Oh no Rosie

[InandOutlander]

I'm so sad to see her go, she was the shining light within the Labour camp.

I mean we're in the position where (a) the government is doing lots of things that clearly weren't in the manifesto and at least don't sit comfortably with the party's professed values, and (b) half the cabinet have been accepting lavish freebies from Waheed Alli, and (c) the party seems to have outsourced its candidate selection to some bloke seconded from Waheed Alli's office who could be trusted to produce lots of MPs with flexible spines. None of this was known before the election.

Yet we've got a very long thread here with people absolutely determined to prove that if there's one bad actor here it's Rosie Duffield.

Oh, and because the manifesto didn't explicitly promise not to cut WFA, it's our own fault for not reading between the lines and realising they were going to do it, lol. That's proof of our stupidity, not Rachel Reeves pulling a fast one on the electorate.

If they're going to pull this Marie Antoinette shit, the very least they could do is get Lord Alli to buy David Lammy an atlas.

Quite. You have to laugh though.

Is this the world's worst pantomime?
She should resign.
Oh no she shouldn't.
Oh yes she should.
Oh no she shouldn't.

Ad nauseam.

🤣

Completely off topic, but I alway marvel at the depth of a five letter word.

Quite, is underrated.

Wasted of money, he still wouldn't be able to find his arse.

How are MPs supposed to hold governments to account if they have to give up their seats if they leave the governing party?

By speaking up in parliament and voting against the government when they disagree with a Bill.

Rosie's previous options (whilst) a Labour MP was to a) stay quiet and vote with something she disagrees with b) speak up and vote against - at this point Labour would have removed the whip, so they would have made the decision that she was an independent or c) speak up and abstain - to scenario b.

She's simply taken her destiny in to her own hands and can now hold the government to account with both words and parliamentary votes.

By speaking up in parliament and voting against the government when they disagree with a Bill.

But then the whip is withdrawn and we are back where we are now, minus the scathing resignation letter.

In 2010 an MP raised the issue of forcing a by-election in parliament. It was dismissed because it would require huge constitutional change and remove the independence of MPs.

Duffield accepted £12k in election funding, took hotels and flights to the USA and Taiwan, valued at over £20k.

She isn't in Govt or had a role in the then shadow cabinet, so why is it all ok for her to take donations and foreign travel gifts but Starmer is greedy and grasping?

Yes its "come to light" in order to sink the new Govt, wreck confidence in the UK and bring about economic failure - how patriotic of the Tory media and many others.

So @noblegiraffe in your opinion what's the cutoff amount of time that has to pass after the election before which it's morally reprehensible and after which it's fine? What's the Duffield Line?

Maybe it's a sliding scale depending on how far across the floor is crossed? Labour / Green? Meh, always ok. Maybe a symbolic Duffield Line on the literal evening after the results? Conservative / Labour? Pretty big gap, got to expect a good two years minimum before it's reasonable for an MP's discomfort with their party's direction of travel to be genuine. Independent somewhere between the two?

Is whether your party is currently in government is a factor? Is it worse to support them in opposition as at least better than the government but find compromises that were ok in theory unacceptable when they can be turned into actions, or is it worse to give up your former conviction for sniff at power?

Or maybe the Duffield Line depends on the specific cause of the disagreement? Gender critical principles? Suck it up sweetheart. Concerns about Transphobia? Run immediately and set the place on fire as you leave!

Duffield accepted £12k in election funding, took hotels and flights to the USA and Taiwan, valued at over £20k.

Can you provide some links?

Its all on the register of members interests, all declared, as were starmers but only his were greedy.

duffield also knew about MPs taking personal gifts for years prior to the GE, yet said nothing.

That's exactly my point...

⬆️😂

The Duffield Line is valid. Only bigots disagree.

When was the last time someone resigned the whip and also as an MP , causing a by election? I can't recall such a thing but it must have happened I suppose.

David Davis resigned his seat but remained a Tory iirc. They were in opposition then. A protest about ID cards or summat.

Chris Skidmore resigned and triggered a by-election in January over protest at the government’s abandoning of net-zero pledges. Caused chaos at the time because his seat was being disbanded at the general election so they had to fight a by-election for a seat that wouldn’t even exist a few months later. https://x.com/cskidmoreuk/status/1744384149962584557?s=46&t=vKGM6xpoeW3wdlaVVVagQA

@FlirtsWithRhinos an interesting question which deserves a thoughtful response but before I bother typing one, am I actually allowed to respond or will I merely be heckled for ‘dominating the thread’ or ‘being a Tory/Labour/TRA bot’?

So getting election funding is just like getting a gift of £16,000 of personal clothing. Right…..

I see the Guardian put the boot in this morning:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/oct/01/opinion-rosie-duffield-divided-canterbury-constituency-labour

Apparently she's against rights, dignity, and humanity for trans people and will be joining Reform any minute now....

Of course. It would be great to get a considered proposal that goes beyond one politician in a specific scenario.

I can't promise I won't challenge it but I can promise I'll base any reply on what you actually say not just make accustions of bad faith. Full disclosure: that might possibly include seeing what you post on other threads if I want to get a fuller idea of where you are coming from/how consistently you apply your principles. If a poster is claiming a matter of principle but it seems like some people are held to higher standards than others it suggests a bad faith or unconscious bias and I think it's ok to call that out. I don't trawl posting history to make personal digs though.

To be clear, I'm not trying to set any rules for you or how you should post! You do as you wish. And I can't say what others might post to you. But having made a commitment to you that i will engage in good faith I want to be clear about what that looks like for me so you don't feel I mislead you.

@FlirtsWithRhinos I second the Duffield Line!! 🤣.

Labour could put, say, a few million into a consultation just to be sure where it is placed is based on empirical evidence, rather than feelz, though. Am sure Lord Alli will stump up a donation in support.