Sexual harassed DD6 in unisex toilet

[LittleCoffeePot]

I initially posted this using a throwaway account in AIBU for traffic but it got derailed accusing me of lying and being obsessed with toilets(?) and my account deleted. This is my main account so I'm hoping this wont be deleted as I genuinely need help and advice.

Monday night, my DD6 comes and tells me that the week before, when using some unisex toilets for a different classroom at school that she wasn't familiar with, she was struggling to lock the door and a boy offered to hold the door. These unisex toilets are unsupervised. While using the toilet, the boy gathered a group of other boys and they opened the door twice to all laugh at her while she was on the toilet. She was in floods of tears telling me this and now doesn't want to use the toilet at school. She said she told a teacher or TA but they didn't do anything.

Obviously I immediately brought this up with the school and they have 'investigated'. They implied that it was my daughter's fault for not being able to lock the door and that from now on she's going to be accompanied by an adult to the toilet. They said the boy's mother has been told but they're 'working on' an apology from him. They're also 'investigating' the member of staff who was told but did nothing.

I had no idea that the school even had unisex toilets as the ones I'd seen in Early Years were sexed. I'm horrified that the unisex toilets for young children are unmonitored and that the school has failed my daughter in allowing this to happen.

I've escalated the issue with the head but am expecting to be brushed off with a 'well we've sorted it now' as they've informed me that unisex toilets are apparently the norm. How do I go beyond the school? Who do I alert to this safeguarding failure?

Thanks

Indeed. And the excuses for male behaviour too it seems.

It seems that many posters do not understand that sexual harassment/humiliation/assault/rape are not crimes of sexual interest - these are crimes of power. Specifically male power over women and girls.

Those boys were humiliating an undressed little girl and getting their friends to come and see - demonstrating their power over her as she was helpless in that situation.

The minimising from posters on here and also from the school it seems, the assertion that this is not sexual harassment is depressing. Nothing to see here.

I agree that it's sexual harassment. I think this boy should be suspended. It's voyeurism.

All of the above is absolutely correct

Also agree that it's sexual harassment, the boys were waiting till she had her pants down to laugh at her and make her feel humiliated.

The tragic thing is that it has been clear for some time that women and girls are 9 times more likely to be sexually assaulted in unisex or gender neural spaces. Yet the authorities don't seem to be doing anything about it.

This makes it even more important for us to stand up for the rights of women and girls to have safety, privacy and dignity. Best of luck with your complaint. By standing up for your daughter, and getting the school policy changed you could be helping countless other children in the future.

Unisex changing rooms put women in danger (thetimes.co.uk)

Unisex changing rooms put women at danger of sexual assault, data reveals | The Independent | The Independent

I'm guessing because NABALT
Even though no one has said ABALT

I would also be unhappy that school are slow to respond.

However.

I think you're probably upsetting yourself further by classifying this as sexual harassment, when there's absolutely no evidence of a sexual motivation on the boy's part. Yes it (loosely) involves genetalia, but most six year olds would regard someone sitting on a toilet as funny/embarrassing rather than sexual. I'm not trying to minimise how embarrassing or upsetting it must have been for your daughter, but I'd classify it as bullying rather than sexual harassment.

I'm also not sure how much difference it makes being a unisex toilet. If it opens directly onto a corridor (and is a self-contained room) then surely a boy could have been passing and offered to hold the door, even if the toilet itself was just for girls.

I'm the mother of a young son. I watch in horror when stories like this - and some people's responses to them - unfold.

His father and I do our damndest to bring him up with good lights. He doesn't witness violence, abuse, arguments or derogatory behaviour between his parents in the home. We are very careful about monitoring his screen use, and will hold off on getting him a mobile phone until we think it appropriate and he's much older. He knows sexism is not okay and will call it out when he sees it. At present he doesn't appear particularly susceptible to peer-pressure (he refused his 'friend's' request to try to get another kid into trouble, said he wasn't going to do his dirty work and would 'grass' on him if he deliberately did this). I don't approve of this friendship, but I doubt it will be the last time that happens. We have not, ever, used the female changing rooms at the pool since the day he turned 7. He knows why that is not appropriate. Other mothers often see fit to flout that rule, but I want my boy to learn from a young age that girls'/women's place is not to make way for men. His dad is of a similar mindset.

I'm not sure how much more parents can do. But we don't raise our kids in a vacuum. I'm so concerned over the influences he's later likely to be exposed to socially. Primary school is a teddy-bear's picnic compared with secondary. Nor am I naive as to the prevalence of male-pattern abusive behaviour. I was abused by male schoolmates as a teenager.

