened their meetings to dads too and then started claiming they had 'always' been mixed. This was part of the issue raised by the 5/6 trustees who got booted as leaders and trustees just for pointing this out and trying to stick to the original purpose

Again, to reiterate, there is no way of you knowing this,

You have a very limited way to thinking if you think you can rule out with certainty such possibilities in the future

How can you tell transwomen are males? Society falling over itself to cater for their emotional needs ahead of the physical and emotional needs of newborn infants and birthing mothers. When I was pregnant I was so unwell I was unable to work, yet I was not permitted to take medications that would help, not because they were harmful to baby, but because ‘we don’t know if they are’. At every turn the pregnant and postpartum woman is made to put first the needs of the unborn/newborn child. Yet the moment a man ‘needs’ to do something that is quite obviously of no benefit to anyone but himself, and very likely harmful (or at least ‘we don’t know’) so called ‘inclusive feminists’ are up in arms, calling for open-mindedness. Where is the open mindedness towards the alcoholic pregnant woman whose need to drink might cause her baby fetal alcohol syndrome? It’s nowhere, despite that being vastly more common occurance than a breastfeeding transwomam. My god the sexism is off the wall.

As a scientist, I really disagree. It would require a clinical trial in which babies are randomly assigned to their breastfeeding mothers, and "breastfeeding" fathers, and to compare the long term health outcomes of mum-fed vs dad-fed children. This would be to prove the lack of negative health effects of drug induced male milk without a clear hypothesis of the benefits. Assuming, of course, that we will ever be able to have some drugs that can induce full lactation in a male.

Most of us are women on here - we know about babies and breastfeeding. Unfortunately we also know more than we'd like about the emotionally incontinent fantasies of men determined to breach the boundaries of women and children - and now babies.
The mother baby dyad is one of the last boundaries these men are attempting to breach - but will ultimately fail.

I'm not. There are zero good reasons for a man to involve a newborn infant in his role play. At best the baby gets nothing beneficial from it and at worst it's actively harmed. It absolutely is abusive.

I Disagree, formula was invented as a means of providing nutrition to babies, they were capable of testing that to determine its nutritional value, there is a possibility that the same could be done with milk secreted from a male. You are delusional if you think you could say with certainty that this is not beyond the realms of possibilities

Not beyond the realm of possibilities, likelihood 0.001%.

@Blueskies25 breastmilk is demonstrably superior to formula. What benefit to the baby is there in chemically induced lactation from a male?

Everything around infant feeding should have the babies best interest front and centre.

So we have naturally occurring female breast milk as the optimum and when that's not possible we have extensively tested formula milk, which both parents (and anyone else) can use to feed a baby.

So what's the rationale for spending time and resources testing whether drug induced male secretions can show any benefit compared to the two tried and tested methods of infant feeding we already have?

In what way would this benefit infants?

It doesn't benefit them in any way at all. It's driven by the wants of a small number of men with an out of hand fetish. These men need to be told no very firmly by the authorities.

We're all different. You clearly didn't find this an issue. When I was breastfeeding I felt happy to do it just about anywhere, and I was discreet, but the idea of having my latch examined in a public place with random members of the public wandering about nearby leaves me quite aghast. I would also add that the random members of the public might not be too chuffed either. My husband would probably avoid using a cafe at the same times as a group like that.

Formula milk began before the Cochrane Institute was founded. I’m not sure “invented” is quite right - commercialised is maybe more like it ans supplemental feeding and wet nursing has long history. But there’s a lot of empirical data to show it’s not harmful. There’s a real difference between those situations and experimental male lactation. Someone could test it. But they haven’t. If the person OP mentions was a responsible parent they’d be getting medical advice/support and organising these tests to check they weren’t causing harm. OP doesn’t mention this - and before you say OP can’t know, I’d say thats unlikely because everyone sees and hears everything at a breastfeeding support group. There’s zero privacy.

I think we all know who's delusional on this thread. Testing one or two samples is not nearly enough to ensure whether male breastfeeding is a viable alternative to the mother breastfeeding her own baby. This has been explained in detail many times on this thread. It's not just what's in the milk, it's the extraordinary way in which the mother's body responds to the baby's needs and growth. That feedback mechanism couldn't happen in a male body.

Hopefully it will happen but people are worried about being sued/attacked/fined
New mothers and people working at orgs like this already have issues with financial security and employment, so it's easy to threaten/silence them

I’ve been googling if men can produce ‘breast milk’ and I am very confused.

Can men produce milk suitable to feed a baby like a woman ?

Male people can produce a substance that no one has even adequately tested for chemical contents..

@Dozycuntlaters the world has indeed gone mad.

If someone wants to wear a frock and call theirself Edith I don't give a rats arse but even after the SC ruling TW are still ignoring the law and biology.
I don't agree all trans people have mental health issues but in the case of TW breast feeding I agree.

I work at the highest level in my industry surrounded by men. I don't barge into their men's health events. I don't ask for a prostrate check. It's not being kind, it's delusional and unsafe.