Because this never happens NHS nurses sue over transgender policy that ‘puts them at risk’.

[LakesideInn]

NHS nurses sue over transgender policy that ‘puts them at risk’.

A fully intact male colleague calling himself Rose was allowed to use the open plan female changing rooms in a hospital. He said he was trying to get his girlfriend pregnant, walked around with genitals viable though underwear and when the nurses complained they were told they needed to get educated and compromise.

https://www.thetimes.com/article/9f995274-a6f8-4da9-8f19-401440ceeb08?shareToken=a33bc4bfddc33558475e4821a9fbf30f

Right. So you, personally, did not see women and girl’s reactions. Just your mother who reported no adverse reactions? Did she check with them? Did she see their reactions after she and your father left?

No? She took a superficial role in observing other women who are socialised to not show their true feelings and continued to enable your father to not respect the needs of female people. Your mother prioritised your father over all other female people at least some in those toilet visits. She showed just as much disrespect for female people if she did this willingly.

And is her presence supposed to show that she would have noticed the harm your father’s presence caused?

Sparkly the way you coped with your father's decision is not the way other women want to cope with the decisions of men like him. The medical or psychological guidance given to him at the time was/is sexist; none of those doctors ever thought about the feelings, vulnerabilities, privacy and dignity of women encountering cross-dressed men in women's spaces. I don't care if a man has a doctor's note or a certificate of any kind and I don't care if he's the most perfect simulacrum of what he thinks a woman is; he's not a woman and he should show respect for women by staying away from women's spaces and services.

As usual, women's needs didn't factor in the thinking process of the medical profession.

Thank you for your insightful posts. A couple of things I’m wondering about. Do you believe your father became a woman after the surgery and hormones? Did you feel comfortable undressing in front of your father?

Can we get back to discussing the nurses and not someone else's one sided story?

It's a good example of the inherent problem though isn't it? The centering of the male person and ensuring that their needs, wants and comfort are met with a good old 'sod everyone else'?

I think it also highlights the appeal to authority these male people have used to get into that changing room. A clinician gives them a piece of paper and that person then expects society to comply when that compliance can harm female people. But those female people were never consulted, collectively or individually. Just told to comply.

Apologies, it was late and a small screen.

“Your mother prioritised your father over all other female people at least some in those toilet visits. She showed just as much disrespect for female people if she did this willingly.”

should read

Your mother prioritised your father over all other female people at least during those toilet visits. She showed just as much disrespect for female people as your father did if she did this willingly.

Don't forget that these men were encouraged to do this by the doctors treating them. They were expected to try living full time "as women" (rather than part time crossdressers), which included using women's spaces, before being considered for surgery. Presumably the bit of paper this man was given was an explanation from his doctor that he was doing his "real life test" in preparation for surgery, and women shouldn't complain about him being in their toilets and changing rooms. Women were never consulted about this, of course.

That's all transition is, going through the door if the opposite sex facilities.

Sparkly chose not to transition her language about her father, fair enough, but she has a lot of contempt for the people she's talking to about him for not considering him transitioned in circumstances that matter to them.

The whole farce of "trans" is manipulative hypocrisy.

Yes, it's coercive control at a societal level.

On the one hand, if you're a man (and a smattering of approved women as a fig leaf) your 'lived experience' and 'inner identity' is important.

If you're a woman, you can fuck to the far side of fuck with your lived experience and inner identity of not wanting men in your spaces because it scares / humiliates / excludes you.

My inner identity is someone who has single sex spaces. My pronouns are 'single sex spaces' / 'women's human rights'.

Is anyone bending over backwards to validate me? No, of course not, because I'm a woman.

I'm quite enjoying, in a bitter, shall I laugh or cry, kind of way, the insistence that because no woman screamed, ran away, burst into tears or stormed out on the entry of the poster's father, no distress or difficulty for women (that matters) existed.

How many times has a man tried to insist that no one in the women's facilities knew he was a man because no one said 'that's a man'? And was baffled at the idea that women do not do anything to upset or annoy a bloke they are scared of or uncomfortable at the presence of, they just keep their heads down and get the hell out of there.

Fgs, identity is all about performativity.

Women have actual, real issues. It's only mad, insane and ugly sexism that means unless they have demonstrated to the last decimal place sufficient difficulty and distress and barriers (peer reviewed, signed in triplicate, buried in soft peat and stuffed in the filing cabinet in the disused toilet with the sign beware of the leopard for a decade or three) that men may permit that there is perhaps an issue. In essence: if the woman did not create a problem so that the MAN experienced it as a problem for him, no problem existed.

Women however are exhorted to believe whatever this man happens to want, because he has feelings. And inner beliefs. And they should not only be very very caring about this but revolve their sad little meaningless lives around him and his needs. And not to get angry or shrill about the utter inequality and appalling double standards of this that says they are merely subhuman NPCs in male lives to some really misogynist men.

Any shred of sympathy I had left is gone. Decent men are not this horribly sexist.

Fuck yes @UpThePankhurst seems we either 'just can't tell' or are so in awe of their stunning, beautiful bravery we're jealous, but never ever does anyone identify 'you're male'.

This whole "old fashioned transexual, you just don't understand how hard it was, paid thousands for a dodgy operation in Morocco" narrative ignores the fact that these men laid down the ground work for the current headlock they have the Labour government in.

The world moved on, these men are dragging the baggage of the 1950s along with them. And Labour are trying to sell it back to an audience that can see what they can't even acknowledge.

For the 0.01% of transwomen who pass among us; lucky (and improbably) you. As for the rest of you, you are denying me the most fundamental of my human rights. The right to dignity is the bedrock that all other human rights are built upon.

I want to know at what stage Wes Streeting is going to make good on his pre-election offer to meet with the nurses. And I want to know if he intends to do something more than just meet with them - is he actually prepared to do anything to help them and the other women putting up with the same shit in their hospital changing rooms?!

Just saw this on another thread. Apparently one of the nurses who's part of this suit called into a radio show and mentioned "Rose" had been exposing Rose's genitalia in the women's changing room. FFS.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5116457-brilliant-transwoman-on-channel5-now?page=2&reply=136673365

Oh what a surprise. Were you surprised? I was surprised.

It's never bloody innocent. Never.

I would treat trans people with the same respect that they show women and children, no more and no less.

Since we’re talking about toilets and leopards…

Some years ago, the cast of the original radio adaptation of The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy toured a stage show. At my local theatre, I was annoyed at the long queue in the Ladies - I could see that one of the cubicles was out of action, with a notice on the door that I presumed said that it was out of order. When I got closer, I saw that someone had crossed out the words “Out of Order” and written “Beware of the leopard”.

You could tell who the biggest HGTG fans were, based on who grinned when they got close enough to read the notice. 😀

Is there any more news on this ? And has Wes Streeting met with the nurses? I hope that the Nurses continue with a claim against their employer .

This hospital is determined to abuse and punish the brave nurses I hope someone explains to them that further victimising them is just increasing the payout

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/24/female-nhs-nurses-changing-rooms-trans-row-darlington-five/

It defies belief that people like the HR director is so ignorant of the rights of women not to be forced to undress in front of random men.
And as usual, threats issued against the nurses rather than a man perving on unconsenting women.

So he wants to be a woman who does a male thing and get a woman pregnant. My mind is boggled. He/ she/ they want it all !!!