Outrage over 'LGBT' books being banned by schools?

[Hairyesterdaygonetoday]

Has anyone seen this story in The Independent? I can't access the story because it's behind a paywall.

I'd like to know if these are books showing gay people living normal lives, which I'd have thought were quite widely read these days. Or if they're nonsense about people being 'born in the wrong body'. Once again it's obscured by the forced teaming of LGB, which are normal human sexualities, with transgenderism, which is totally different.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/lgbt-books-ban-uk-schools-library-b2596374.html?lid=3zhtz7kgzghk

Thanks if anyone can enlighten me!

This is so important. There are parents in some schools determined that their children should not learn about same sex families, that basic biology should not be taught to young children and more. That's why it's unforgivable that adults without boundaries, adults wanting to share their kinks, fetishes and sexual desires with children have been able to do so via SRE in some schools.
It makes it so difficult to argue about the rights of children to access factual, age appropriate SRE that reflects the world they live in when so many dodgy, porn soaked materials are being presented as suitable for even the youngest of children.

I find children's publishing is just full of this stuff now. It's like there are no real substantial, stories, just this awful pious stuff, it's completely unsophisticated and bland.

Give me some Maurice Sendak any day.

Totally agree. They are just really bad books, children deserve better.

Agree there are far too many preachy “message” children’s books with paper thin character and storylines. The emotional literacy ones are the worst IME. I have no issue with the messages, but the books themselves are just bad, boring stories. No child wants to be lectured at bed time. They can all tell it’s an “improving” book and it turns them off.

The best LGBT children’s stories are Frog and Toad. Love those books. Totally appropriate for children, brilliantly written, read again and again in our house.

My thought entirely. Just teach them to read.

I heard from my local council librarian that 70% of books are chosen by the book seller not the librarian themselves. Wondering what that agreement is? (On funny note they got a whack of books on goat herding some years ago 🤣)

What are the boundaries for primary age books? Secondary books? (And I think there should be some filter- we have age ratings for films)

That school with the Drag performer head teacher had a book promoting bestiality. I mean wtaf. 😱

And we have seen pornographic content make it into RSE under mantle of LGBT+ because opposing it 'is homophobic'. (Not to mention wrong body shite)

Understandably some parents are probably being reactive because they are concerned about stuff slipping in. Which is fair enough because there IS questionable and age-inappropriate material.

I would also like to say as a long time lover of books that it pains me how shite these social justice books are- in writing and design. (On the main) The libraries should be striving for excellence

@HelenScot I retired from library work a few years back, but yes, at that point most of the book ordering was done by the bookseller, who would be using an algorithm to determine what was likely to go off the shelves . If you take a look at the teen/YA section in your local library it will be dominated by romance/ supernatural/ dystopia because that is what a lot of teens read and libraries want to get them through the door. I agree there is a lot of tedious preachy stuff around, both for teens and younger children.

I haven't come across these (I think) but I am guessing neither Frog nor Toad are trans.

Nope, it’s about a male frog and male toad who have a very close friendship, but I thought the discussion was about the removal of LGBT books, not trans books specifically? The ABC of Pride isn’t specifically a trans book either.

(I have seen it in bookshops and actually assumed it was a jokey stockingfiller aimed at adult gay men, rather than a serious attempt to teach four year olds the alphabet - Waterstones certainly didn’t put it in the children’s section).

Dorling Kindersley (publishers) state that it's aimed at young readers aged 3 plus to introduce them to Pride 🙄

I don’t doubt it, I just disagree with them!

Honestly wasn't impressed to see ds and his reception class being taught this book!

Understandably some parents are probably being reactive because they are concerned about stuff slipping in. Which is fair enough because there IS questionable and age-inappropriate material.

Ithink this is actually a big deal. Once you are at a point where you no longer trust the school to choose appropriately, you don't want to give them any leeway.

I'd rather my kids school not choose anything about any social justice issues tbh. I don't think they have shown they have a lot of capacity to even understand the issues. Better not to touch on them, IMO.

That seems very reactionary, but in the end, I am not convinced it is the role of the school to decide what moral and ethical issues kids need to be indoctrinated about. They are not better set up to do this than anyone else, they don't even seem to understand child development!

It doesn’t seem at all reactionary, @TempestTost - it’s just about common sense and about what is appropriate for school age children, whether they’re four or 17.

Agreed, just teach them to read.

A few generations ago now, but daily I thank my DM who made damn sure I could read before I went to school.

Grandad is wearing fetish gear, in the attractive colourful illustration I saw. All part of encouraging children to see sex fetishes as harmless dressing up.

Most of the examples quoted could be used to groom or normalise activities that should raise safeguarding alerts. These must not become the norm. Wait until older and sexual knowledge becomes established in pupils.
Ps. I am Bi and have teen children.

Grandad is wearing fetish gear

I am sure that is a line from an old folk song.

Grandad is wearing fetish gear
Grandmas only got here
They hit the sticks
double quick
And the assembled crowd they cheer

I think it's on Steeleye Spans 3rd album: "Now we are sex".

Most schools do actually teach most children to read pretty effectively. But that’s just the necessary first step. They then have to encourage them to enjoy reading. To do this you have to have a wide range
of attractive , interesting, age appropriate books which will engage them. It’s vanishingly rare for primary schools to have a dedicated librarian now, so you have to hope there’s someone there who knows about books and takes an interest in what’s out there. There are actually lots of picture books featuring diverse families which don’t have granddads in fetish gear.

Why do 3 year olds need introducing to Pride?

It's not at all reactionary to object to social justice stuff being pushed at kids. The reactionary (and racist, misogynist and homophobic) lot are the social justice warriors.

There are also some illustrations which could be read as encouraging the normality of paedophilia e.g. a MAP (Minor Attracted Person), and various other bits and pieces apparently to do with pirates.

Many years ago my DS (then 12 and allowed to choose own library books) brought home a book about the Afghan war - he suddenly said that horrible things were being done to women. ex-DH had a look and found that a very adult book with graphic descriptions of death and rape had been put in the junior section, why, who knows. I complained to the librarian who apologised, but it left me feeling I had to check what DS was borrowing after that.