Kemi Badenoch

[CassieMaddox]

Looking unlikely to win the Conservative leadership now and has gone very quiet about women's rights/the EA during her campaign.

Current favourite is Cleverly.

I know she had a lot of support on here so just wondering what people thought had gone wrong for her?

It depends on Morgan McSweeney and for the time being, he wants Starmer.

I am not saying it is. But you are hardly her target market are you? Given your political views, if you didn’t consider her appalling then she would probably be in the wrong party.

She is straight talking and articulate. I feel you know what you get with her. I'm puzzled as to the accusations of racism and sexism though. Maybe I've been living in a box, but can you give me some examples - those making the case for that.

I heard what she said about maternity pay. In my opinion the current level of maternity pay is generous. It wasn't always the case - I think it was Blair government who increased maternity pay/leave to current levels. It is not unreasonable to ask where money comes from for benefits and how to prioritise them. That's what politicians are supposed to do.

Absolutely. She also dehumanised people needing care, reducing them to bottoms to be wiped.

Why wouldn't she be articulate? Most politicians are.

I heard what she said about maternity pay. In my opinion the current level of maternity pay is generous. It wasn't always the case - I think it was Blair government who increased maternity pay/leave to current levels

And so it bloody should be generous. I don't have children but I am very happy to contribute towards maternity pay.

@LongtailedTitmouse you're not wrong there. But it seems many Tories are the ones feeling she's in the wrong party.

@ThisOpalRobin and@PandoraSox I can't help but feel you overlooked the questions I was asking.

I didn't ask whether maternity pay should be generous, just observed that it is. I could remove the observation on articulacy completely, agreed many politicians are. But actually she is exceptionally talented in putting her points across.

@JoodyBlueToo was this your question? It's a bit convoluted:

It is not unreasonable to ask where money comes from for benefits and how to prioritise them.

If this is what you're asking I think you're being a bit disingenuous. All politicians do this to some degree, it's their job. I think Kemi is smart enough to know what will grab headlines and what she thinks people in charge of male-dominated business structures want to hear. But I don't think she is 'exceptionally good at putting her point across'. She's an efficient communicator, as she should be in her line of work.

I'm puzzled as to the accusations of racism and sexism though. Maybe I've been living in a box, but can you give me some examples

This was really my question.

When did I say she was racist and sexist? I called her a hypocrite and a snob.

Employers paying is one option; taxpayers paying is another; it's also possible to have an insurance type model. Or mixes of these systems.

It's also possible to look at the larger social structures and trends and think about whether they make the most sense for mothers, and whether changes there could mitigate issues around the direct policies.

There right be other possibilities too. All of these kinds of policies didn't come ready made, they were developed by people who thought about problems. The assumption that they are the only way to do things just stops people from thinking about other possibilities. If a policy isn't working well, the thing to do is recognize that, understand why, and try and think of something better.

You'd would do this as a pool. (As health insurance usually is.) So men would also pay in.

I'd also say though, from your other post, I don't think women or their kids should be sacrificed to GDP.

She's been accused of racism laundering and most recently spoke of some cultures being less equal. We all know what cultures she means. Got to appeal to those Reform voters.

It was another poster who said that, and what kind of sane black woman has her opinions.

Presumably the idea here is all sane black people are Labour voters.

Afghanistan? Iran? China?

I take it, if you feel all cultures are equal, that there is no justification for seeking asylum?

Ok @TempestTost the poster I was replying to @JoodyBlueToo tagged me upthread and said I had not answered her question on the racism and sexism.

I find it odd that the mat pay issue is what she chose to discuss. She also said women had more babies when we didn't have mat pay, which is correct, but also a flagrantly stupid thing to say.

Attacks on her are mostly racist.

She's never said anything I've heard that I disagree with.

Re:mat pay why should other people pay so that baby daddies dont pay towards the joint costs of having a child?

Yes she meant China because Chinese culture is a hot topic in the UK. Appealing to people who don't like Chinese culture will draw back Reform voters, who are renowned for being anti Chinese.

Oh yes, that's what mat pay was designed for. To cut those baby daddies a break 😂😂😂😂

Perhaps she thought it was something a lot of people could relate to? I have a small business, I can think of a ton of stupid regultions that are detrimental, but most people wouldn't know much about them.

However, maybe it was just not the best choice she could have made to discuss over-regulation.

I took her point about people having more kids to be that why people don't have kids can't be reduced to maternity benefits.

Without getting bogged down about if Badenoch is or is not racist etc. I said to a friend on 5/7 that if the conservatives went "right" after Sunak resigned, they'd learned the wrong lesson.

The majority of seats and votes went, I think, to what I broadly think of as the progressive parties. labour, LibDem and Green. Not to the right, Conservative and Reform.

So by going for either of the last remaining two, theyve shown they've learned the wrong g lesson.

I actually think it may, in the longer run, work out for Cleverly. Whichever of those other two win on 31/10, they are unlikely to stay in that position until 2029. If he plays his cards right, he may still be in the mix.

Full disclosure, I'm a member of the Labour Party, but I do believe that democracy demands a functioning opposition. I'm quite happy for either of the last two to be at the despatch box, when thinking about my party. But democracy demands the best the opposition can provide. That person, in my view, was Jimmy Dimmly.

You're right that it was definitely the wrong issue to highlight when it comes to over-regulation. And perhaps she did mean that there was little correlation between mat pay and birthrates.

But both of those headline points make her seem insincere when it comes to women's issues and rights. It makes it seem like she only has a GC stance because it's a vote winner with conservatives, not because she cares about the myriad of inequities that most women face.

So how's that aging for you now?

@ThisOpalRobin apologies. What I was commenting on really was I felt you picked out my mentioning her articulacy. I could have been been clearer.
That comment really was to me conversational. She is articulate. And as you pointed out "so what!".

The spirit of that post really was asking generally to the chat why anyone would call her racist and asking for examples. It isn't the first time I've heard that so I was asking for examples as I can't think of any.

I didn't mean to focus on you particularly. Although I can see how that could have come across.