Imane Khelif

[LHayday]

Just reading the thread on here for the first time. What I fail to understand is why so many contributors are so desperate for her to be a man. Someone who has lived their entire life as a woman. Beggars belief.

Bless you.

HE.

🤣🤣

Nope.

You lot are horrible bullies and should be ashamed of yourselves. I am truly disgusted

Why would anyone want a man to box in the female category? That's nuts!

Oh yeah, the IOC that's who. Because "inclusion".

I know you don't want to hear this but:

• IK has a DSD. Almost certainly 5ARD (same as Caster Semanya)
• People with this DSD can be mistaken for female at birth because their penis doesn't grow properly.
• At puberty, they masculinise because of the testosterone supplied in normal male amounts from their testicles
• At this point their genitals also virilise. Their balls may drop and they may get a couple of inches penis growth. There's a range of development but it will be a noticeable change.
• Most of these young men identify as men and live the rest of their lives as men.

So yeah, there is reasonable doubt to be cast on many of the narratives around these particular DSD stories, but honestly? If IK stayed out of women's contact sports then the rest of the way they live their life is their business alone.

Yes how do you live as a woman?

I'm a bit concerned I might have been doing it wrong all these years...

Yes. Almost as if a clever lawyer has written the statement 😉

You do understand that there are conditions called DSDs, don't you? And that many are found exclusively in males, but that some give the appearance of female genitalia? The person remains male, despite that.

Why does ‘living their entire life as a woman’ make someone female when they are male?

And you have made a great assumption that they ‘lived their entire life as a woman’. They have definitely known since 2023 when they had their 2nd test with the IBA and it seems the third test in Paris, that they were not female.

Do you also think that they were unaware previously? That they were just a 17 year old girl playing football with the boys when the boxing coach said ‘you’d be great boxing, why not come and try it’?

If they didn’t start menstruating, do you think that any parent would have not taken their child to get checked. If they started to have a testosterone puberty, would that have been noticed?

I think your ‘always lived as a girl’ is doing some very major heavy lifting.

By the way, do you use the same argument for Lin from Taiwan?

I mean this is very simplistic.

A lot of young people in the world unfortunately are not knowledgeable about how puberty usually manifests.

And a lot of girls may not get periods for one reason or another, consistent very low body weight, involvement in sport to an excessive degree etc.

And as for being carried on a man's shoulders, you can not generalise about cultural experiences. Women who are extremely rich are often treated differently and more like men in some cultures. Women who have different shades of skin from the norm are often treated differently and more like men. Women who are tourists or who are famous are often treated differently from most other women. Women in family or close friend situations might experience more familiar interactions and physical proximity than they would do with complete strangers.

There is no singular experience as a woman in any given culture.

Stop bullying women boxers who don’t want to fight men boxers. You horrible bully.

I’m disgusted by your gaslighting and misogyny quite frankly.

This was IOC sanctioned male violence against women for the whole world to see. Not only did they accept blatant cheating, they awarded a gold medal and made sure any actual female boxers with an eye for sporting glory were roundly assured that male egos will always be prioritised and the potential to sustain life threatening punches will be ever present in their sport.

Legally female, yes, if recorded female at birth. Biologically male though, as the boxer’s own trainer seems to have confirmed. A female fighter can’t have a chromosome problem AND a testosterone problem unless ‘she’ is a biological male with a disorder of sex development that led ‘her’ to be incorrectly assigned female at birth.

As I’ve said before, the focus should be on the IOC and not individual boxers. Khelif was playing by the IOC’s ridiculous rules that allow anyone with female paperwork to punch women in the head.

We need to ensure safety and fairness for women. Every athlete should complete a sex test to ensure they are competing in the correct category. Legal females with biological male advantage should not compete with women. It’s that simple.

What, in your view, is the reason for male and female categories in sport?

You can only live as a woman if you are, in fact, a woman.

Well Khelif is in a difficult position, living as they do in a country which has very negative views on anyone who doesn’t fall into a neat little box, and I can see that Khelif is probably desperate to be able to live a life which offers them a precarious place in society, unfortunately for Khelif they have now been denied that opportunity by people who have known full well for a good few years ( I believe Khelif is in their mid to late twenties) that Khelif is not a woman, and never has been, despite having a female passport, based on a female birth certificate.

At the moment Khelif is being feted nationally as a gold medal Olympic champion - though in pictures I have seen the faces of the men people around are grim to say the least - but when that dies down they will be faced with the reality that for most people in their immediate and wider society they are an uncomfortable anomaly, who doesn’t fit into the expectations of what a woman is and should be and will be treated as such. And I doubt that admitting the truth and living as a man will make any difference, and might make things worse.

I hope the gold medal gives them some comfort because I don’t think the rest of their life is going to be a bed of roses. The lies and deception will have wider implications than hoodwinking the IOC for the sake of a medal.

I do sometimes wonder whether the "you're horrible bullies" lot would EVER object to a man boxing a woman.

Is it that this case is somehow not clear-cut enough, so they are seizing onto a sliver of doubt that lets them retain their shred of "my tribe good" belief?

Is it actually possible for them to ever object to a man boxing a woman, or would they always find some way to justify it - "my side is supporting it, so there must be a reason for it"....

She can live how she wants, refer to herself, identify as a woman. No problem with that. But the facts remain, if a person has a penis, that person is MALE!!

He’s a cheating man. And he will seriously injure, if not kill, a woman if he is allowed to continue to enter the female category. Watching him fight biological females is sickening.

For recognizing that a person who has clear cues of male puberty should not be competing in the female category of sports?

ok. Be disgusted. It is water off a duck’s back by now. If you wish to prioritise male people above female people, you do you. Others will think differently. Many others have been there and done that when Semenya and learned from the experience.

What you don’t get to do, nor does @LHayday , is to shame others who choose not to follow your own personal choices for language.

He won't be on mumsnet love. He will be fine.

This OP can't be for real, living as a woman is trolling surely.

This person did not start boxing until 17. Those trying to use sport as an explanation for not starting periods don’t seem to understand that this athlete was not doing intense sport before then to explain this delay.