Actual gender critical left

[JumpingPumpkin]

I read this on their FB page today. I'm under no illusions as to whether Trump is genuinely supportive of women's rights (I don't believe he is), however I don't see how any of this was going to get resolved with the insane left in power.

There was no indication that any rollback was going to happen with Biden/Harris. I'm just wondering if anyone can comment on this as I do feel Trump is going to be a disaster in other areas.

"Ruth Serwotka:

"I'm not disappointed or shocked to see a large number of women who claim to be 'gender critical' embrace Trump and his billionaire oligarchy. It was written in the politics of many of them years ago.

Repeatedly I and other socialist feminists pointed out the ultra right wing drift, the myopic, endless focus on one thing to the point of banality, the reactionary evolution towards the Proud Boys and the shift towards upholding of traditional gender norms that implies.

Many of these women have become the enablers of a new age of reaction in America and elsewhere. They're currently on Musks social media platform cracking stupid jokes about the world not being in the grip of lunatics. They're celebrating as a victory that Trump has declared the existence of only two sexes (as if he's a deity).

There is zero focus on the fact Trump knows for sure which is the better sex, or his complaint that malign feminine energy, otherwise known as feminism, has brought America to its knees. No worries for our GC's. Nothing to see. Let's say we've won!

Well, biological sex is real for sure, but women have won nothing with Tumps election and could well lose everything, especially reproductive rights.

As matters progress I'm interested to see whether the "GCs" will unravel in the face of mass deportations of women and children, or enforced child bearing or the loss of freedom for lesbian and gay sexuality. Will they admit their hapless, clueless niavety or will they finally go down as red hot fascists in the end?"

"I'd rather fight the right for our rights than the left for our identity."

Thanks to whoever said this. Spot on.

Oh dear are feministing wrong because we - checks notes - agree with trump that there are only 2 biological sexes, a fact that until 10 minutes ago wasn’t even up for discussion??

the purity spirals spinneth on

As matters progress I'm interested to see whether the "GCs" will unravel in the face of mass deportations of women and children, or enforced child bearing or the loss of freedom for lesbian and gay sexuality. Will they admit their hapless, clueless niavety or will they finally go down as red hot fascists in the end?"

To paraphrase Titania McGrath

We have analysed the election data and thought carefully over how to win the hearts and minds of voters.

The only possible conclusion is that we didn't call them hapless and clueless domestic zombies enough.

Let's not make that mistake again.

AGCL has been the topic of many threads, including the lengthy one about their dishonest workshop at FiLia.

And their infiltration, or maybe they were invited, to WPUK was (IMO) why it closed itself down.

They are a tiny group of women who are only interested it criticising other women who dont have the purist of pure left politics.

So even if it means women (and their children suffer) they always condemn any one who even suggest a policy from the middle of the road let alone the right should be supported.

ie they aren't really feminists, because they never put women first.

Just dont listen to them.

A bit like the SWP they infiltrate and attempt to coopt groups that have (had) genuine out reach. So having closed WPUK down, with any luck they will end up closing FiLia down.

Somehow their purity is so pure, that to be popular must mean that you are not correct.

And for those with an even longer memory they were some of the prime movers that led to the huge blow up over women such as KJK and Julia Long going to the US, and initially Jean Hackett having gone sided with the AGCL arguement, although recently she seems to have stopped preaching only purity is good enough.

So would not worry what they said.

But I am sure you could start a thread based on what you think and what the issues are.

They dont need to be taken seriously.

What on earth do you want GC women to do? Some of us are just so bloody relieved that AT LAST someone is putting reality back into the world. I never thought I'd support Trump, but on this topic I support him completely. It doesn't mean I support everything he does but I am completely on board for declaring that there are only two sexes, and that men don't belong in women's sport, and that children should not be medical experiments.

Although why the hell any of this is even for discussion blows my mind. What on earth have people in power been thinking to let us get into this situation where women don't have rights and where children can chop off body parts before they are legally allowed a drink.

Well yes. And when Senator Ed Markey (D-MA) mildly pointed this out after the election loss, the reaction from the democratic party was as expected. The Boston Globe followed with its own condemnation until someone actually read the comments following the various articles - uniformly "look I voted for Harris but he is right" or "I am as liberal/left as they come but I don't want biological males on women's sports teams" A few more reasonable articles followed but they still don't get it.

The disconnect between party policy and what their voters actually think was stark. I would not and did not vote for Trump even if I think he is right on this one issue but someone in the Democrats needs to realise this is a major issue.

She's one of these people that think that anyone even a tiny inch to the right of her is literally Hitler.

sorry not Ed markey - Seth Moulton.

This

No - they really are like some group of students pontificating from an isolated priviledge position.

And, as can happen in groups, there is also an aspect of vendetta. ie they are obsessed about how dangerous WoLF is and endless try to belittle Kara Dansky (spelling).

Half the time I think the little green eyed monster cant bare that more women respond to WoLF than to them.

And as I said up thread, why not start your own thread about what the issues are for you.

The AGCL statement isn't even true. It is the usually over the top if you aren't with us, you are against us.

