"Men's clothes"

[FannyCann]

This was posted on X

x.com/hazelappleyard_/status/1828749446030733652?s=46

I'm just shocked how many posters are referring to the image on the left as "men's clothes".
It's how I dress most of the time. These are clothes that surely most women will have in their wardrobe at least for casual wear, maybe a more fashionable/tidier version but similar.
They are everyday clothes, commonly worn, by both sexes so I suppose if one had to assign a sex to the clothes it would be gender neutral (which isn't a sex obviously, I know, don't bother correcting me).

FFS are we truly going back in time - to when? The 1950's? The 1850's?

Forget the bloke in a skirt - I don't care, but the implication that everyday casual wear is "men's" has made me fume.

Rant over.

Yes, that figure is a man LARPING not merely as female, but as a little girl.

There's a word for those men, what is it again, starts with p ...

But they’re unlikely to be ‘men’s clothes’ if the wearer is a woman because they wouldn’t fit. We’re different shapes. They mean practical clothes worn by both sexes.

I suppose the ultimate practical clothing is leggings, jersey tops and trainers. Maybe track pants. Why don’t men wear leggings more? 🤔

Do women ever choose to wear impractical clothes that are traditionally male gendered?

I never understand the concept of women'c clothes and men's clothes.

Men have worn garments cut like skirts and dresses throughout history (the Romans, the Scottish Kilt) and it is still the case in countries like Fiji, Greece...

Women have worn trousers in the UK since 1851.

As far as I am concerned people can wear whatever they like and that is never going to change their biological sex.

I buy mens shorts (Jersey ones, not fitted) as they tend to be longer and have bigger pockets. So practical.

Interesting. Are we no longer allowed to swear?

Many women including me like wearing dresses much of the time because we prefer the feel of the lighter fabrics and the colours. Please don't start campaigning against us. We enjoy it.
Many women will say - I wish my man would wear something other than dark blue or grey. Having clothes that fitted his body properly would be a bonus.

They tend to be sewn on by hand by small children too. Avoid.

I’m getting weird fetish vibes from the pic on the right…

Most younger women (in my fairly provincial city) the other day seemed to be wearing either those loose grey tracksuit style bottoms with a vest or crop top or looked like they’d come straight from the gym.

Either look wouldn’t work well on a typical male body, (as ‘Isla’ Bryson demonstrated so memorably), which I guess is why so many TWs seem to opt for an OTT interpretation of one of Laura Ashley’s off days that 99% of women wouldn’t be seen dead in.

I think there’s an important point here: I buy women’s clothes because they’re more likely to fit my build. But I’m often envious of the colours and styles that men can buy. Women’s clothes are often in stereotypical feminine colours, which I don’t want, and aren’t so practical. Even outdoor clothes and walking gear have this problem

It's another instance of TRAs false-teaming women's rights with the Conservative religious right who are totally opposed to women's right.

A man in a dress is not wearing women's clothes. He is wearing his own clothes. Izzard said this many years ago. There is no such thing as men's and women's clothes and the clothes you wear has no effect on what sex you are.

The Conservative religious right have just as much of a problem with women failing to perform femininity correctly as they do with men failing to perform masculinity correctly.

Therefore most people would either have no problem with the outfits of either side of the picture, or if sexist and stuck in the 50s they might have a problem with both. But this has no implications for people being prepared to lie about which sex someone is.

There's other similar idiot-memes with lots of pictures of the brilliant and talented rock stars of the 80s who smashed gender norms as if it's sonehow weird that we loved them and yet won't accept that a bloke is really an actual woman now. Smashing gender norms means that no one has to be constrained by the sexist rules any more. Insisting that there exists a way to "feel" male or female independent of the physical reality of ones body is intrinsically sexist.

Of course there are men’s clothes and women’s clothes:

Men’s clothes = clothes cut to fit men.
Women’s clothes = clothes cut to fit women

Men and women have different body shapes so need clothes cut differently. Sometimes, especially for casual fit clothes, you can fit clothes cut for the opposite sex. And sometimes clothes are poorly cut. Unfortunately for women, clothes cut for women often seem to be made with thinner cheaper fabrics and less practical styles so we may choose to compromise cut for practicality.

Men wear women’s clothes specifically because they are women’s clothes not because of the style or fabric. If sparkly dresses and tiara was mainstream fashion for men they wouldn’t be interested in them.

mankini anyone?😂

You really see this on the Great British Sewing Bee made-to measure challenges. So much skill in dressmaking for curves.