The number of people who are in denial as to these sobering facts is a depressing indicator of why these problems are so entrenched socially. If I were the mum of the boy who did this, I'd be mortified. I'd question everything I'd done as a parent, do my damndest to correct the damage, and an apology is the very least of what the girl concerned would be entitled to expect. I'd also be asking the school to work with me on hammering home the message that this is not okay, and that such behaviour in an older male could result in criminal proceedings.

They are six. Six! Where do they learn this stuff? And yes, it absolutely is sexualised behaviour designed to humiliate the girl. This is how it starts.

Then there's the implicit suggestion out there in the wild (any SM platform will amply confirm it) that males have their lives ruined by accusations of sexual assault; no similar concern as to how women's lives are ruined by experiencing it. Society would rather believe women are liars than that men abuse.

I fear for our children's futures. What they might be subjected to, and what they might turn into. Denial of unpleasant facts is not going to make them go away and we all have responsibilities as parents.

I'm sorry. OP.

You might hope 6 is an age of innocence but unfortunately it is not too young to have seen pornography or having experienced or watched unwanted sexual activity.

It may not be the norm but the school should be seeing it as a red flag just to be on the safe side. There is the issue of the girl’s experience to deal with plus why a 6 year old wants to do this. It MAY be straightforward bullying, that could’ve applied to either a boy or a girl but it could be a symptom of something more concerning. As a parent you are welcome to assume the best but as schools have to abide by safeguarding principles it should NOT be disregarded simply because the boy is 6 years old. The school should be using professional curiosity just to err on the side of caution. Hopefully there is something going on behind the scenes that OP is not aware of (and right now shouldn’t be).

Schools have to deal with all kinds of difficult and often unbelievable situations because sadly, a small percentage will have a horror show for a back story. This may not be the case but it is NOT up to a teacher or a TA to make that call.

And even if it was bullying* it needs treating with seriousness because all schools will have anti bullying policies and unchecked they are adding to the problem.

*the school may not call it bullying as bullying is defined as persistent but it should be logged as a concern anyway. Hopefully it now has.

Have only just seen this thread and wanted to say how sorry I am that this happened to your DD.

Does your post that I have quoted above mean this is all that the school is going to do?

If so do you feel re-assured or do you want them to do something more?

Do you know about this group, who might be able to provide advice https://safeschoolsallianceuk.net/

And more importantly how does your DD feel now? or maybe !

But well done to you for not letting the school fob you off.

And persisting with the minefield of mumsnet rules.

Let alone the bullies who think somehow they can intuit via their connection to the internet what someone they have never met in real life is making things up.

Also ignore those who tell you how you think is wrong.

Go with what you feel and as important, how your DD responded.

If all else fails or you are not re-assured you could try your local council assuming they have a committe that overseas education in the area. Even if just to ask them to ensure that schools are following good guidance re safety of girls in schools.

The school has a clear duty of care and safeguarding responsibilities for your daughter.

If they fail to do anything, then I'd take it up with the Governors.

The boy who thought this was appropriate needs a harsh punishment to remind him how inappropriate his behaviour was and set an example for others who are minded to do the same.

I am not normally an advocate of corporal punishment, but I still remember a boy being caned for misbehaving when I was at school; it certainly had a deterrent effect on others.

Sorry just to add, this may sound trivial but has the school fixed the lock.

Its incredible for them to have either left a broken lock unfixed or to have accepted toilets with locks that aren't easy for a child to use.

That at least would show they are taking it seriously as an incident that could happen to other girls.

Let alone somehow implying your DD was the problem for not being able to use the lock and would have to ask a teacher to come with her to the toilet.

Honestly dont know what they were thinking when they said that.

Although I think single sexed spaces are so important, it’s irrelevant in this situation.

Like most accessible toilets or baby changing facilities, they will often be unisex.

The boys didn’t open the door because it was a unisex toilet and it sounds like this would have happened if it was a single sexed toilet too, as he was holding the door closed originally, not actually going inside.

I think OP (and some posters) are focusing on the unisex toilets, which is an important topic, but not for this situation and I wonder if OP has focused more on this when speaking to the school.

Even if this was girls doing it to the DD it would still be awful behaviour and it’s so wrong that the school aren’t making this a bigger deal.

FFS.

