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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Man says sorry

29 replies

Lovelyview · 19/04/2025 12:13

https://archive.ph/FN89Q

Mark Smith of The Herald says sorry to women. To be honest it sounds like his arc from be kind to gender critical is similar to my own (although I didn't pay much attention rather than supporting self id) so I'm not sure he's got a huge amount to be sorry for. It's nice to hear though.

OP posts:
Pluvia · 19/04/2025 12:19

Wow. The author John Boyne is the only other man I know who has apologised — though in his case he's apologised to Graham Linehan for criticisms about Linehan's defence of women's rights. So he hasn't actually apologised to women. All I'm seeing, from women as well as men, is defiance and what I can only describe as hysteria: my FB (which I check in on a couple of times a month) is full of left-wing lesbians having nervous breakdowns over the assertion of women's right to single-sex spaces and female biology, and copious apologies to transpeople for the terrible harm being done to them. One of my neighbours who works for the NHS is beside herself with grief and trying to raise an army of people to go to a local pro-trans demo this afternoon.

EmilyMarcel · 19/04/2025 12:35

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

Annascaul · 19/04/2025 12:37

Pluvia · 19/04/2025 12:19

Wow. The author John Boyne is the only other man I know who has apologised — though in his case he's apologised to Graham Linehan for criticisms about Linehan's defence of women's rights. So he hasn't actually apologised to women. All I'm seeing, from women as well as men, is defiance and what I can only describe as hysteria: my FB (which I check in on a couple of times a month) is full of left-wing lesbians having nervous breakdowns over the assertion of women's right to single-sex spaces and female biology, and copious apologies to transpeople for the terrible harm being done to them. One of my neighbours who works for the NHS is beside herself with grief and trying to raise an army of people to go to a local pro-trans demo this afternoon.

Edited

What on earth is a “pro trans” demo? What are they actually protesting about?

lcakethereforeIam · 19/04/2025 12:46

That men will no longer be able to get naked in women's changing rooms? That rapists won't be locked in women's jails. That raped women can access support without a larping man in the room? That vulnerable or disabled women won't have to worry that their intimate care will be provided by a man in a cheap wig? That the Police won't sanction their officers, who claim to have lady brains, forcing women to undress and let them search their naked bodies?

All good causes. The best 😠

TheOtherRaven · 19/04/2025 12:46

lcakethereforeIam · 19/04/2025 12:46

That men will no longer be able to get naked in women's changing rooms? That rapists won't be locked in women's jails. That raped women can access support without a larping man in the room? That vulnerable or disabled women won't have to worry that their intimate care will be provided by a man in a cheap wig? That the Police won't sanction their officers, who claim to have lady brains, forcing women to undress and let them search their naked bodies?

All good causes. The best 😠

This.

Women have too many rights. They're really inconvenient. Send help.

Annascaul · 19/04/2025 12:48

lcakethereforeIam · 19/04/2025 12:46

That men will no longer be able to get naked in women's changing rooms? That rapists won't be locked in women's jails. That raped women can access support without a larping man in the room? That vulnerable or disabled women won't have to worry that their intimate care will be provided by a man in a cheap wig? That the Police won't sanction their officers, who claim to have lady brains, forcing women to undress and let them search their naked bodies?

All good causes. The best 😠

Well, exactly…
But surely the simpletons aren’t actually going to put that on their banners?

InWithThePlums · 19/04/2025 12:51

Pluvia · 19/04/2025 12:19

Wow. The author John Boyne is the only other man I know who has apologised — though in his case he's apologised to Graham Linehan for criticisms about Linehan's defence of women's rights. So he hasn't actually apologised to women. All I'm seeing, from women as well as men, is defiance and what I can only describe as hysteria: my FB (which I check in on a couple of times a month) is full of left-wing lesbians having nervous breakdowns over the assertion of women's right to single-sex spaces and female biology, and copious apologies to transpeople for the terrible harm being done to them. One of my neighbours who works for the NHS is beside herself with grief and trying to raise an army of people to go to a local pro-trans demo this afternoon.

Edited

Re Boyne: I think he was GC for a fair bit before he realised that GL was saying the same thing as him, so the personal apology made sense.

FeelingLessTired · 19/04/2025 13:04

Annascaul · 19/04/2025 12:48

Well, exactly…
But surely the simpletons aren’t actually going to put that on their banners?

Maybe they can just put 'Women said 'no'. And we don't like it'.

Chersfrozenface · 19/04/2025 13:08

TheOtherRaven · 19/04/2025 12:46

This.

Women have too many rights. They're really inconvenient. Send help.

IKR? These people complaining about women having too many rights.

So very incelesque, so very Andrew Tate-ish.

morningtoncrescent62 · 19/04/2025 13:11

Mark's been onside for a while. IIRC he got converted talking to sensible women at a women's rights demo outside Holyrood a few years ago, and he's written some decent articles. He has much less to apologise for than the likes of Swinney.

