Non fatal strangulation and choking during sex

[ArabellaScott]

Grim read.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62zwy0nex0o

I don’t think anyone is denying it, they’re simply pointing out the consequences/dangers of what is being advocated by some posters.
Sadly, the experiences of women are very often denied, mostly when they are saying no to men about what they are not prepared or willing to do sexually. If you are lucky enough to have found a sexually compatible partner who totally respects your boundaries then that is fantastic, but spare a thought for young girls who are being pressured into harmful/dangerous practices by porn addled men, they need to hear from more experienced women that they have every right to say no.

Do you think that in 15 years this has never occurred to her or do you think it is more likely that this is part of an abusive relationship in which she has lost all concept of what she doesn’t have to tolerate?

I agree and I am a strong advocate for this all the way. But again, PP have said numerous times in this thread alone that there is “no reason for anal sex” and “there is no pleasure in this for women” which also shames women who do want to safely explore these things. Remember, anal play is something women can (and do!) explore on their own as well. Learning for yourself what feels good without the pressure of what men want or will gain from it is incredibly powerful and will always be something I actively encourage for all young women.

Understanding informed consent and a full, comprehensive sex education is absolutely vital. Beyond that no woman gets to decide what is or is not “right” for another woman to enjoy.

There's also something that's not spoken about, which is how easily women (and girls) are coerced into sex. So consent appears to be there, but it really isn't, because the consent occurs within the much wider context of a woman's life and place in society. Especially for young women at the beginning of their sexual journey, inexperienced, unsure, struggling with low self esteem, desperate to please the boyfriend so that he will stay, terrified that if she says no to something he'll move on to another woman who will consent, terrified to be labelled a prude, told that pain is normal and even desirable, aping what they're seeing in porn and on social media. There is so much more to it than simply saying the word yes.

Ask yourself what it says about him and his feelings about women generally and you as a woman that he wants to do this.

I don't think it's just boys who are porn addled now, I think young women are too.

Men look at the women in porn and say that's how women should be.

Women look at the women in porn and say that's how I should be. They don't see the off camera stuff, the bruising and bleeding and pain, unable to use the toilet without pain, the affect on mental health, the misery.

I feel really sorry for you if you think that if you're not being asphyxiated during sex, you're just lying on your back not enjoying it 😞. You need to get out more and find a partner who's good at sex tbh. And use a bit of imagination.

men in same sex situations would be included in these sats

so it's not really telling you who is DOING the strangulation, only who it is done to

Flip side, I do actually know women in the porn industry. While this is one (very dark and accurate) side of it there is another level. With women in charge of writing their own scenes, choosing their partners with full health screenings and having agreed do’s and don’ts.

The positive side to social media is that when men in the industry have behaved badly in any way they are publicly called out and the women choose to stop working with them.

This is at least one positive of the OF generation. While you can think what you like about the porn industry (and yes, I have opinions too) there is a level of agency available now for those working for themselves on this level.

I am of course absolutely, in every way, against websites like pornhub.

Do you really believe straight men don’t enjoy being strangled? The stats say SLIGHTLY higher, not significantly, because many men love to be dominated by women. This isn’t just the extreme of gimp masks and stilettos on balls. They like to be asphyxiated by partners and spanked.. and, gasp, yes indeed - straight men love to be pegged by women.

Sexuality - and much other behaviour - seems to have become increasingly performative. I feel like the focus on Insta-selfie-filters-appearances-sharing has affected how we relate to other people. Seems to be more about status than the experience located in the individual.

Putting your hands round someone’s throat isn’t violent?! Yes, I put my hands round people’s throats ALL the time 🤦‍♀️ It’s obvious what is in a man’s mind when he does this.

He’s been watching way too much extreme porn, and for a long time.

He has been putting you in a great deal of danger.

While you can think what you like about the porn industry (and yes, I have opinions too) there is a level of agency available now for those working for themselves on this level.

There are very few women in porn working on those levels though.

That's as valid a comparison as it is to say that prostitution isn't so bad because a small minority of women charge £1000 a night and stay in luxury hotels. Doesn't change that the vast majority are working the streets, being paid peanuts and being abused.

Glamourising porn by suggesting that women taking charge and being treated well is the norm now is misleading, and unhelpful.

Sheila Jeffreys talks of how most practices that end up in hetosexual porn started off in gay porn.

For men, the appeal may be obvious...for women, less so. Personally, what I want ( if and when I want it) is vaginal penetration... and that comes from a very deep place... a primally deep calling, if you like. I'd be both offended and frustrated if anal was primarily what a man was after.There is also, of course, the risk of fecal matter being transferred into the vagina

I did not say it was the norm, what I did say is it is happening. It needs to be made the norm.

I honestly don't think it's positive if the women are organising it themselves, TBH. Onlyfans and the like are new. It's too soon to say what their real impact on women is going to be. We have a generation who are just beginning to see what it means to have aspects of your life which would previously have been private now made public for all to see. Women have always made money from selling sex to men. I don't deny that. But I think we should be very concerned about a society in which women are being told that selling sex to men is not just an option, but a desirable one.

