Outrage over 'LGBT' books being banned by schools?

[Hairyesterdaygonetoday]

Has anyone seen this story in The Independent? I can't access the story because it's behind a paywall.

I'd like to know if these are books showing gay people living normal lives, which I'd have thought were quite widely read these days. Or if they're nonsense about people being 'born in the wrong body'. Once again it's obscured by the forced teaming of LGB, which are normal human sexualities, with transgenderism, which is totally different.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/lgbt-books-ban-uk-schools-library-b2596374.html?lid=3zhtz7kgzghk

Thanks if anyone can enlighten me!

This has been a serious issue in Ireland - though it's gone a bit quiet now, anti-immigration 'activities' seem to have floated to the top of the agenda. Groups of people forcing their way into libraries to remove questionable books from the children's section.
This was widely characterised as retrogressive, bigoted, rightwing action, and that's probably true, but it means that any valid points about the content of the books in question are buried under condemnation of intimidation of library staff, book-burning mentality etc.

The problem is the T in LGBT. Given that the marriage equality referendum in 2015 was carried with 62% voting in favour, it would be hard to argue that the Great Irish Public suddenly decided that LGB people were a threat to children and libraries should be invaded to remove the threat.

But drag storytelling in children's libraries, age-inappropriate books with trans or fetish themes and illustrations - which many LGB parents wouldn't be happy with, let alone the wider public - have been lumped in with age-appropriate children's books that show families with same-sex parents etc, which have probably been on the shelves for years, with no objections.

So yet again the T in LBGT is causing problems. Different issues, different people, different demands, different books, but protesters like the book-snatchers are unable or unwilling to make the distinction between LGB and T - encouraged, of course, by the mainstreaming of trans ideology.
This is more proof of how the trans movement is threatening the hard-won advances achieved by decades of campaigning by lesbians and gay men, in Ireland and elsewhere.

https://www.indexoncensorship.org/2024/08/banned-school-librarians-shushed-over-lgbt-books/

It's based on this article, which I haven't read yet.

The ABC book on Pride has no place in a primary school and I’d be having a chat with any teacher who gave this to my small children to be brainwashed look at to ask them why they thought this was appropriate.

Whatever happened to A is for apple etc?

Yes I read that. A lot of it appears to be fantasy projection.

Dawson claims to be a straight woman in a heterosexual relationship with a straight man. Whilst writing for, and about, teenage girls.

Watch out Index article mentions Mumsnet

On online forums, book-banning sentiment is inseparable from the culture wars around sex and gender. In one Mumsnet thread, a user seeks guidance in drafting a complaint about the book She’s My Dad due to the links with gender identity, later adding: “I’m really looking for experiences and complaints about this book/author, and how to write to ask for it to be removed/immediately stopped being used until a parent consultation has gone ahead.”
There are dozens of replies. Some offer advice, others cry “inappropriate content”, and others argue that teaching the book is a political move.

I don’t know the first book, but it sounds harmless. The second I have seen in Waterstones in the children’s picture book section. Appalling.

I’m wondering whether any of the folks complaining about censorship were ok with the removal of copies of Harry Potter from school libraries?

Safe Schools Alliance and Transgender Trend are also mentioned. Presumably they haven't been asked to comment.

The Safe Schools Alliance UK (SSA), a group which describes itself as “a grassroots organisation which campaigns to uphold child safeguarding in schools”, ran a review of Juno Dawson’s young adult novel Wonderland, beginning: “We had our ex-English teacher reviewer read it so that you – and your kids – do not have to.”
The review was less than favourable. Out-of-context scenes are plucked from the book, peppered with dismissal of protagonist Alice’s gender identity and accusations of “male sex fantasy tropes” and the “reckless statements Dawson plants in Alice’s mouth”.
Another group, Transgender Trend, which uses the strapline “No child is born in the wrong body”, has published a lengthy essay on “trans picture books for little children” and describes some of them as “militantly activist”.

isn't Grandads Pride, the book with a bunch of paedophile coded stuff in the illustrations??

As an ex library worker I’m instinctively not in favour of banning or censoring books, but it is important to have some idea of whether the books in your classroom/ library are age appropriate. For example we were approached more than once by Yr 3/4 teachers wanting to use The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas with their class because the child in the book is the same age as this pupils and they thought it was a good way to introduce this topic to them. Which it absolutely isn’t. Similarly with sexual content. Someone has to make the effort to find out if it’s right for the age of the child reading it. Once they get to 13+ I wouldn’t stop them reading almost any book tbh. I’m not a particular fan of Juno D, but JD’s books are popular with teens and I think they are more likely to be swayed into pro trans views online or by peer group pressure than by reading JD.