FeelingLessTired · 19/04/2025 13:15

morningtoncrescent62 · 19/04/2025 13:11

Mark's been onside for a while. IIRC he got converted talking to sensible women at a women's rights demo outside Holyrood a few years ago, and he's written some decent articles. He has much less to apologise for than the likes of Swinney.

Absolutely.

I am LOVING how effectively he is pointing that out.

Pluvia · 19/04/2025 13:18

Re Boyne: I think he was GC for a fair bit before he realised that GL was saying the same thing as him, so the personal apology made sense.

IIRC (too lazy to double-check!) Boyne was a trans ally and when GL had a couple of pops at him for betraying women's rights, he invoked the wrath of the TRAs. He then wrote a book about a character who had a trans sibling which led to a massive, traumatising pile-on from the TRAs because he didn't, according to them, get it right. I may have misremembered half of that. But I did see his very gracious apology to GL on Twitter just the other day.

InWithThePlums · 19/04/2025 13:34

Pluvia · 19/04/2025 13:18

Re Boyne: I think he was GC for a fair bit before he realised that GL was saying the same thing as him, so the personal apology made sense.

IIRC (too lazy to double-check!) Boyne was a trans ally and when GL had a couple of pops at him for betraying women's rights, he invoked the wrath of the TRAs. He then wrote a book about a character who had a trans sibling which led to a massive, traumatising pile-on from the TRAs because he didn't, according to them, get it right. I may have misremembered half of that. But I did see his very gracious apology to GL on Twitter just the other day.

I think that’s about right, but he was still having a pop at GL after his conversion iyswim. It was a very good apology.

TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · 19/04/2025 13:45

Helen Joyce says we should let them over the Golden Bridge, so out of respect for her, because she's more than earned it, I'll say well done that man, although I'd much prefer to kick them off bridge.

mrshoho · 19/04/2025 13:48

lcakethereforeIam · 19/04/2025 12:46

That men will no longer be able to get naked in women's changing rooms? That rapists won't be locked in women's jails. That raped women can access support without a larping man in the room? That vulnerable or disabled women won't have to worry that their intimate care will be provided by a man in a cheap wig? That the Police won't sanction their officers, who claim to have lady brains, forcing women to undress and let them search their naked bodies?

All good causes. The best 😠

The women took their stuff back that we robbed them of and it's not fair boo hoo.

Pluvia · 19/04/2025 14:05

In conversation with a terfy friend earlier I asked whether she was aware of any men who'd apologised to women. She said she thought Brendan O'Neill (Spiked) had apologised once.

FeelingLessTired · 19/04/2025 14:08

Brendan ONeill has been completely terfy though. And very excoriating of TRAs though.

Did he have an earlier #bekind history? I missed it if so. I really enjoy his writings.

ArabellaScott · 19/04/2025 14:11

Thank you, Mark Smith.

NPET · 19/04/2025 14:18

TheOtherRaven · 19/04/2025 12:46

This.

Women have too many rights. They're really inconvenient. Send help.

Yes we ARE inconvenient aren't we?😊
I mean, how dare a body exist without an obvious spout and two rubbery capsules containing the gift of life?
It's almost as if a place to incubate that gift of life was needed! Almost as if it needs to emerge from another body after 9 months.
And don't talk to me about privacy needed to expel liquid waste. Who could imagine such a thing was needed?

Pluvia · 19/04/2025 15:53

FeelingLessTired · 19/04/2025 14:08

Brendan ONeill has been completely terfy though. And very excoriating of TRAs though.

Did he have an earlier #bekind history? I missed it if so. I really enjoy his writings.

I think she thought he had been through a TRA phase.

mathanxiety · 19/04/2025 16:02

FeelingLessTired · 19/04/2025 13:04

Maybe they can just put 'Women said 'no'. And we don't like it'.

Perfect.

I bet they would too...

FeelingLessTired · 19/04/2025 16:07

Pluvia · 19/04/2025 15:53

I think she thought he had been through a TRA phase.

aaah- I wondered if I had missed something!

RoyalCorgi · 19/04/2025 16:10

FeelingLessTired · 19/04/2025 14:08

Brendan ONeill has been completely terfy though. And very excoriating of TRAs though.

Did he have an earlier #bekind history? I missed it if so. I really enjoy his writings.

I don't think he was ever TRA, but I do remember him saying in an article something like he hadn't fully appreciated the crap women went through before the trans issue came along. I can't remember the exact wording, but it was on the lines that it took the full-blown misogyny of trans activists to show him just what women had to put up with.

SidewaysOtter · 19/04/2025 16:20

Thank you Mark.

<tips hat>

FrothyCothy · 19/04/2025 16:28

That’s a great piece. If only the JOBs and LOJs of the world could have a modicum of the same insight.