Gender Neutral Loos

[LoveCherryTree]

So I went to a restaurant on Saturday with my girl friends. I go to the loo, and a lad walks out of one of the cubicles, ok, that’s ok, bit surprised, I go into another, finish and walk out to wash my hands, another guy also in the “communal” part of the loo….feeling slightly nervy about being alone in a room with two strange men, but try to just do what I usually do, wash my hands, both men come to stand either side of me and ask me if I’m having a good night, try and just be polite and say yes whilst trying to just get out of there, when one says, “do you fancy a better night?”
they both get too close for comfort and start cornering me towards one of the cubicles whilst laughing. I am literally panicking thinking what the hell, luckily another two women walk through the door and the guys laugh and walk out.
I’m sorry, but I’m not a nervous person, but this really scared me, why do we need communal loos, AIBU to ask if we could just stick to male and female separate loos to avoid such incidences and I’m not saying all men are the same! I’m just saying, walking into a communal loo with a stranger or two can be bloody nerve wracking?

People complain about trans men / women using men/women's bathrooms, so businesses use gender neutral bathrooms. People then complain about that. Don't like it? Don't return. It's a toilet, pee or don't I honestly don't see why anybody cares this much.

People mainly complain about men being in women's spaces, and vice versa, not trans people using single sex spaces for the sex they were determined as at conception and will remain as even after death.

How would you respond to a muslim or orthodox jewish woman who told you that a lack of single sex toilets made it impossible to visit their local shopping centre? Do you think this is good for the shopping centre, from a financial, reputational or legal point of view?

For clarity, by "men" and "women" I mean the usual definition everyone used until 2015 and 95% still use.

Are you claimimg that :

• females objecting to females with a transgender identity using the female bathroom because they were trans

• males objected to males with a transgender identity using the male bathroom because they were trans and

was the reason that mixed sex bathrooms were provided?

Let me kindly point out that excluding a female from a female bathroom just because she trans a transphobic act. (Same for males too)

In the UK its both sex and gender reassignment discrimination.

I hate mixed sex toilets. Men piss everywhere. Then women hover and it gets worse.

There's an excellent, very easy to read and understand guide to the regulations and the law.
https://sex-matters.org/posts/updates/the-truth-about-toilets/?fbclid=IwY2xjawJ3MzdleHRuA2FlbQIxMQBicmlkETFlM0FyYmhhY0ZjOUY1aktvAR7Wi0Q45PQZfv4xSLR2XRISICb13USCwGEVipVCMtCq9VP7e4DpmxhIdfow7w_aem_c_o1XO2r8X_DgzSHQR4cOA

Ah, the individual cubicles plus shared sink area has become very common on university campuses every time they refurbish or build new toilets.

I don’t like having to wash my hands after the toilet next to males. I don’t find it sufficiently private for dealing with female bodily things.

But I am not a ‘cool girl’

I hate this too. I don't want to be in a space like this on my own with males who I don't know. I had an incident recently at a gig where there was a unisex facility like this at the end of a corridor. I felt very vulnerable, and I was willing for other women to come in.

I think gender neutral toilets are fine BUT only if they are a single full unit - toilet, wash basin, dryer etc. all in one room that is fully enclosed. Those kinds of facilities are useful for many people such as parents with young children, as well as for trans-identified people.

You need far more single units with toilet, sink and drier. People spend longer in them than if they use a cubicle then vacate it for someone else to use while they wash their hands at a communal sink.

Well in my experience those kind of facilities are either found in addition to regular single sex toilets, or if they are the only facility then it is a small venue like a cafe and so efficiency is less of a concern.

Your use of the word 'bathroom' suggests you are American in which case you possibly aren't familiar with the requirements of The Building (Amendment) (England) Regulations 2024, i.e. there should be separate single sex toilets for men and women, and a 'universal' toilet may be added if there is space, but it is optional.
Other regulations require adapted accessible facilities for disabled people.

It's not rocket science, it's just building regs.

I've come across three places with just a row or corridor of these and no other toilets.

You'll mind if your kid collapses inside one and no one realises it.

See when there's "cubicles" and "cubicles and urinals" and fellas go into the "cubicles" door, they're the ones to watch out for!

That is a fair point, though I think the chances of that are fairly small in that age group.

Yet not negligible. How many deaths are acceptable? It’s also the fear of having a child with a heart condition, diabetes, epilepsy, asthma and sending them to school knowing they are not as safe as they could be.

We know children collapse at school.
It means these toilets have to have a mechanism to open inwards doors outwards from the outside because bodies get stuck. Also all schools have a defibrillator. In the recent cases I know of children dying in enclosed cubicles in school, cpr was tried in all cases but failed. I know they were looking for one child who they knew was distressed for over an hour.

It isn’t really the schools fault but it’s absolutely horrendous these designs haven’t been properly risk assessed.

I try and explain it like wearing a seat belt. I always put one on but have never needed one yet.

No not neglible, there is always a risk so normal single sex toilets with cubicles are best but there's no room for those at my kid's school, it's always had the self contained loos since it was built in the 50s.

That’s interesting and very unusual. So they have no floor to door gap whatsoever?

No, no gap at all. I think it's the normal school design in my country from that time frame, I've seen the same in many schools.

Could be worse though, when my mum was in school their toilet was an outhouse (pit toilet) with two seats over the pit next to each other in one room and the children were sent to the toilet in pairs. Now I certainly hope they were sent in single sex pairs! I have used that toilet myself, my mum's cousin now owns the old school house and turned it into his summer cottage.

Ah not in UK. I research UK toilets.

In medieval times in Britain they used to have a long row of toilets - a bit like a wooden plank with holes in. One architect I heard discussing toilet design seemed very excited about this 😵‍💫

I guess it was rather similar to medieval Britain in the early 60s in Lapland

😁

How freeing it must be to breeze through life not giving a shit about anyone else but oneself