PSA #1

Safer forms of breathplay exist than strangulation

If you like the feeling of asphyxiation, you can simply hold your breath. You could put bondage tape over your mouth, hold a cat bell to ring, and have him hold your nose if it's that fucking important to you that he controls your breathing. It's still risky because he might not let go of your nose, but it's less risky than him crushing your throat.

Him squeezing your neck can fracture the cartilaginous structures, like the larynx. It puts pressure on the veins and arteries in your neck, which can cause strokes and brain death because the blood pressure in the brain goes too high, rupturing blood vessels, or too low, starving the brain of oxygen.

If you cannot orgasm without being put at proven risk of death and brain injury, you need therapy. If he cannot orgasm without putting someone else at risk of that, he needs to be in prison to protect all women from him.

PSA #2

Kinkplay without a safesignal and limits set is inherently dangerous and abusive.

I bet all these posters saying that their husbands strangle them, by request or otherwise, have never had their husband ask "what's your safesignal?" I bet they've never been asked to discuss preferences and limits. They've never had a cat bell tied to one finger to ring if they want to stop.

When I was on "the scene" twenty years ago, the test for doing something at all was that it had to be all of "safe, sane, and consensual". Strangulation is never safe and never sane. There is no excuse for it, ever.

Yes, 100%

https://wecantconsenttothis.uk/

'Although it is common for strangulation to leave no visible signs of injury, this research sets out the terrible harm suffered by victims of non-fatal strangulation, with the onset of symptoms sometimes delayed by days or weeks. Harms can include stroke, cardiac arrest, miscarriage, incontinence, seizures, paralysis, speech disorders, and other forms of long term brain injury.'

• Up to 10% of the population have experienced strangulation.
• This rises to over 50% of women subject to routine domestic abuse, and up to 20% of women who have been sexually assaulted.
• Strangulation is an overwhelmingly gendered crime: in a review of 300 forensic records in San Diego, 298 involved a man strangling a woman.
• if a woman has been strangled, the chance of her subsequently being murdered rises eightfold.
• Neck structures are alarmingly fragile: blocking the jugular vein can take less pressure than opening a can of Coke.
• Consciousness can be lost within as little as 4 seconds of arterial pressure. Losing consciousness indicates at the very least a mild brain injury. Consciousness was lost in between 17% and 38% of strangulation incidents identified.
• It is thought strangulation might be the second most common cause of stroke in women under 40.
• In terms of pathology, strangulation was shown to lead to dissection of the main neck arteries, blocking of blood flow to and from the brain, brain swelling, cardiac arrest, miscarriage, and stroke (which can be delayed by weeks).
• Neurological consequences of strangulation include: loss of consciousness (which indicates at least mild brain injury), paralysis, movement disorders, speech disorders, incontinence, and seizures.
• Cognitive consequences include: amnesia, and impaired ‘executive function’ (e.g. decision-making, planning, judgement).
• Psychological consequences include: PTSD, dissociation, suicidality, depression, anxiety, and personality change
• Behavioural consequences include: increased compliant and submissive behaviour, and survival-based aggression

Also from that link:

'In a bizarre and unethical experiment in the 1940s in which prisoners and psychiatric patients were strangled to observe the effects, the lead researcher first tried the equipment on himself[2]. There was an emergency release button. He found himself unable to press it, even when he wanted to. He was unsure whether this was due to forgetting he could (amnesia) or messages from the brain not getting to his hand (dyspraxia). He almost died. Both these impairments were the result of altered brain and mind functioning as a result of strangulation.'

The full research paper from WCCTT:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33432860/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36526942/

'Recent research indicates that some young people initially learn about sexual choking through Internet memes. Thus, a qualitative content analysis was performed on 316 visual and textual memes collected from various social media websites and online searches to assess salient categories related to choking during sex. We identified nine main categories: communication, gendered dynamics, choking as dangerous, choking as sexy, sexualization of the nonsexual, shame and worry, romance/rough sex juxtaposition, choking and religious references, instructional/informational. Given that memes, through their humor, can make difficult topics more palatable and minimize potential harm in the phenomenon they depict, more concerted, synergistic effort that integrates media literacy into sexuality education programming on the potential risks that may ensue for those engaging in sexual choking is warranted. '

Sex-positive is one of those euphemisms developed by men to gaslight women into believing that dangerous and/or soul-destroying acts are in fact expressions of feminism or female strength.

Examples:

Polyamory = I'll cheat on you but you'll still accommodate me and keep house
Pressing = I'll strangle you because violence turns me on
Sex-positive = you'll do everything my favourite OF creator does and you'll believe you enjoy it, or act as if you do, because there's nothing worse than being a prude.

Has any woman here strangled a man in bed?