I'm not trying to minimise how embarrassing or upsetting it must have been for your daughter, but I'd classify it as bullying rather than sexual harassment

Actually you are. And calling it bullying doesn't make it any better. Being on the receiving end of bullying that embarrassed and upset her in front of her peers and who she has to be in class with is just as bad.

Why are some posters so determined to downplay this?

If they hand wave any harder they will fly away.

The schools lack of seriousness would annoy me enough to phone ofsted and see what they think about it. They are failing to safeguard a child and this is not normal behaviour for a 6 year old boy, I'd be raising some safeguarding questions about this child.
This is not ok ever, it's not a case of kids will be kids.

The privacy of her body and its functions were intruded upon by a gang. woukd the gang of boys have done this to another boy? No. They needed her to be female to get their kicks.

Whatever the exact name for that is, it is outrageous.

Unsure why my “hmm” comment was deleted - it wasn’t offensive in any way and nor was it troll hunting or calling the OP a liar.

But either way I’ve now got the time to comment on this. I don’t think it can be considered sexual harassment, a 6 year old child is below the legal age of criminality and I’ve never come across a 6 year old who had remotely sexual feelings at that age. Bullying, definitely and the school should never have dismissed or minimised. Hopefully you get a resolution to it asap, and an apology from the staff member that ignored your DD.

I’d be strongly tempted to speak to your local councillors too, mixed sex toilets do not belong in schools regardless of if they are primary or secondary. I’d also be requesting to see the safe guarding risk assessment that should have been done before the implementation of mixed sex toilets (and if there isn’t one done I’d take that as high as you possibly can too).

A proper self contained room seems safer to me. The old toilet blocks were terrifying for many children. The ones opening onto a corridor seem much less likely to result in bullying.

https://www.keepingchildrensafeineducation.co.uk/part_five_ch_sex_viol.html

What schools and colleges should be aware of447.
Sexual violence and sexual harassment can occur between two or more children of any age and sex, from primary through to secondary stage and into college. It can occur also through a group of children sexually assaulting or sexually harassing a single child or group of children. Sexual violence and sexual harassment exist on a continuum and may overlap; they can occur online and face-to-face (both physically and verbally) and are never acceptable. Schools and colleges should be aware of the importance of:

• Making clear that there is a zero-tolerance approach to sexual violence and sexual harassment, that it is never acceptable, and it will not be tolerated. It should never be passed off as “banter”, “just having a laugh”, “a part of growing up” or “boys being boys”. Failure to do so can lead to a culture of unacceptable behaviour, an unsafe environment and in worst case scenarios a culture that normalises abuse, leading to children accepting it as normal and not coming forward to report it;
• Recognising, acknowledging, and understanding the scale of harassment and abuse and that even if there are no reports it does not mean it is not happening, it may be the case that it is just not being reported;
• Challenging physical behaviour (potentially criminal in nature) such as grabbing bottoms, breasts and genitalia, pulling down trousers, flicking bras and lifting up skirts. Dismissing or tolerating such behaviours risks normalising them.

448. Children who are victims of sexual violence and sexual harassment wherever it happens, may find the experience stressful and distressing. This will, in all likelihood, adversely affect their educational attainment and will be exacerbated if the alleged perpetrator(s) attends the same school or college. 449. Whilst any report of sexual violence or sexual harassment should be taken seriously, staff should be aware it is more likely that girls will be the victims of sexual violence and sexual harassment and more likely it will be perpetrated by boys. Children with special educational needs and disabilities (SEND) are also three times more likely to be abused than their peers. [132] 450. Ultimately, it is essential that all victims are reassured that they are being taken seriously and that they will be supported and kept safe.

There is no legal requirement to have single sex toilets for infants and many school buildings haven't been updated in years and years. As such I doubt a risk assessment has been completed or would be deemed particularly reasonable to complete. I appreciate you think it is but that doesn't mean the school would have to comply.

You really think boys never got bullied/threatened/hurt in the old style toilet blocks. Do you have sons? My understanding was the old style toilet blocks were as scary for boys as the girls ones were for girls.

It's awful this happened to your daughter and awful it happening to anyone of course. I do have boys and they can be silly. They don't necessarily at the age of 6 consider their decisions carefully or would it have been sexually motivated, I think more like boys being silly and taking it too far. Sexual harassment is very far stretched. Imagine if it was your daughter that did that, being silly, would you say she sexually harassed someone at the age of 6? Or would you class this behaviour as silliness? If you'd have said they tried to touch her etc then yes but they just laughed like silly boys do!