I think there are sequinned fabrics that are machine made but yes, complex sequin patterns are likely to be hand sewn and children in developing countries are cheaper than couturiers in Paris.

However, if adult women in developing countries can earn a living wage in that country as self employed seamstresses and tailors, that independence can be supported by micro loans. The factories, poorly built and without H&S as we know it, are an issue. There are such places in the UK too.

Many women and children pay a massive price for cheap disposable fashion.

Brain, bleach, anyone?😂

I once asked a tailor why women's clothes were more expensive than men's equivalents, and he told me that a woman's tailored jacket had nearly twice as many separate pieces as a man's.

I've noticed that there's a trend for men's clothes to be more fitted over the waist and hips, and as they tend to have none of the latter, I have a couple of lovely shirts that fit perfectly down to the third-from-last button😡
It's OK, no need to send me thoughts, prayers and - I have coping strategies - I wear them open over t-shirts.

I'm a woman who prefers skirts and dresses for comfort. My everyday outfits are probably more stereotypically feminine than most women here, I'd guess.

I still have a hoodie or two and comfy jogging bottoms in my wardrobe. I don't consider them men's clothes! Women have been wearing trousers for many decades now without it it being remarkable in the slightest. Advertisers don't help though, with labels like 'boyfriend jeans' or 'boy shorts' for garments cut for and marketed to women. As if clothing being skimpy and tight is inherently female and anything else is 'boyish'. (But not 'manly' I note. The discourse analysis on that could be interesting.)

I don't have white knee socks and sparkle-covered outfits, and haven't since I was literally a little girl. That's what makes the picture on the right creepy. I don't care if a man wants to wear a skirt. I do care when the motive for it is obviously fetishistic.

Leggings? Yeuch (on men and on women). There used to be some very practical but over-revealing "leggings" for outdoor pursuits use called Ron Hills. Men looked absolutely dreadful in them, but somehow they were fashionable in some circles. Revolting lightweight nylon things that never wore out and were quick to wash and dry.

Re leggings...

Men wear them under shorts for sports. They call them "skins".

I'm 61 and the left one is how I dress most of the time. I also wear slogan/ band t shirts etc. it's casual clothing.

I have no issue with anyone wearing anything tbf. My DGD wears football kit most of the time. Had never worn dresses etc. her body, her choice.

With my trans identified son, the one thing that really gets to me is that he is wearing clothes designed for a woman's body shape, so he then has to fill out the bust, which means wearing a bra to hold the falsies. If he could wear a dress actually designed for a man, it would be less jarring; and I suspect it would be less likely to feed the dysphoria that he now appears to experience. My fear is that he will feel more and more pressure to conform to "womanly" appearances, and that this will lead to oestrogen and possibly to surgery, all because he has never fitted comfortably into societal expectations. This is speculation on my part, because he has not been able to articulate what it is that has led him onto this path, but it is quite clear that there are now strong expectations for him to conform to a trans stereotype when he spent much of his life managing not to conform to social pressures. All of a sudden, he seems to have left his individuality behind along with some of his critical thinking, as he gets more and more embedded in a cult-like mindset.

@FearOfTheDucks I don't care if a man wants to wear a skirt. I do care when the motive for it is obviously fetishistic.

agree.
I remember during my first year of secondary school some classmates talking about buying 'bondage' trousers during the latter days of punk. It all seemed a bit daring and harmless to us then, what did we know about bondage? It was a childs' eye view of an adult fetish.

Now I know how childish naivety and curiosity gets exploited and the damage it can do I take a much more world weary view.

Perhaps your son could learn to make or alter their own clothes, many great designers started that way.

gendered clothing is interesting (although obvs the picture in the tweet is simplistic and not the gotcha it thinks it is).

my sons would probably like some of the gendered aspects of women's clothing. they hate rough or heavy fabrics which men's clothes seem to run towards, so buying clothes that are soft enough so they'll actually wear them can be a challenge. it would be a lot easier if i could kit them out in soft cotton skirts for the summer, but I've got no interest in making their lives harder by dressing them in ways that are likely to attract ridicule from their peers.

I do think a lot of men would be happier if the gendered rules around men's clothing were loosened in the way women's have been.

'@KielderWater · Today 10:53
Of course there are men’s clothes and women’s clothes:
Men’s clothes = clothes cut to fit men.
Women’s clothes = clothes cut to fit women'

Again, I am going to disagree. I have on occasion bought joggers, tee shirts, caps, sweaters, trousers and shirts from the men's sections of several stores and charity shops.

I just get a small or medium size. I don't have a 'boyish' body shape but the clothes fit me fine.