Reports Roz Adams successful in her action against Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre

[LargeSquareRock]

https://x.com/journalismseen/status/1792305714595012730?s=46&t=f8U9xaap9RM6pcBCdpsFIA

Excellent news and looking forward to seeing the judgement.

I'm going to have to get myself a cup of strong coffee and re-read for the 4th time and see if I can make any sense of the words!

But thanks ...

My mistake, the email was to funders:

MR wrote to main funders [reads regretfully unsuccessful in tribunal, board received it w sadness and humility and considering an appeal.

The alleged conduct of CEO at uni may have been appropriate.

(I think this refers to Nicole Jones' evidence)

They contacted re the event and are satisfied this event was misrepresented at the tribunal.

They went out of their way to clear MW's name - by MW or MR. Rather than Ix the tribunal findings. ERCC say have insurance that fully covers the compensation.

NC not confining herself to the faults of ERCC and RCS.

NC: The trib has the power to make recommendations re the EA, which is an area of employment law where inaccurate received wisdom has sprung up possibly from the bench handbook.

[My emphasis]

Written judgment in 3 to 4 weeks:
https://x.com/tribunaltweets/status/1845822179155362043

Ooooh, NC is not holding back there - love to see it!

Woman to get payout after being hounded out of rape crisis centre over gender critical beliefs
Roz Adams awarded £35,000 after ‘heresy hunt’ by scandal-hit charity run by biological male
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/10/14/edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre-trans-row-mridul-wadhwa/

Also an article in today's Times:
https://www.thetimes.com/article/78aa7220-44bb-4487-b17f-b5724dfd1a74?shareToken=011d26890b0d0dd73b8d3b8ee9884345

I like the (deliberate, I'm sure) mistake in this comment: "despite the abdickation of responsibility by a number of overpaid Holyrood politicians, "

Sandy Brindley appears to be the very epitome of the saying 'speaks with a forked tongue'. Still no definition of a woman... I wonder what Butler inspired word salad she will come up with, so that she doesn't have to use 'adult human female'?.

Over 12 months and they still can't say what a woman is?

Brindley (a woman) in a relationship with another woman (somehow) said this

If we recognise trans women are women, that doesn’t mean that we don’t recognise that trans women’s needs and the needs of women who are born women at times may not necessarily be the same in terms of the service they require

'If' is doing a lot of heavy lifting there. TW simultaneously being women but also being different from women. I can see two ways of editing that quote, there may be others

We recognise trans women are humans, that doesn’t mean that we don’t recognise that trans women’s needs and the needs of women at times may not necessarily be the same in terms of the service they require

Or

We recognise trans women are men, that doesn’t mean that we don’t recognise that trans women’s needs and the needs of women at times may not necessarily be the same in terms of the service they require

@lcakethereforeIam interesting. Her statements are typically TRA, they are real women (but somehow different) and have different needs to biological women.

nitwit codswallop speak.

two pints i would like to make

Given biological women will doubtless be the vast majority of users in need, why has she put trans women in her statement first - very telling

Why is she allowed to impress her personal and political beliefs on the charity she heads up.

As pointed out in the review of ERCC re MW it is not within her gift.

The trustees of RCS should in consultations with all the RC services, and service users should be the ones deciding this.

its bloody outrageous.

Neither of those edits really work because Brindley is on the other side of the "if", Brindley believes that transwomen ARE women. So most women (female ones, who identify as women) have to be considered a subset of women and called "cis women". This raises the question of what happens to other women, i.e.g. to transmen and non-binary female people; I don't know for sure but I guess their needs for rape crisis services are significant to Brindley who sees them as vulnerable not because they are female, but because they are trans.

But single-gender services cannot substitute for single-sex. In the US there have been some utterly disastrous decisions based on this kind of reasoning, like accommodating disturbed girls who identify as boys with disturbed boys. With exactly the results to those girls that you'd predict and fear.

What it comes down to is that if your language is a mess then your policies will be a mess too.

But having said that, I don't know how much of this is within remit of an employment tribunal. This is a service user issue and ERCC is not alone in their determination to obfuscate. Some people believe that in order to be "inclusive" a rape crisis service must hide sex and share only gender identity, other people believe you must do the opposite. Some people seem to think "more or less female presenting in some way or other including simply saying they are women" will be good enough to qualify as "women only" for most service users most of the time. We still need successsful service user cases.

the needs of women who are born women

This makes zero sense as a statement.

So is she saying trans women are not in the wrong body?

I've just posted on another thread my concerns about focusing on one woman, one service provider.

Its too easy to respond with horror to the individual, and endlessly say how could she.

The real issue is why those with power as funders, politicians, charity scrutinisers, allowed and effectively enabled this.

There are existing laws that say none of this should have happened. But they were not enforced.

Why?

Because despite what might have seemed like changes in ideas about women and male violence, since the days of Women's Liberation that created the concept of rape crisis centres and refuges, there has been a perpetual undermining of the concept of women having autonomy and rights.

Only a society that thinks women are not as important or even "worthy of respect", as men and their culture would go along with the notion that women are not entitled, able or whatever to decide what is best for them.

The TRAs only have the power they have because the MRAs see them as just another branch of the ongoing attack on women.

Of course it is also worth thinking that what if there were more women like Roz Adams. What if there were as many women who are able to remain committed to their support for women and stand up to the MRA culture that is undermining women's rights to autonomous organising.

If all of us who comment here and on other online forums about how wrong this is were there IRL.

Roz and the lone woman who challenged Nicola Stugeon shouldn't be the only ones.

Oh my. Dummies coming flying out of prams at ERCC in 3, 2, 1...
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/scotland/article/counsellor-wins-70000-after-trans-heresy-hunt-at-rape-charity-d2w5ldf6m
Sorry no share token, but this may help: https://archive.ph/7SYpy

Brief summary courtesy of Maya:
Edinburgh Rape Crisis must

• pay 70,000
• publicly apologise to Roz Adams
• acknowledge where it went wrong with Adams

-acknowledge she “was motivated by a wish to act in the best interests of service users" and did no bullying or harassment.

• refer survivors to Beira’s Place

£70k? Wow. Although I suspect the apology will sting more, and being made to refer to Beria really will have them raging.

Yes, definitely! They claim they have insurance for the money, so it's the other stuff which will hurt.

Just seen the update on X. What a brilliant outcome.

Oh that's fantastic news!

That IS fucking fantastic news.

@WFTCHTJ 🙌🏼👏🏼 Excellent stuff & bloody rightly so! Roz has suffered enough.

On a day of shit news this is good.

I once got a bollocking from a teacher for bad behaviour during Assembley. I rolled my eyes, sighed and muttered I suppose I'm sorry. The thing is, I was 7.

Great news.

Adams said: “It’s pretty shocking to me how [Rape Crisis Scotland] can claim to defend [women] when the issue at Edinburgh Rape Crisis is not having women-only spaces and not defining women … It is at the heart of where the issues lie.”

Nutshell.