I work part time in a secondary school library, there is a full time professional school librarian in charge. We have a tricky time navigating YA fiction. Part of the issue is that publishers and reviewers don't always consider the age appropriate bit of YA. Books that are fine for teens over the age of consent are sometimes wildly inappropriate for children aged 11 and 12. Mostly it's the graphic sex between the young characters of all types.
I am always surprised about the sort of books primary schools use and stock but I think I'm old fashioned or as my students often remind me just old.
People do tend to think of censorship as a big deal, a sort of public ban, but really it's self censorship that's the issue. There are parents of students even at my inner city school who object to Harry Potter, I can imagine some schools just quietly removing or hiding books to try to placate this sort of thing.
This sort of "debate" is pretty funny though as most adults have no idea of what is in popular fiction for school children. The Hunger Games for example is about children being killed live on TV for entertainment, in some graphic detail. Handmaid's Tale is in our school library as are a range of classics crammed with violence.
I read a lot of books to make sure we dont shelve books which are inappropriate, I have noticed that a lot of books with trans themes are boring and repetitive. There is a story arc which suggests that once surgery or transition by other means is done the only problem is mean people. This doesn't make for a gripping story usually. We put them out and let the kids decide.
Trans books are a small subsection of books. Although I do need to ask the kids about manga which is the most popular genre I have no idea if there are trans characters in those books as I don't read them.

Nothing by Juno Dawson should be anywhere near a school, or young people. Seriously dodgy themes and storylines including non consensual sex, drugs, etc.

Thanks, MumBoss, but the site seems to be down at present. I’ve tried it several times. Will try again tomorrow.

Isn't it interesting - and very telling - that not one of the librarians interviewed mentioned "age appropriate" or "safeguarding ". Because that's at the root of all this for most people. It's not different families, same sex relationships etc. It's the age inappropriate descriptions of sex, sexual acts, porn, kink and fetish that so many of these books include (see my post at 11.30 above). Add to that the social grooming of even the youngest of children that their bodies can be flawed but fixed with a sex change - again, adult concepts that young children can't possibly understand.

You'd think school librarians would be involved in discussions teasing out how all this works, where are the boundaries? It's ironical that it's just culture war stuff about censorship that they speak about - the needs, rights and safety of the group they are supposed to be focused on means nothing to them. They're bothered about their own feelings and the feelings of authors who are criticised - yet children don't feature in their discourse. What a disappointment they are.

They've solved these issues in Scotland by just not having school libraries, or any books, at all. 😔

It does seem madness that books don't come with age ratings the same way that films do. (Completely separate the the "reading age" which is ability based). Aged 7, my DD bought home a book about child abuse... she wasn't ready for that sort of thing. Only book I've ever had to confiscate.

Yes kids need to know about different families. But in an age appropriate way!

I know Florida is having a very controversial time with books currently. I don't want the UK going the same way with bans etc.

I'm disappointed with Index on Censorship all round. There is obviously a fuzzy line between selection and Censorship. I bet no one would object to a story for teenagers that glamorised the Ku Klux Klan not being stocked.

School libraries are by definition a curated selection and age appropriate material is essential. If a selection policy says no LGB material that's Censorship but it still leaves the necessity to select by criteria which books to stock.

I just coincidentally read this:

'The website endeavours to be accessible to people from deprived areas and is written for a reading age of 9-11, which is the average reading age in Scotland.'

Holy fuckballs. Given that school libraries are apparently keen on providing graphic novels with the emphasis on 'graphic', and Scotland is keen on banning libraries all together, and our collective literacy and educational attainment is so shocking, we need to rethink the whole bloody system.

(Context not directly relevant but possible tangentially)

transpolicy.substack.com/p/complaint-to-govscot-regarding-page

As an aside I've just noticed Transgender Trend is flagged an anti trans organisation on Wikipedia. Don't know if anyone can alter it.

Most state primary schools don't have a librarian, they have a teacher trying to add donated books from parents to stock whilst also teaching their own class. If they're really lucky they'll have gardening club or the school choir as well.

Often primary school libraries find it easier to just withdraw items parents complain about than have proper library protocol - collection development policies, back up by the head etc.

@WeMeetInFairIthilien That book is one of several Cots have raised concerns about. Mums remain mums, and dads remain dads, protected in law and reality for the wellbeing of their children, whatever the trans fantasies and attempts at coercion and gaslighting of the parent.
https://childrenoftransitioners.org/2023/04/10/paperwork/
-perhaps you could point out to the school that children of transitioners have human rights too, and should be safeguarded from harm like other children.
childrenoftransitioners.org/2021/09/25/not-shutting-up/

Agreed.
...which introduces young readers to the ALPHABET, while they learn about the LBQT+ community is an abomination. Leave the bloody toddlers alone.

Thanks for that @Chariothorses

As DD moves into the year, I'll be keeping a very close eye on what she's being taught.

It'll be interesting to see just how much the school doubles down "our students need to know about every type of family" and "we don't teach any side (GI or GC) as fact"

Err, I think I'd be finding another school!

This isn’t is about censorship at all; it’s about presenting children with books appropriate for their age / stage of development. I don’t think anyone would argue that not stocking “50 Shades of Grey” or similar in a school library is about censoring or banning books.

“Grandad’s Pride” - yes, I saw this in Waterstones recently. As if children need to know about grandad’s sex life, whichever way he swings…🤮

100% agree. Let them figure it out on their own.