Many of us not just on FWR have said we can appreciate the policies but no in any way support the Republicans, let alone Trump.

This is what I meant by them not really being feminist.

Women's rights always come second.

Although as many have said, the real issue isn't what Trump is or is not doing but just as in the UK, when the Democrats had the opportunity to do something that gave women their sex based, but they chose not to.

Same.
Especially when Ruth Serwotka et al have done very nicely for themselves over many years on the backs of women in The Movement.

Life in the USA got worse for women what with men claiming women's trophies and scholarships, men in women's prison and STILL no guaranteed access to abortion.

The left can claim no moral high ground on women's rights. How docille and obedient does she think women should be?

I might have missed it, but did any AGCL women go to America and try to convince Democrats not to support trans ideology?

I really have no time for people who are essentially making up ideas from whole cloth.

There is zero reason to think Trump is going to make it impossible to be gay or lesbian. He has openly homosexual people in his administration, and in his employment, and has never said or done anything to suggest he might have a problem with that.

There are tons of gay people in the Republican Party.

He was dancing with the Village People at his inauguration, fgs!

A lot of people like the Real Feminists seem to have a completely made up set of beliefs about what Trump actually thinks, or what Republicans or conservatives actually think. Again and again, it's clear their ideas are completely distorted. They have made monsters of people who in the main are pretty normal with normal concerns.

It's just another thinly veiled jab at KJK as usual.

Something I wonder:

At what point is it ok for people to look at the complete shit the Democrats, or the Labour Party, are spouting, and the often shitty policies they are implementing,

and then look at the policies coming from the other side,

and then say, actually, on balance, it kind of looks like the left is in bad faith and doesn't give a shit about anyone, and the right is maybe a little better?

The two arguments she puts forth here are firstly, that Trump will somehow make things bad for gay and lesbian people - which is just a made up lie, there is no reason to think that and in fact his actions suggest it is bs. And then the question of abortion, which I appreciate still rankles, but actually is still being managed by democratic, responsible political institutions, just at the state level. It hasn't been taken over by dictators, and citizens may even be able to have more input than they did before.

Her real problem is purely about tribal allegiance.

I agree. There is quite blatant scaremongering on this issue.

It seems to be rooted in this 'all or nothing' mentality where people cannot seem to cope with any nuance at all.

Her real problem is purely about tribal allegiance.

Also this. The progressive left seems to have become so addicted to its vision of itself as the 'good guys' it will do literally anything to maintain that. Including barefaced lying.

The majority of the group (well the inner circle) are American but seems to have attracted some UK women eg Jayne Egerton.

Their focus seems to have been to put up a counter arguement to WoLF. The problem for them is WoLF went from strength to strength and they just floundered in a small pool of self congratulartury purity.

I am not sure they have ever bothered with the Democrats. They just seem to focus on saying why other women are wrong.

So for instance someone posted about a recent comment from Bev Jackson of LGB Alliance saying

" It expresses the 'middle ground' position being taken by some of the gcs who think of themselves as on the left. She generally deplores Trump but supports the two EOs & thinks we shouldn't be scared to say so rather than contribute to political polarisation. I struggle as much with this position as I do with the full on Trump supporters."

And one of the response from a founder member of ACGL was:
"Bev is a ding-dong and is normalizing fascism to protect her ego."

And yet they have this stern warning about being part of the group that says
"Be polite. Be civil. Make evidenced-based arguments. No vitriol. No ad hominems."

You also get kicked out of the group if you question one of the founding women's analysis.

So suggest if you want meaningful discussion on the conflict in being left aligned and gender critical, I dont this this is the group that will help this happen.

Alexa, what is a 'pyrrhic victory'?

Was just coming to post this. See also Jane Clare Jones. Absolute chumps the pair of them.

Oh, was that her?
Domesticated zombies?
She can bugger off then.

(For the absence of doubt, I despise fascists. I'm also not keen on the modern Left.)

I spent most of my life being very left wing, but had the tribalism knocked out of me by hard experience. Now I consider myself politically homeless.

It's all about tribal identity. All about who's in the club and who isn't. And I don't even think they're being in good faith with their purity spirals. Because ultimately there's a particular type of socfem who is almost identical to TRAs in background and ideology, and their main grievance is their own exclusion from the lefty club.

Kara Dansky isn't part of AGCL's club. She Who Shall Not Be Named is definitely not part of the club. So, definitionally, everything they say and do is wrong, even if it achieves a good result.

I'm willing to bet they view unrepentant MRAs like Owen Jones or Dickie Seymour as basically good comrades who just happen to be misguided on this one issue.

Well clearly we were supposed to carry on throwing ourselves, other women and vulnerable children under the gender ideology bus because the purity of left wing politics matters more than anything else. Even more achieving the thing we’ve all been striving for.

There is quite blatant scaremongering on this issue.

To go by some of the narrative swirling about you’d think Trump was reenacting The Handmaid’s Tale. For the record, I don’t like him or his politics but he’s not fucking Hitler.

I hate Trump and wouldn't care if he died.

I'm also gender critical and always have been, because I'm a feminist.

TRA love to love GC because it fits their narrative.